brakes on Testarossa

Hello to all,

I was wondering about the brakes on a 87 testa. Driving on the track at Spa last weekend showed that the brakes are not all to great. After 4 laps all gone. Disks are fine and so are the pads so my geuss is that the oil was getting to hot.

My question; are there any aftermarket sets available and if yes what make and where to get them.

Hope to hear from you guys

Robje1355
Netherlands

 

The OEM brakes were never intended for track use, they overheats and can cook the brake fluid under on the track. Brembo makes brake kits for different level of performances, both include drilled(Casted) or slotted vented discs, stainless steel brake lines, upgrade pads and better fluids. My understanding is also, don't over do it as a brake setup for track use may not be ideal for street use, because there has been incidence that track setup brake system fails to heat up enough for street use. Anyway, check www.brembo.com and decide on what the best setup is for yourself. Good luck.

 

First, run race fluid. Has higher boiling point. Does need to be changed more frequently. Everyone has their personal favorite. Castrol SRF/AP550/Motul/Ate Super Blue are all good. Makes a big difference when coupled with the second recommendation.

Second, use some more temperature tolerant pads for the track. Everyone has their personal favorities on this too. I use Carbotech's on my 308 (1109 XP).

Third, Gary Bobileff noted that biggest issue with TR brakes is front to rear brake bias @ track. Putting in an adjustable bias valve will give you significantly more brake action. Most race shops can supply. (I've just done this on my 308).

If all this doesn't get you where you need to be, look at bigger brakes but be careful with wheel clearance issues (I am putting 355 F brakes on my 308).

HTH
Philip

 

Hi Anthony,
I was at the Brembo site but I can't make any sense out of it. The stuff they list is that what currently under the car or it that the replacement. If replacement any idea what it's going to cost?

Robje1355

 

The standard Brakes are made by ATE so any Brembo will be aftermarket

 

I think the price on there are what the new brakes kit will cost you. I think the best thing to do is find out if they have a regional dealer close to where you are at, that way you can have direct Brembo support and someone that can clear up any questions you may have.

Also, be very careful about the suggestion of just changing the brake pads. There are pads out there that are great performers, except that they also tears your OEM disc apart. Remember, you are mixing 2004 techology with 1984 techology. Make sure the pads are suitable for your discs that are on the car.

 

if you put bigger brakes on you may have to put bigger wheels on as the calipers might catch and if your testarossa hes single bolt knock on wheels on this would be expensive

 

I've just had a chat with some people at ATE in Germany about the brakes.
Well after going thru the hoops this guy said that the brakes are actually not that bad.
What we ended up with was that my testa's braking oil is high contanminated with water (use the brakes actively, when te pedal goes down all the way you water in the oil is steaming (steam can be compressed) and therefor you end up with no braking power.

I'll go with the new oil first and see what happens.

Keep you all posted

Robje1355

 

Since you are going to change the fluid and flush the system, you may want to consider getting stainless steel brakelines for the car as well, it will also improve brake feel at the paddle, which allows you to better modulate your braking. Not to mention the lines are over 15 years old as is anyway. At least that is what I am planning on doing to my own car later this year fo the annual fluid change. Just my 2 cents.

 

Hi Anthony,
Thanks for the advice, will change the lines also. Still a **** load cheaper as getting new brakes.....
Funny thing was that I called them to find out about what aftermarket ATE brakes to buy. The guy told me the brakes are fine and are more than capable of handleing the car (altough racetrack being something different he admitted) in the end he told me go flush the system first and see how this works for you. "changhing the brakes you still can do if you feel this is not doing it for you"

Robje1355

 

I know, I went through the same type of debate internally as well. On one hand, I wanted to keep the car as OEM as possible and on the other hand, improve or upgrade as the opportunity arrives. The cost of Brembo brakes pretty much made the decision for me. I also looked into another company (stoptech) for the drilled/slotted brakes, but unfortunately, they do not carry anything for the Testarossas. Anyway, what I have posted is pretty much the sum of my researchs on this topic and I am more than happy to share what little I know with any fellow Tifosi My understanding is that the braking power of the car will dramatically improve with the switch to SS lines and the better fluids. But still, just like you said, street performance is one thing, track use is another. Please do post your results and evaluation after the modification.

 

(Sorry, but I can't resist making this joke)

You don't need better brakes -- you need to cut ~1000 lbs off your TR

Seriously, isn't the real problem (if it's not just a moisture/fluid problem) more that you need better brake cooling (rather than more powerful/exotic brakes)? (Ignoring that more pistons give a more even load over the brake pad) Isn't the real advantage of "bigger" brakes just that they're more massive/larger so they can absorb more energy for a given temperature increase, and that they have more total surface area so the convective cooling is better?

 

I agree with Steve..........the TR is just TOO heavy, to be an enjoyable track car. Rather than spend the money required to make it so.............a LOT.........why not just keep the TR for what it was designed for?........a wonderful cruising machine.

The money needed to make the TR into a true track car, would be better spent on a Lotus Elise.........and have fun tracking, right from the start!!!!!!!!

 

Well the brake fluid got changed. what can I say.... I should have looked at it straight away. The fluid looked like coke (smelled differnt) so there you have it.
Braking is wonderfull now. Much much more Bite. No need to change brakes and yes the Testa is NOT a track car and it will never be one.. (to bad, like racing though)

Thanks for the advice

Robje1355

 

Vince -- I've got no question that increasing the radius from the axle to the mean pad center would increase the available braking moment -- but that wasn't the stated problem (and I'd argue that this would actually reduce feel as you'd have a narrower pedal "input" range from free-wheeling to full lock-up).

Your second point is really along the same line -- having more braking moment available for the same pad-to-disc unit pressure (if you can put more force onto the larger pads), but I don't see how this really helps if the wheel is already able to be fully locked up with the stock system (when it's not over-heated).

I know the car manufacturers and the aftermarket have figured out that we love gigantic brakes (and that we like 'em painted too ), but I'm just surprised that better thermal management isn't more the focus (rather than increasing the maximum available braking moment) -- just an observation...

 

I changed the front calipers to a Brembo kit from Stillen with F50 pads and 13.5 inch drilled rotors - the difference is AMAZING. I had the rear calipers serviced, pads changed and rotors surfaced. Parts and labor were under $3500 - the best money I've spent on the car yet!

Another help that was already mentioned (of sorts) is that I have the brake fluid flushed and changed once or twice a year.

 

For those of you that are interested, I just got the new SS brake lines put into my car. The padel feel is much improved, better response and easier to modulate than before.

 

Try different pads, SS lines, and good fluid.

If that doesnt work, then think about a BBK.