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Birdman 308 window fix success stories / tips?

Discussion in '308/328' started by eracer, Jul 7, 2019.

  1. Martin308GTB

    Martin308GTB F1 Rookie

    Jan 22, 2003
    4,146
    Black Forest Germany
    Full Name:
    Martin N.
    Hello Eric,

    meanwhile I saw your result you printed from my .stl file. And it's great!
    At this occasion I want to underline, that I am willing to share my CAD-data and associated 3D-print files with everyone here for strictly personal use, if I can be sure, that there's no commercial use intended.
    So, anyone of you who's interested please drop me a PM.
    Old friends or 'LED-handbrake lever light - customers' preferred of course :)

    Best from Germany
    Martin
     
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  3. marklintott

    marklintott Formula Junior

    Jul 13, 2005
    537
    Taipei / Somerset UK
    Full Name:
    Mark Lintott
    Martin, this is very generous of you - could you send me a copy too - own personal use of course.
    mark at mld.tw

    Many thanks

    Mark
     
  4. Martin308GTB

    Martin308GTB F1 Rookie

    Jan 22, 2003
    4,146
    Black Forest Germany
    Full Name:
    Martin N.
    Mark, you have mail.

    Best from Germany
    Martin
     
  5. offtheworkigo

    offtheworkigo Karting

    Feb 23, 2016
    229
    Dallas
    Full Name:
    Dave Hoffer
    Hi Martin, I have not done anything to my windows yet. But would like a copy also. Thanks Dave
     
  6. Martin308GTB

    Martin308GTB F1 Rookie

    Jan 22, 2003
    4,146
    Black Forest Germany
    Full Name:
    Martin N.
    Dave, you have a PM.
    Best way for future requests is sending me a PM (conversation) giving me a valid e-mail address at the same time for attachment of the file.

    Best from Germany
    Martin
     
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  8. eracer

    eracer Karting

    May 29, 2009
    141
    Michigan
    Full Name:
    Eric W.
    The job is DONE!! Windows go up and down smoothly, nearly as fast as johnk... shows in his video above.

    Many thanks to Birdman for his write-up, and everyone who posted above with their tips, experiences, etc. Special thanks to Martin308GTB who so kindly provided the 3D model for the "window motor installation helper". I've attached a few photos of the tool in action, and I can't tell you how nice this was to have compared to trying to tie wrap the cable.

    A few observations that may help future repairers:

    1. Definitely eliminate the easiest sources of the problem first (switches, fuses, etc.). This is not a particularly difficult job, but I agree with Ferraridoc--it's every bit of 20 hours to do both doors. Just a lot of disassembly, note/photo taking, cleaning, cleaning, CLEANING, and fiddly reassembly.

    2. Re-use the cable if you can. I was lucky in that everything inside my doors was in great shape. Motors, cables, window stops and guides all fine. It was just the suspected hardened lube in the gearbox that created the problem. (photo shows some of the dried lubricant--worm gear shown for perspective)

    Image Unavailable, Please Login .
    3. As many have said, make good notes and take lots of photos. There are a few things that can trip you up if not done correctly.

    These 2 photos show how the tool clamps on the spool to hold the cable in place:
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
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    Shows the motor ready for installation, tool in place.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
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  9. mwr4440

    mwr4440 Four Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Jun 8, 2007
    43,692
    Bavaria, The 'Other' Germany
    Full Name:
    Mark W.R.
    Martin,

    Can I get a copy of your file?

    Email is in a PM.

    Mark
     
  10. Verell

    Verell F1 Veteran
    Consultant Owner

    May 5, 2001
    7,001
    Groton, MA
    Full Name:
    Verell Boaen
     
  11. Martin308GTB

    Martin308GTB F1 Rookie

    Jan 22, 2003
    4,146
    Black Forest Germany
    Full Name:
    Martin N.
    Hmmm. For commercial use I could imagine a deal, which makes a win-win situation out of this :)


    Best
    Martin
     
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  13. thorn

    thorn F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Aug 7, 2012
    2,930
    Tallahassee, FL
    Just throwing this out there... if there was a ready-made version of this tool, I'd buy at least 1 - possibly 2 - of them, depending on the price.
     
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  14. miketuason

    miketuason F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Feb 24, 2006
    14,306
    Cerritos, CA.
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    Mike
    +1
     
  15. Verell

    Verell F1 Veteran
    Consultant Owner

    May 5, 2001
    7,001
    Groton, MA
    Full Name:
    Verell Boaen
     
  16. Martin308GTB

    Martin308GTB F1 Rookie

    Jan 22, 2003
    4,146
    Black Forest Germany
    Full Name:
    Martin N.
    Hi friends,

    after a few thoughts and conversation with Eric (eracer) I have decided the following. Due to the fact, that I have a current project for a consumer project running, which needs a lot of trial and error regarding 3D-print and cost me a lot of time and money regarding professional suppliers I decided to purchase an own 3D-printer. Not for serious prototype parts manufacturing, which I will still leave to the pros in the future, but for own first tests and experiments which will save me a lot of time and money. And to get a feel for functional plastic parts after decades long design and construction of heavy steel machinery.

    Means I will print a small run of the cable tool myself and offer it at a reasonable price for you in the near future.
    Thanks Eric for convincing and encouraging me.

    Best from Germany
    Martin
     
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  17. miketuason

    miketuason F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Feb 24, 2006
    14,306
    Cerritos, CA.
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    Mike
    Sounds great Martin! Put me down for one please, thank you so much.
     
    Martin308GTB likes this.
  18. eracer

    eracer Karting

    May 29, 2009
    141
    Michigan
    Full Name:
    Eric W.
    Great choice Martin! Please let me know if I can help you with the settings on the initial run.

    Eric

    Sent from my moto g(6) using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
  19. Martin308GTB

    Martin308GTB F1 Rookie

    Jan 22, 2003
    4,146
    Black Forest Germany
    Full Name:
    Martin N.
    Many thanks for your offer Eric. I actually wondered if I may bother you :) Questions will follow soon.

    Best from Germany
    Martin
     
  20. eracer

    eracer Karting

    May 29, 2009
    141
    Michigan
    Full Name:
    Eric W.
    Happy to help . Email me anytime.

    Eric.

    Sent from my moto g(6) using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
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  21. Tire Fryer

    Tire Fryer Karting

    Feb 18, 2013
    153
    Farmers Branch, TX
    Full Name:
    Christopher Williams
    I'd also like to purchase a window cable tool once you have them.
     
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  22. GordonC

    GordonC F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Aug 28, 2005
    3,869
    Calgary, AB, Canada
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    Gordon
    It sounds like a few of us have 3D printers now. Commercial enterprises aside, it might be interesting and worthwhile to start a separate "3D Printing for 308s" thread to share files for tools or items that people have found useful or have created to fill a need?
     
    eracer likes this.
  23. BigTex

    BigTex Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Dec 6, 2002
    74,280
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Bubba
    This looks like a Tool Box "must have"!!

    Amazing that cleaning that gunk out alone can fix it, my windows have all but stopped, I just leave them there.
    Don't tell anyone it stays under the cover....LOL
     
    Martin308GTB likes this.
  24. Martin308GTB

    Martin308GTB F1 Rookie

    Jan 22, 2003
    4,146
    Black Forest Germany
    Full Name:
    Martin N.
    Cleaning the old gunk out, regreasing, cleaning connectors and fixing switches can actually restore the windows to how they came from the factory. Not lightning fast, but o.k.
    When I did the job 18 years ago I was amazed, what I found inside the gear. The same like Eric showed above. After the job the windows worked o.k. till early this year, when a switch began making trouble. Cleaned it and fixed it with a bit of conductive grease -have opened a thread about it- and they are back to factory condition.
    Relays, window accelerators are often just curing the symptoms.
    I actually had a failing gear/motor assembly. But it had nothing to do with slow or non-working. it was the ratchet mechanism for the emergency handle, which began to slip occasionally accompanied by nasty noises when reaching the upper or lower stop.
    Luckily no new motor assemblies from questionable sources back then in 2000. So TRutlands sold me a perfect used one for $100.00 incl. shipping overseas. Good ol' times.

    Best from Germany
    Martin
     
  25. Martin308GTB

    Martin308GTB F1 Rookie

    Jan 22, 2003
    4,146
    Black Forest Germany
    Full Name:
    Martin N.
    Some have, but most of those to whom I have sent the file so far have no own printer, but plan to upload the file and order from shapeways or similar.

    Best from Germany
    Martin
     
  26. Ak Jim

    Ak Jim F1 Veteran
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Dec 23, 2007
    5,511
    North Pole AK
    Do any of you guys know if this tool to hold the cable on the spool will work on the 365/400/412 cars? If so I'd really like to get one. I really need to work on my windows but have heard how difficult it is to keep the cable on the spool. Thx.
     
  27. eracer

    eracer Karting

    May 29, 2009
    141
    Michigan
    Full Name:
    Eric W.
    I have no knowledge of those models, but just to comment, if they use the same motor/spool assembly and there is access in the door for you to reach up and remove the tool once the cable is strung around all the pulleys, it should work.

    Sent from my moto g(6) using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
  28. thedunk

    thedunk Rookie

    May 6, 2015
    17
    Claremont, CA
    Full Name:
    Kent Miller
    I used a relay in each door and the windows now work great. I had tried lots of other things but the relay did the trick. The motors pull lots of current so I had to fuse each at 15 amps.
     

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