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Boxer Air Conditioning

Discussion in 'Boxers/TR/M' started by DonB, May 24, 2020.

  1. DonB

    DonB Formula Junior
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    Nov 11, 2003
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    Don Bartz
    Hi all..

    OK just looking for some input. Last time my engine was out, about a year ago, I had a new seal installed in the York AC compressor. I watched the guy do it The shop is a huge rebuilder of all types of AC compressors. I was able to watch the guy do the work which was actually easy and very straight forward.

    System was filled with R-12 as I have a lot of of it and will stay with it. System has lost all the charge however. I suspect that it is the dryer as I discovered a leak around the low pressure switch (?) attached to the dryer assy.

    The dryer to the BBi, from what I can find out, is unique to the car because of the pressure switch assy. and the way it attaches to the dryer, plus the way the hose fittings are oriented for clearance. So, I would like to install a new dryer. Which is NLA from Ferrari.

    I have found "replacements" on line but they do not look like the original so they're a no go. I believe Classic Air in Tampa can rebuild the dryer as they did on a classic Buick I own. But the question in my mind is what about the pressure switch?

    As an aside, my '79 308 holds pressure and has for a looooong time and the air works very well...even here in Flori duh.

    So, has any body out there in BB/BBi land dealt with this issue before? Any ideas/suggestions/input would be welcome.
     
  2. Ludwig

    Ludwig Formula Junior
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    Mar 27, 2006
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    Ludwig Allegra
    Hi Don,
    I infact have just addressed this issue. I replaced the old York "licensed in Italy" with a new York that is virtually exact except that it is slightly higher displacement. I am converting to 134a and will accept the performance hit for the overall practicality.
    The OEM receiver is not available other than very expensive "used". Not a good choice.
    The receiver from Superformance (part#106647) is the correct form factor but the location and configuration of the ports is different.
    There are several issues.
    The line from the condenser to the receiver is a bit too short with the change in geometry to allow the high low switch sensor bulb to fit. In order to clear the chassis the assembly has to be rotated and the stock line will be a few cm short.
    The line from the TVX to the receiver needs a gender change and also a 90 degree fitting so that the battery compartment is not affected..
    So I initially cleaned and flushed the system and then made up the new lines and fittings. Also new o rings for everything. https://coldhose.com/specialty-fittings.html

    Also need the correct crimper #6 die. I bought a hydraulic unit from ebay.

    Evacuated the system and held perfectly. I am about to recharge as I am firing up the engine after the full resto.
    I did turn it over and got instant oil pressure. Good sign....
    As soon as I start up then I'll charge.

    The images show the orientation needed for the assembly.
     

    Attached Files:

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  3. DonB

    DonB Formula Junior
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    WOW!

    You went all out! Thanks so much for the info. I just may see about having my OEM dryer rebuilt and see if I can get a new pressure switch for it. I'll stick with my R12 as I've got a bunch of it. The part may not be available anymore, and it may be hard to get to, but at least the system doesn't work too well ;-)
     
  4. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran

    Apr 6, 2008
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    romano schwabel
    for such unit I look here in europe long time but could not find. you have me perhaps a manufacturer of your unit or a link to ebay for this item?
     
  5. Drew Altemara

    Drew Altemara Formula 3

    Feb 11, 2002
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    I used Classic Air in Tampa to replace the dryer on a carbed BB. Knowledgeable and helpful guy. I don't recall any issue with the pressure switch; maybe specific to BBi? The new one I installed was very close to the original and I could use the original fittings and placement.

    Drew
     
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  6. Ludwig

    Ludwig Formula Junior
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    the high/low-pressure switch is easy and available -I think I bought it on ebay- it is the exact replacement. I'll try to find the source later today. you will need a flaring tool to install it. If you need a new pressure switch its available through Superformance.
    I would not rebuild the old dryer- unless you want to be absolutely OEM original. The new dryer will work better and new hose connections are pretty easy.
    R12 vs 134a doesn't make any difference as long as there is a new dryer/receiver.

    If you would like I can ship you my crimper to use.
     
  7. DonB

    DonB Formula Junior
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    Thank you so much for the info/offer. I'm trying to keep this as straight forward as possible, and really don't want to replace hoses if possible. When the unit is all charged up it works really well...so will try the rebuild and switch thing first.
     
  8. ago car nut

    ago car nut F1 Rookie
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    From what I read R-134 doesn't like R-12 hoses? The R-134 bleeds out!
     
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  9. EZORED

    EZORED Formula Junior
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    Nov 24, 2007
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    Don, just look on craigslist or ebay and buy some real R12 It only takes 3 cans! You will appreciate it later.
     
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  10. turbo-joe

    turbo-joe F1 Veteran

    Apr 6, 2008
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    romano schwabel
    R12 not available in europe and also not legal anymore to use :(
    but if I would get I just would buy, if not a horrible price
     
  11. DonB

    DonB Formula Junior
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    I've got 3 cases of R12 I got on eBay

    Sadly R12 went the route of Halon 1211 and 1301, along with all the other CFC's that work so well.....deemed unsafe by a bunch of worthless bureaucrats. Just sayin
     
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  12. DonB

    DonB Formula Junior
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    The compressor rebuild guy said it's not the components in the R12 system it's the expansion valve I think. The two different gasses work differently, and there's also an issue with the lubrication of the system as well.
    As with my rant on R-12 being eliminated along with other CFC's for "destroying" the Ozone layer. read the caution label on a can of 134...it's a joke. All the same warnings......
    It's crazy I tell ya, crazy!
     
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  13. ago car nut

    ago car nut F1 Rookie
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    HVAC guy told me EPA wanted Dupont to produce an ozone friendly refrigerant. Dupont said: not profitable, wont sell. EPA said will make R-12 illegal!
     
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  14. EZORED

    EZORED Formula Junior
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    I will by a case if you want to sell. Don't be a hoarder! LOL
     
  15. DonB

    DonB Formula Junior
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    There's plenty on eBay!
     
  16. DonB

    DonB Formula Junior
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    If you were shooting "car guys" all in the EPA would be safe!
     
  17. 2dinos

    2dinos Formula 3

    Jan 13, 2007
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    My understanding is the lubricant is a problem with CFC - > HCFC. The rest of the hardware does ok. Hoses develop leaks right thru the wall from age. My system holds R-12 fine now, but I'm planning to add an ounce of sealer to the system if it needs work. More of what I learned there is trace moisture does bad things to sealer so an extended vacuum pull after new filter drier install is recommended. And finally, the active drier agent is specific to CFC or HCFC. I was told it will work, but not recommended. Last I saw a brand new Ferrari filter/drier, there was a sticker saying "134 only". So what the !%# does that mean ?? I have no idea. I'm going to stick with R12.

    Nice job Ludwig on the beautiful work remaking those AC hoses! So I didn't catch which freon you're using? 12 or 134?
     
  18. Ludwig

    Ludwig Formula Junior
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    I'm using 134a as the york replacement pump is pre filled with oil for 134a. I am about to charge the system as I have sorted out the initial engine start up. If the 134a using the higher displacement pump is truly horrible I can certainly convert back to R12.
     
  19. pshoejberg

    pshoejberg Formula 3
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    Dec 22, 2007
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    I just overhauled the aircon system in my BBi with new hoses, expansion valve, filter and sensors. I kept the original compressor and are now running +-900 gram of 134a and the system is working flawless. Lots of cold air in the Danish summer heat so there should be good hope for your system Ludwig.

    Best, Peter
     
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  20. Ludwig

    Ludwig Formula Junior
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    Sounds encouraging- I'll recharge it this weekend.
     
  21. ag512bbi

    ag512bbi F1 Veteran
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    Nov 8, 2003
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    My Boxer is going thru an engine out. My tech told me he will be installing the R134 (don't know what that was) but I said OK.
    so when he is done, I'll update you

    Crazy thing is, in the 35 years I own the car, I really haven't used the air.
     
  22. synchro

    synchro F1 Veteran

    Feb 14, 2005
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    Yeah, I saw that expansion valve was right there and it didn't get changed - wow, saved $20

    I have produced an R-12 to R-134a conversion kit for 246 GT / GTS Dinos A/C.
    While 10+ year old A/C hoses will probably leak, the real culprit is the design to use flare fittings to seal the A/C system
    That is why modern cars only use HNBR O-Ring seals for the A/C system
     
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  23. DonB

    DonB Formula Junior
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    How hot is a Danish summer?
     
  24. pshoejberg

    pshoejberg Formula 3
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    Dec 22, 2007
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    Today 30 deg C. We have experienced increasingly warm summers last years and driving coupe cars without air con is not nice. I’m suffering in my old Dino gt With no air con and the header located a few inches from my back.

    best, Peter
     

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