Best Ferrari Track Car? | FerrariChat

Best Ferrari Track Car?

Discussion in 'Other Racing' started by Texas Forever, Apr 12, 2005.

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  1. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Eight Time F1 World Champ
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    This comes with a tip of the hat to Jon Ward. Last weekend, at the FOH track day, Jon brought his 2000 260 Modena.

    http://ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=55273

    (See the 5th pic of the 1st post.)

    After comparing notes on the widsom (not) of buying a used F355C, a F360C, or a Stradale, I believe that Jon has it figured out.

    That is, buy an earlier F360, put slicks and better brake pads on it, and go run the crap out of the car. You see, one of the problems with tracking a car is that to figure out its limits you have to, ah, exceed them occassionaly. Otherwise, you're just guessing. Plus, you find out that you'll live to try again.

    When I had my Stradale on the track, the little accountant in me kept saying, "Dale, you're driving a $200K car on the race track. This is a 2 followed by 5 zeros." Granted, it was a lot of fun. But did I really push the car? No way.

    In Jon's case, he brought his car new, and it has spent almost all of its life at the track. He doesn't ever plan on selling it. Just drive it.

    Is a stock F360 competitive? In Jon's hands it is. I forget the mileage on the car, but Jon and Ric have put in a ton of seat time. Being a stock production car, it doesn't seem to break down as much as the Challenge cars. Just plug and play.

    So go rob your piggy bank and come up with roughly a buck and a quarter and go racing!

    Dale
     
  2. judge4re

    judge4re F1 World Champ

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    Or spend $25k and get a beater 308 GTB and worry less while still having fun.

    Rule #1 of racing, be prepared to walk away (hopefully) from a totalled mess. If you can't do that, you don't need to be out on the track.

    If you really are trying to drive at 100%, you will write one off one day. As long as you know that and you can, go out and have fun.

    The added bonus of the older cars is that you won't be going as fast when you really do fnck up.

    I also strongly advice against getting a 360 as a first track car unless you really understand how the aeros work on it...
     
  3. Hubert

    Hubert F1 Rookie

    Jan 3, 2002
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    "Best Ferrari Track Car?" Trick question.

    It's like asking "What's the best Ducati race bike?"

    There really isn't such a thing; the consumables are expensive, the bodywork expensive, the service expensive and the crash damage liabilty is huge.

    Everyone's got their beef w/ the Radicals but as far as I can tell, they're the best track car available on US shores. That or a used GT3 Cup Car.

    "Is a stock F360 competitive?"

    Comapred to what and at what level? For track days, amongst mild street cars? Yes. Against big dogs? Not really.

    A street car is a street car is a street car and no matter how well engineered it'll always be endowed withe the cardinal flaw that seperates street cars from race cars: compromise.

    Best Ferrari Track car? A red Radical.

    The anecdote here is, if you're using dollar signs as break markers, you're not really going to develop as a driver because you'll never let yourself really have a go.
     
  4. vlamgat

    vlamgat Formula Junior

    Jan 9, 2004
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    Well its not a TR or 512 unless you want to run an Enduro and even then you would pit every 40 minutes for new something!
     
  5. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Eight Time F1 World Champ
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    I'm glad you guys brought this back to life because I didn't really give this idea a full explanation. Jon Ward is a long-time Dino driver. He started out in a 348, moved to a 355, then a 360 (which is the subject of this discussion), next came a Stradale, and he has a F430 on order. Jon has also spent a zillion hours on various tracks in and around Texas, both racing and instructing.

    Point is that with just adding racing slicks and better brake pads, Jon can hold his own with Challenge and GT cars. That's right, Challenge and GT cars. A fully sorted 360 Modena is that good of a car. (Oh, one secret is to get the alinement right.) Put all this together with a willingness to explore its limits, a stock 360 is one hell of a race car.

    Dale
     
  6. judge4re

    judge4re F1 World Champ

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    No, its not. Its a hell of a street car, but a race car its not.

    Even Spicy picked up on all of the race engineers/techs calling it a **** box.
     
  7. teak360

    teak360 F1 World Champ

    Nov 3, 2003
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    In my opinion the 360 with slicks is a very sweet handling, sounding and overall feeling track day car. I was in one with slicks that easily kept its own with everything on the track in a winding infield (not the straights) including 2 F40's. No Challenge cars or Stradales to compare to though.
     
  8. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Eight Time F1 World Champ
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    It's ain't the techs behind the wheel! :)
     
  9. judge4re

    judge4re F1 World Champ

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    No, but how many class wins has it had compared to other cars that are more "race" oriented from the beginning?
     
  10. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Eight Time F1 World Champ
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    Texas!
    As you know, Ferrari has not had a production car that was "race oriented" in a very long time. The Boxer was probably the last.
     
  11. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
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    The above posts put it right. Along those lines:
    The Best Ferrari trackcar is up for debate.
    The most FUN Ferrari trackcar is the one that's yours!
    The Fastest Ferrari trackcar is the one you get to drive that does NOT belong to you.
    Your lady thinks the best Ferrari trackcar is the one with working A/C for the ride home.
     
  12. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

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    At Laguna Seca with drivers of similar talent a 360 on slicks can set faster laps than a modified (not heavily) F40. Every race mechanic and engineer I have ever known hates street based race cars and considers them junk, no matter what make.

    I agree with Dale that if what you want is a Ferrari for the track the 360 is a good choice. If you want to open it up to any make then there are lots of cars that can go faster for the same money.
     
  13. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Eight Time F1 World Champ
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    LOL
     
  14. judge4re

    judge4re F1 World Champ

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    I'm not saying the 360 isn't a great track car.

    I am saying its not a race car.
     
  15. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Eight Time F1 World Champ
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    A buddy of mine, who has won the Spec Miata crown for several years, (Ara) told me that the Stradale and the Ruf tied for the sweetest driving track cars that he has ever driven. He sez that the F40 was the scariest.

    Oh, and one more point, Jon Ward told me that the key with any Ferrari Dino is getting the alinement right. It can take several hours to do right. Plus, he has never seen a car from the factory that was set up correctly.

    Dale
     
  16. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Eight Time F1 World Champ
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    No argument here. But for a street legal car, it is pretty damn close to being a very good track car. For some reason, the 360s are not as tempermental as the Challenge cars. All Jon has done with his car is the regular services and change the oil. (Knocking on wood) So far, so good, and I think that he has over 10,000 miles on the car, almost all at the track.
     
  17. judge4re

    judge4re F1 World Champ

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    Do the brakes still "squeeel like a high school cheerleader" when they are cold?

    Tell Jon I said hello. Ask him how "binky" is doing. That was a fun weekend...
     
  18. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

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    Last time I was at the factory they had one alignment rack in operation and I never saw it used.
     
  19. ntflblueliz

    ntflblueliz Rookie

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    Dr Who, I personally love Ferraris and am looking very hard to find a nice 360 that I can buy for myself for street use ( the car is sex on wheels!) but IMHO you have to have big bucks to track one, that is why I have a Lotus Elise to be my track car and fun street car. It can't keep up with many things on the track including the 360 or the aforementioned Radical but is a fun and very cheap to run track car. BTW, Ara has found a new favorite track car:

    excerpt from Elisetalk, a Lotus Elise Forum:

    He bought an Elise! If I had the money I'd track the 360 but....... I don't! so Elise it is!
     
  20. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Eight Time F1 World Champ
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    Ara is pretty cool guy. He did tell me that he liked the Elise, but he still says that the Stradale and the Ruf are the best things that he has ever driven.

    Ara is building me a SM, so that will do for now. Only problem is some of us are not that good. For us lesser types, we need to be power sluts. For example, driving a Maranello on the track takes some, uh, patience. But once you see a little bit of daylight, BAM!!!!!! Oh, baby, come to Daddy!

    Dale
     
  21. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Now that is the Ferrari we have all grown to know and love. I guess that's why my Ferrari trackcar runs flawlessly. I personally fix it and the last corner weight and alignment took about 5 hours from a pro!

    These cars are really pretty good. Take a smokin fast Z06 Corvette and you get a really fast car that stock will eat its brakes, overheat the differential and transmission, and the engine temps will run hotter than stock. Take a Ferrari like I do and sit on the grid or doing "starts" all day in race school and the car stays totally cool. The faster you run it the cooler it is. People always yell brakes brakes brakes with streetcars clothed as racecars and Ferrari's are no different. People seem to claim Ferraris have crappy brakes. Well...maybe I am just stinkin slow (It takes me two weekends to "cord" a set of slicks while clubracing) but I swear the key to making brakes work is keeping them cool. Others like huge brembo 90 piston calipers and 25" rotors. I use my cheesy stock rotors not even slotted and stock brake pads but giant 3" brake ducts and even larger intake scoops. I threshold brake all day long and never a problem.
     
  22. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Eight Time F1 World Champ
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    LOL, my buddy Jon (the one with the 360) says that this is hyper critical on the 348s. Makes all the difference in the world.

    Dale
     
  23. ntflblueliz

    ntflblueliz Rookie

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    V12 Power! Yeah Baby Yeah!!!!
     
  24. LightGuy

    LightGuy Four Time F1 World Champ
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    I had an Elise on order and test drove one before mine came in. Its just too darn small for me at 6'1". Proper track alignment on street cars will destroy tires on the street.I guess a 360 ,street alignment with slicks would be a nice track car,change the wheel/tires and back to grocery getter.I wouldnt want to bite the depreciation bullet and off track ( especially undertray ) expenses.
     
  25. LightGuy

    LightGuy Four Time F1 World Champ
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    And please dont tell me a 360 is faster than an F40, while I hope its not true , even if it is let me live in my F40 Fantasy world.
     

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