Buy Your Gated F430 Before They Double in Price

Hopefully the 360's follow...

 

I think at a *certain price point* manual 430s will hit a ceiling as ppl other than the super rich will have a hard time justifying the delta over a manual 360, in spite of the few advantages of the 430 over it.
Law of diminishing returns.
Plus, I’m of the opinion, that manual lovers are a dwindling not increasing population.

Still a great car, I’d love to own one...but will settle for my manual 360 for now.

 

I don't know what others' experience is, but the young car nuts I know all want manuals. This is certainly not true for the general population. Markets are hard to predict and I suck at it so I won't go there. I've had my 3 pedal coupe since new (2005) and have never been tempted to sell it. Reliability and low maintenance costs are big factors why I still have it. I really don't know what price point I'd let it go for.

Dave

 

This whole notion of appreciation of manual F430s gives me mixed emotions. On the one hand, were I to be tempted to trade my '06 gated F430 Spider for a new or newer Ferrari, a higher trade-in value sounds great. On the other hand, I have grave reservations about giving up the pleasures of that gated shifter. Fred

 

"If you want the most modern and reliable Ferrari with a gated manual but can't afford those ridiculous 599 and California prices, the F430 is a relative bargain at the moment. For anyone in the market for their first supercar who doesn't want to take the enormous depreciation hit of a new one, we highly suggest investing your money in a manual Ferrari F430."

Fair point. I wouldn't swap my gated 430 spider for a 488. I'd have to think harder about a 458, but my neighbour has a 458 Spider, and while its a nicer looking car with a better interior, if he suggested a swap for the next year, I'd say no. But who knows if that means there are loads of people like me to boost the prices as the article suggests. Even if there're aren't any more manual Ferraris, there are lots of manual Porsches, R8s, Aston Vantage V12s and so on, around.

Anyway, who knows how the market will go. It's a great car though. Manual, mid engined convertible Ferrari with nearly 500 HP and a E Diff for amazing traction. More fun than an F50.

 

Hard to know where the market really is. First, it’s really annoying how many 430s are listed as having manual transmissions when they’re F1s. I get how technically they’re automated manuals but the lack of true differentiation means having to wade through every listing to look for a pic of the console to see whether it has a stick.

The range of asking prices seems to be from $169k to $270k, with most around $179k-$189k. But I’ve not followed these so have no idea how long they’ve been sitting. There aren’t many sticks, and if these prices are anywhere close to market, they are significantly more than stick 360s. I’m not so sure the delta is worth it for a driver. Maybe a collector will pay, but what’s the fun in buying a car and parking it indefinitely? I’m sure there are plenty who do that, but not me. So, no 430 upgrade for me, from my 360.






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Hello to all:

Well what I can tell is only about my personal experience. In about Sept. 2016 I set out to find a F430 Gated Transmission Spider. While it's true that you really have to look inside the vehicles listed to make sure the shifter is visible it's not an insurmountable problem. What I found was there was more 2005 and 2006 F430 GT's available, fewer 2007 and nonexistent 2008's and only one 2009.
Unfortunately for me the 2009 I saw on line was exquisite and only had 3,927K on it's clock, and had some nice upgrades such as the 7K Bose sound system installed. The reason why I say unfortunate was after seeing it nothing else could possibly come close to even comparing. The bad part was the asking price which was $270K.

What I later learned was the reason why there were few 2008's and even fewer 2009's was because Ferrari at that time was promoting their newly released Scuderia, and later the Scuderia 16M and the consequence of that was the USA Dealers were bringing fewer plain F430's. That December of 2016 I went to some Ferrari Dealers in the Los Angeles area and posed the question, that if I didn't act on my desires to buy the 2009 vehicle, what were the odds that I would see another one like it come up for sale within my lifetime? At the time I asked the question I was 66 years old. The answer I got was; probably never!

Keep in mind that the Dealers also realize the value of these cars and they are also your competition, as they most likely have potential buyers who have put in a request to be contacted when a good one comes up for sale.

To keep this from becoming a 'shaggy dog' story I'll cut to the chase. My maximum price I set for myself that I was planning on spending was $250K, however when I finally offered that price in January 2017 I only got a lukewarm reaction and later found out my offer wasn't even presented because that offer had already recently been offered and the seller who had his car on consignment had turned it down. The Dealer told me the seller knew the value of what he had and was in no hurry to sell it and because summer was approaching he'd probably wait until then because Spiders become more desirable then and bring better prices.

Since the Dealer told me the seller would not accept anything less than $260K, and the fact someone else was trying to cut in on my action I decided what the hell it's now or never and threw out the price of $255K. The Dealer assured me they would present that price and later that day I got a call back saying the seller accepted my price offer. I later found out that if it wasn't for the fact his wife had been recently hospitalized and was facing a potential mortal illness he wouldn't have accepted that price either. So in the end timing becomes an important role in getting the car of your dreams at the price you're willing to pay.

The night before I was preparing to fly to Salt Lake City to sign the paperwork I heard back from another 2009 F430 GT Spider owner whom I had PMed on this forum where he related to me his informed knowledge on this topic was a total of only four 2009 F430 GT Spiders were ever brought into the USA. So as it turned out, I was buying one of those four.

Before this time I had never even sat in a Ferrari much less ever drove one! After I received it via truck transport, I must admit I have never regretted making my decision in buying the one I bought.

johnfe

 

Great story and I believe I remember you posting photos of it before - beautiful car with all of the carbon fiber options. I have been watching the 6-speed F430 market for several years now and I have never seen a 2009, and only one 2008 from what I remember. I got close to buying a 2007 earlier this year that had all the right specs, but it sold before I had a chance to look at it.

I am sure you typically keep her locked up safe and sound, but if you ever take her for a spin in SoCal I would love to see her!

 

They're about two years too late to the party. Premiums on stick 430s were, for a short while, about 100% compared to an F1 car, apples to apples. That premium has dropped to about 30-40% (again, apples to apples) and is continuing to head down.

 

mchas:

If you can come to the 'Cars and Coffee' upcoming event on this next Saturday I'll bring her to the event. This will be on Saturday February 16th 2019. Please see the attached PDF document for the details regarding the time and location.

johnfe

 

I just purchased a 2006 coupe with 17k on the clock after a 5 year search, it gets here this weekend and couldn't be happier...

 

smyers528:

Congratulations to you, you'll never regret it. The good thing about the Manual is much less maintenance with more reliability at much less the cost. Also you'll do many less clutch changes, and not have to encumber the down time not to mention the cost.

The one thing I'd recommend if it hasn't been done already is to install the Capristo exhaust brackets to save your exhaust manifolds from cracking. I love to see a picture of your new purchase if you have one available.

Thanks for posting your good news,

johnfe

 

Thanks for the great words, I'll post photos once it arrives this weekend. For clarification, it's the one mentioned in the article this thread is referencing, the $169k car.

http://www.pmcdetroit.com/detail-2006-ferrari-430-2dr_coupe_berlinetta-used-18435998.html
Best,
Shawn

 

Hi Shawn aka smyers528:

Really looks like a very awesome cleanly kept and well maintained vehicle. Did you fly back to Michigan to see the vehicle in person? So it's coming to you cross country by truck? If so the feeling you'll get when the truck pulls up with your baby will be one you'll never forget so I'd recommend committing it's arrival to video so you'll be able to relive that experience over and over as the years roll on.

I had wanted to do that with mine but was unable to do so as the car arrived earlier than I expected and I was still cleaning out my garage making space for it. But before putting mine away I had to take it for a short drive and found I had to pry myself out of the vehicle as the experience was so pleasurable.

Well done, I'm sure you're counting down the days until it's arrival! Mine is also the same color of Rosso Corsa Red with beige interior although mine is the Spider version. Glad to see you're seats are not the 2 tone color combination as I have decided I think the interior looks better with just one color as the 2 colors seems to break up the lines of the interior. But that's just my personal opinion.

Well I'd say your tenacity of the 5 year search has finally come to a very pleasant fruition.

Regards,

johnfe

 

That is a common misconception about the F1 vs gated. In normal conditions and if properly set up an F1 clutch will last almost as long as the manual one.

 

Zed82: No misconception here about the F1 vehicles. My guess is you are unfamiliar with the fact that Ferrari intentionally set up the F430 F1 vehicles to slip in 1st gear in order to produce a smoother transition (ride); so it's unavoidable that the clutches in F1 cars will wear out much faster even when they are set up properly according to the proper specifications. To avoid this from happening it has been recommended the F1 owners should start out in 2nd gear to avoid excessive wearing on the clutch plate!

Unfortunately many F430 F1 owners are completely unaware of this fact and don't start out in 2nd gear because they simply don't know any better and thusly are unintentionally wearing out their clutches getting much less mileage out of their vehicles per clutch change when compared the the manual clutch vehicles that don't have this flaw incorporated into their vehicles.

Regards,

johnfe

 

Have you owned a F430 with the F1-system? If properly set up the slippage in the first gear is not a problem. If you get less then 30k miles from an F1 clutch in normal driving conditions something is wrong. Unless you drive in lots of stop n go traffic but in those conditions a manual car would also have issues. I drove 6000 miles last season with only 2% wear on the clutch.

 

Nice to see more buzz on the gated topic.
Articles like help raise awareness.

 

I think you're right about that Fred. I'm tempted to trade or sell my gated 360 spider but I'm started to rethink it. Modern Ferrari's have a lot of competitors from other brands right now. The cars coming from these brands have better build quality and at a relatively better price point. IMO Ferrari has to get off their high horse (no pun intended) but that's a whole different conversation. The gated cars are in a special place for true car enthusiasts right now and as time goes on their dollar value will increase accordingly.

 

You are right, john is wrong, AND his suggestion to launch in 2nd is whacked too. That will cause MORE clutch clipping just as if you did it with a gated car.

 

Interesting story, and congrats on your car. There is an 09 F430 spider with manual in a noted local collection here in WA state. If I remember the history, it was delivered in early 2010. IIRC he also said when the order came up for production in the fall, Ferrari tried to convince him to switch to F1 due to the lack of parts available to produce a manual, but he insisted and was very happy to receive it. The local dealer told him they believe it might even be the last one produced, based on their research.

 

Having owned F1 and now manual I can confidently say I can achieve upwards of 50% less clutch slip on take off with the manual compared to the F1.

 

Maybe you were too careful and slipped the clutch too much with the F1? I definitely get instant grip with mine. It’s a driving technique.

 

16,500 miles on my F1 transmission and I have a little over 50% clutch left.
I figure I can get another 7-10,000 miles on my car before I need a new clutch.
So somewhere about 27-28,000 miles on the clutch.
I am OK with that though I believe you can get a little more with a 6 speed manual car.
Reverse is especially hard on these clutches since I believe it is always slipping the clutch and
seldom fully engaging.
I try to get a reverse move done very quickly.