Budget Cap Enforcement

Yep. Apply some classical "logical extension" to Egan's (Ghostbusters identical twin) argument: every "minor" infraction is worth a half second? So, four minor infractions ... to the tune of a couple million bucks ... will buy you TWO SECONDS per lap? Nonsense. Also, as you point out, if dollars translate directly to time, any "budget cap" at all would mean that ALL teams would post the exact same times. Also nonsense.

 

If Red Bull has to be punished, it should be in a way that
1) don't affect last year's result, and therefore damage the sport credibility,
2) don't penalise the declared winner who isn't responsible for the team's accounting,
3) don't cheat the public, they witnessed Max winning, and should keep that memory intact.

So the FIA has to be careful in what it decides. A fine seems to be the best solution.

 

The FIA was supposed to come with their "findings" 4 or 5 hours ago......still nothing yet.

 

Agreed.

IF there's an exorbitant and egregious breach by said parties the FIA should limit:

1) wind tunnel tests
2) pay a fine set by how much the exorbitant and egregious breach was by what percentage over the FIA "mandated" amount.
3) limit the amount of time regarding Pirelli tests and fiming tests.

 

Agree on more.
But a fine wouldn't be enough for a significative infringement.
No way Ferrari should accept such a disadvantage for 2022 and 2023.

 

Here's reality: RBR, Mercedes, and even McLaren are clearly lying about expenses. They can all lie about how much parts, manufacturing, and labor are costing them, and the only way anyone can prove one team to be lying is to compare declared costs side by side between the teams. But since it all gets to be private under the law, there's no way anyone can prove anything .

Ferrari would've breached the cap as bad as RBR and Mercedes, if they weren't still wiping egg off their faces from the 19' fuel scandal. The Ferrari board are a lot of stupid things, but they were not happy about Binotto getting caught in 19', and I'm sure he was on thin ice to not be the first to get caught breaching the budget cap.

Mekies statement of the budget cap will be "game over" if RBR are not punished severely is him laying the groundwork for Ferrari to breach the cap next year, and be able to blame RBR "starting it" if they get caught. Toto is doing the same - knowing damn well Mercedes went way over this year.

The budget cap is like the ban on team orders. Everyone is still going to do what they want, especially when their main rivals are going to do it too.

 

Ferrari shouldn't have a say in it, IMO.

A third party is not consulted for a judgement.

 

Exactly !! The FIA should abstain from writing rules it cannot enforce.

 

1) fact of the matter is the first instance of that diffuser is was used in FP1 by Charles. That automatically then means it's a part used and HAS to be brought in as a new part. This diffuser was further revised upon that testing and then introduced as part of the upgrade package in Spain. It's a matter of fact that Toby didn't mention these parts, not opinion. He's missed several wings and diffusers in the list you provided. All big ticket items. This completely distorts the opinion whether RB or indeed Ferrari is upgrading or not.

2) We'll see. Merc claimed early on in 2021 to not develop yet they continued to bring parts. What's funny is that this wasn't even a story at any one point since AbU Dhabi, none. Now suddenly it's an open secret? Why didn't Mercedes complain throughout 2021 about RBR bringing updates? Yet all of a sudden everyone is an expert in what RBR has spend all because Toto opened his mouth and started accusing. There simply is NO way that after all the 2021 post championship **** they completely forgot about this and didn't think to bring it up at any given moment during the championship or immediately after when they where screaming bloody murder, or any of the 10 months since, and only now claim ''oh yeah, open secret, everyone knows they WAY''. Utter ****ing ********.

Regardless of this discussion, with people all over this right now, one has to wonder why F1 doesn't keep a very simple, easy to overlook archive for anyone to access so people don't have to go back on the twitter statements of select journos who may or may not have brought the full list of upgrades of certain teams.

 

The tea biscuits were late and the milk foamer has failed. FIA issues............

 

Any news who breached the budget?
Can RedBull get out of trouble with no consequences?
Also the role of breaching by the satellite team AMR should be taken into account. It adds up to the story.

 

Big fine of at least 5x the amount over budget. Paid out to the teams and then NO winter testing. Prac1 of race 1 they can use that for testing. 50% wind tunnel penalty. Free tickets to all fans at the Vegas Grand Prix to include hotel suites. That should do it lol

 

If no punishment comes of cheating, then the sport is dead and has lost all credibility, to fans and teams.

 

They now delayed the report till october 10th. Lol. Another week of Toto to spew made up stories. Can't wait for the headlines in the papers this Monday (if Max wins the title) "Max wins title, but can he lose this and last years?"

Damage done as far as Mercedes is concerned. Many people are entirely convinced of a breach having happened, and are also convinced if the report says RB didn't breach, it's a cover up.

 

Thanks for posting facts about any 'liability' Horner and those here think apply to Ferrari or Mercedes LOL. Sure lets just ban a team for stating what is openly spoken of in the press and in the paddock LOL. Genius level bias and thinking.

 

Delayed till Monday now..........in the press

FIA delays release of F1 cost cap certificates until Monday
The FIA will delay the release of the Formula 1 cost cap certificates until Monday, owing to the “long and complex process that is ongoing.”

 

Some of the worst scenarios that could come from the FIA:
- Red Bull disqualified from the 2021 WCC, and losing its share of the redistribution money.
- the WDC result overturned and Hamilton declared 2021 WDC
- Red Bull having its testing and wind tunnel time further reduced
- Red Bull so heavily fined that it cannot operate under the budget cap in 2023, etc ...

Would that serve the interests of the sport, and increase the FIA credibility? I am not so sure.
Do people follow F1, and attend GPs to see the budget cap at work, or to watch racing ?

F1 existed for decades without a budget cap, and these incidents should make the FIA realise it went too far in its search for parity.
F1 is over-regulated as it is. They shouldn't add layers upon layers of new rules.

 

Err, ... I think they should at least issue the certificates to teams which are clear of any budget concerns.

Instead, FIA seems very uncomfortable with making any decisions, (read: something BIG happened and they are not sure what to do with major breach actor)

 

This is going to backfire badly on Wolff

 

a "small amount" could also equate to buying some ice creams for the team while enroute to Monza.

where is the tolerance level ?

 

Does not matter what used to exist in f1, its about the here and now, Last years title is already tainted, what difference does it make if it goes to who it should have gone to any way if the RULES had been followed and all drivers and teams was treated equally?, Cause thats sport right? a fair contest between teams competing under the same rules and regulations right? to be the best of the best. now we actually know what team and staff are the best, cause the top teams all work under the same budget, or atleast, should be...

Manchester United dont get to ingor the offside rule just cause you know, it didnt exist in 1883...... or adhear to new updated rules which happen every single season because you know, it didnt exist last season... or play 12 players instead of 11..

 

And Ferrari. Ferrari are as intent of penalty of meaningful type if there is a violation. Do you not think Horner and Marko would be pushing for major penalty as well on Ferrari or others to keep their advantage etc. This is F1 at its best.

The only question is proof and FIA action on who ever team is in breach if they are at all.

Binotto has been questioning RedBull developments for months and its related cost vs the Budget Limit agree'd to. Of all the reactions with weight the FIA should fear Ferrari not being pleased more than most.

I hope this entire budget idea melts and dies swiftly. Spend, innovate and race. You want limits run a Karting Team.

 

It does matter a lot, because before everything was fine !

I don't know who had the stupid idea to imagine that we would obtain equality among team by limiting their budget.

It leads to plenty of subterfuges, creative accounting and other means for the wealthier team to spend more than allowed.

The cream always raises to the top; the most efficient teams will still win, and the minnows be tail enders.

 

+1

It's a really daft idea; and far more controversial than any technical rules the FIA has introduced over the years, IMO.

Socialism has invaded F1; that's what I think. How some teams dare to spend more than others !! LMAO