Brake pedal problem, can anyone help? | FerrariChat

Brake pedal problem, can anyone help?

Discussion in '348/355' started by Jackie and bill, Feb 5, 2016.

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  1. Jackie and bill

    Jackie and bill Formula Junior

    Nov 29, 2014
    795
    GB
    Full Name:
    William
    Due to a slight leak in the brake pressure switch sensor, i change it for a new unit. This is the pressure swiitch that is found in the front RH brake line in my 94 GB car.
    So after the swap the brakes were bleed with no problem. But now the brake pedal travels maybe two imches and the feels like it has hit a wall, no movement what so ever :(
    Its as though something in the master cylinder is not allowing the pedal to be pressed past the two inches from the top.
    This happens even when the engine is of. Also when bleding the front brakes the pedal does travel all the way down, but once the bleed nipple is locked of, the pedal suddenly has this problem with the ignition on or of. I have even put the old pressure swith back on but the problem is still there :(
    The ABS pump is working as it should FYI, and the system is an early ATE (the one without the round servo)
    Has anyone experienced this before? I am baffled and need help from an expert? There must be a reason for this.
     
  2. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Aug 10, 2002
    29,200
    socal
    Isn't about 2" from the top approximately max brake pressure that will stop the car? If you hit that wall and get a bleed off pedal sinking with engine on or off that would imply a leaking master. What you want when driving is a firm solid pedal that hit a point solid and the car stops directly or goes into ABS pedal pulsing mode both with plenty of pedal travel left unused.
     
  3. Jackie and bill

    Jackie and bill Formula Junior

    Nov 29, 2014
    795
    GB
    Full Name:
    William
    Thanks for the reply, i had to read it a few times because some of it did not make sense to me.
    No there is definately a problem with it. A brake pedal is supposed to be progresive, not just stop after 2 inches with out any movement at all. I have owned the car for 2 years and it has always has a good pedal.
    I have read this has happend to some 360, however they had the new servo units that had faulty check valves in the vacume hose to the servo. My 355 being an early car does not have this type of set up, were as the later 355s do.
     
  4. plugzit

    plugzit F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 1, 2004
    7,786
    Redondo Beach, CA
    Full Name:
    Bruce Bogart
    Did you bleed with ignition on (abs on)?
     
  5. Jackie and bill

    Jackie and bill Formula Junior

    Nov 29, 2014
    795
    GB
    Full Name:
    William
    Yes the car was bleed with the ignition on. The rear calipers activated the ABS pump as usual. And the fronts also bleed as usual.
    With the front bleed nipple open the pedal travels down, but once the nipples locked of the wall takes effect after a few inches. Its a strange one but surley it cant not have happend before. Thanks for replying by the way.
     
  6. GerryD

    GerryD Formula 3

    May 5, 2010
    2,444
    North of TO
    Full Name:
    Guido
    Check the relays on the opposite side of the car from the abs. On a left hand drive they are under the front hood on the passenger side. You have to unscrew and lift the carpet.
     
  7. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Aug 10, 2002
    29,200
    socal
    I don't think I am understanding your description. However, what you describe is sort of like a bad brake line. The lines are rubber and old. Breakdown internally can cause weird symptoms like the wall with no braking or reduced braking effect and failure of brakes to release. The newest 348 is 22 years old! I would replace brake lines of this age as routine maintenance. Girodisc in Washington used to make Stainless braided lines you can check with them. They are not hard to make or source by fitting.
     
  8. Mike@Girodisc

    Mike@Girodisc Rookie
    BANNED

    May 29, 2015
    33
    Belllingham
    Full Name:
    Mike
    Unfortunately we no longer offer brake lines but I don't think that's your issue. It sounds like the ABS is acting up and cycling a valve that closes off the input to the outlet. I've never seen this on one of my 348's but we have a 456 that did something very similar when we were bleeding and cycling the pump with a Leanardo, it would lock the left rear caliper and the pedal would go hard, it was very strange and only after cycling the pump a few times did we get it to stop acting up. Being that the pump is Bosch we were able to blame this one on the Germans for a change :)

    I would keep cycling the ABS pump and see if anything changes. Other than having the lines pinched, a blockage in the lines or something in the master cylinder that won't allow travel there isn't much else it could be.

    Best of luck, keep us posted.
     
  9. ///Mike

    ///Mike F1 Veteran

    Dec 11, 2003
    6,097
    Bugtussle
    For whatever it's worth, Goodridge, the well respected maker of SS braided brake and clutch lines, makes two different sets of brake lines for the 348, and offers them in a rainbow of colors. I just ordered a black set with stainless fittings from Demon Tweeks. Seems like they were under $125 shipped. As mentioned above, considering the age of 348s at this point, a new set of high quality lines seems like cheap insurance. They typically improve pedal feel as well, so win/win.
     
  10. Jackie and bill

    Jackie and bill Formula Junior

    Nov 29, 2014
    795
    GB
    Full Name:
    William
    Mike@girodisc, spot on, this was what happend. I wish you had posted what you did the week i posted the question, it would have helped me source the problem quicker. Thanks Mike@Girodisc, gold star :) All sorted now, but i wish i had spoken to you first mate :)
     
  11. Mike@Girodisc

    Mike@Girodisc Rookie
    BANNED

    May 29, 2015
    33
    Belllingham
    Full Name:
    Mike
    Ahh shoot, well I'm glad you got it sorted regardless! Guess I need to poke around in here more often, it's tough to keep up with you guys sometimes!
     
  12. tomhargr35

    tomhargr35 Rookie

    Sep 25, 2012
    2
    I'm having to same issue. What was the final fix?
     
  13. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
    Consultant

    Nov 29, 2001
    13,630
    San Carlos, CA
    Full Name:
    Mitchell Le
    Jackie and Jill just posted that the fix was a stuck valve.
     

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