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Buying first Ferrari. What to look for in PPI of a 458

Discussion in '458 Italia/488/F8' started by Nexxas, Oct 25, 2019.

  1. Nexxas

    Nexxas Rookie
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    Jul 15, 2019
    25
    Orlando, FL
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    David Alexander
    I am looking at finally buying my dream car. I am having a PPI done. What kind of issues should I tell the mechanic to make sure to check? It's a 2010 and I have been reading and researching these cars for months.

    I have read common issues are hydraulic system of suspension, engine seals, ... sensors going bad, but can that be checked? Same with gearbox issues - are there any indicators to look for?

    I appreciate it.
     
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  3. paulchua

    paulchua Cat Herder
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    Jul 1, 2013
    10,088
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    Paul Chua
    Welcome Fabian! Just moving to the 458 forum for ya.

    Cheers
     
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  4. greyboxer

    greyboxer F1 World Champ

    Dec 8, 2004
    11,133
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    Jimmie
    If you need to tell the mechanic what to look for maybe you need to find a different mechanic who is actually familiar with 458 to do the PPI ?
     
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  5. Nexxas

    Nexxas Rookie
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    Jul 15, 2019
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    Orlando, FL
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    I agree, except it's a part of the country that doesn't see many exotic cars. It's an excellent shop that deals with European cars, but I am just trying to do my own homework to insure nothing is missed.
     
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  6. Steinhart

    Steinhart Formula Junior

    May 21, 2019
    258
    Scottsdale, AZ, USA
    I heard some the 2010 458's had transmission problems and were recalled, something maybe to look into

    Agree, it's best to get someone familiar with the car to do the PPI

    When I was looking I hired a nationwide PPI firm called "Automobile Inspections", paid $400, but was very basic, not much value to me in the end, there were even some obvious mistakes that they later corrected, admitted they copied and pasted from another PPI they had done :(
     
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  8. RayJohns

    RayJohns F1 Veteran
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    May 21, 2006
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    Unless you are dealing with a situation where someone selling the car will allow fairly extensive work to be done, I think mostly a PPI is a visual check and largely a waste of time and money. Even most Ferrari dealers probably aren't going through their cars with a fine tooth comb. They are just looking to turn the cars around as quickly as possible and get their commission. My impression is basically they clean and detail them, then put them on the show room floor. Most of the dealers I have spoken with don't know all that much about the mechanics of the cars; they mainly are just sales people.

    Your best bet is to inspect the car yourself and see if it appears to have been well taken care of. I would also put the money you'd otherwise spend on a PPI towards some sort of warranty coverage.

    2010 isn't a year I'd personally buy. As mentioned already, they seemed to have gear box failures at a higher rate than later years (according to information related on this forum). Just in general, buying the first year of any new Ferrari tends to be dicey business in my experience. Look at the 355 or the 360. The first year on those cars included many bugs which later needed to be resolved. Even several years into production, Ferrari was still sorting out odd-ball issues in some cases. Heck, my 2001 360 had problems; you'd fill up the gas tank and it would only register 3/4 full. Stuff like that. And anyway who has ever owned a 355 and actually driven it more than 3000 miles can tell you how much money it takes to keep those things on the road. I drove my 1997 F355 for about 15,000 miles and it seemed like every time I turned around, something was either needing attention or failing or just flat out falling off the car. Great car for sure, but they require a lot of TLC.

    By contrast, the 458 is pretty bullet proof, especially from mid-2012 on. If you can afford to get a 2013 or later model, that's the sweet spot as far as good quality drivetrain I think. I don't know if that's a function of who was on the assembly line or just my imagination or what, but it seemed like the 458's produced between late 2012 and early 2014 were some really well sorted out Ferraris.

    Is the car in question at a dealer or are you shopping via a private party?

    Ray
     
  9. Ado4wd

    Ado4wd Formula Junior

    Dec 27, 2005
    280
    Germantown, TN
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    Andrew O
    If you do go through with it I’d recommend taking it to your Ferrari dealer and paying for the new power warranty.
     
  10. Corradosv

    Corradosv Karting

    Oct 17, 2016
    120
    Monaco MC
    That.
    First of all because they are extremely concerned with the car being in perfect shape before taking the risk of releasing the warranty, and they will ask for some jobs to be done (if any) for their (and your) piece of mind, secondly because you are covered in a number of circumstances, which is way better than nothing, even if sure they will try their best not to honor, in case.
    The Power Warranty has a much higher cost than a "regular" PPI, plus it needs a "serious" PPI to be done at extra cost, but it is worth the return to me, and it is what I personally did, if that helps.
    Then, of course, luck, or the absence of it, plays its part whatever you do.
     
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  11. Rdwaggie

    Rdwaggie Karting
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    Nov 6, 2018
    64
    I agree with others on year. I researched everything and landed on a 2013. 2010 & 2011 tend to trade a bit cheaper because of the early issues. Highly recommend a PPI from a Ferrari tech or at least someone with a Leonardo with the 458 module that knows exotics - you can tell a ton about the history from that. I flew a master tech in to PPI mine. It was a lot more than $400 but I spent almost 6 hours side by side with the tech and knew everything about the car before buying. Brakes and transmission are expensive.

    Also look out for remanufactured / repaired wheels, paint / body work (tech needs to bring a paint meter), get records and make sure fluids have been changed regularly (my brake fluid had not been changed despite the dealership record saying it was - it absorbs humidity regardless of miles which is no bueno). Would stay away from things that haven’t been driven.

    Regardless of age of battery that is in the car, throw it away and buy a new Odyssey and go through the electrical initiation process detailed in multiple places on the forum - that will save you a lot of troubles.


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
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  13. AlfistaPortoghese

    AlfistaPortoghese Moderator
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    Mar 18, 2014
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    Nuno
    I can only second the very useful insight all other members have posted.

    Just like to add one thing: there’s no hard, scientific evidence to support pre-2012 cars are more prone to mechanical failures. As far as I know, there have been software updates (for which pre-2012 cars are fully eligible), but no hardware changes.

    Kind regards,

    Nuno.
     
  14. Stormtrooper787

    Stormtrooper787 Karting

    Dec 15, 2017
    82
    Wouldn’t touch a 2010 .....2013 and higher. Production matured into the years.
     
  15. TUTTSF

    TUTTSF Karting

    Sep 21, 2018
    125
    So. Cal
    When searching for my 458 I was told all the same things about years and milage which I fallowed and landed on a 13 spider. Having owned one now for a year and going to FCA events and talking to owners and former owners of 458's I have yet ran into any owner who have had these issues or knows of said issues. Granted I'm sure it has happened but at a higher rate than other years I can't find any proof that this is a known issue with early production 458.

    As far as your list the hydraulic system is for the front lift system and all hydraulic seals at some point fail.
    Engine seals same thing no premature failure just scheduled maintenance
    Sensors well that is the transmission sensor failure you hear about and the solution used to be new trans when the sensor failed but I think they offer a rebuild kit but I could be mistaken on that.

    Things you should wan't in your PPI is like what Rdwaggie mentioned at the very minimum a Leonardo but a dealer would be preferable. They need to know about carbon ceramic breaks and what to look for in surface wear, look for fishers in the disk as this is where it will fail. The dash is known to crinkle or shrinkage from sub standard glue, of course the wonderful 300 thousand dollar car sticky buttons that Ferrari is so dam proud of they put it in all Fcars for ever.. idiots change it already.
    Have them look over all the glass and mirror condition I have a fog around my passenger edge mirror that was missed looks dirty but is actually permanent, chips in the windscreen are not picked up by a lot inspectors they focus on mechanical things, damage to the diffuser usually picked up when they put it on the lift. You want to tell the inspector when they are done with mechanical to give you a concourse review of the condition inside and out, you don't want any surprises when taking delivery as this will screw up the whole excitement of getting your dream car.

    I know I'm missing some things but I did not have a list when I asked for a ppi and left it up to the dealer luckily it turned out ok for me minus the dash problems they failed to mention that.

    Good hunting
     
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  16. Rdwaggie

    Rdwaggie Karting
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    Nov 6, 2018
    64
    Based on other posts on this forum, I am confident that Nuno is a far superior source of info than I. I will fully admit that I run out of depth pretty quick on certain technical issues but the techs I have spent a lot of money on and time with have said that the clutch changed a little and I think the robustness of the wiring harness / sensors that fail in the transmission were beefed up a bit between 2010/11 and 2012+


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
  17. AlfistaPortoghese

    AlfistaPortoghese Moderator
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    Mar 18, 2014
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    Indeed the manufacturing process is perfected over time, regardless of brand.

    You’re very kind and I do place great emphasis on accuracy, but always check and crosscheck me, as nobody gets it right everytime and I could be wrong.

    According to data on the internet, fellow owners’ feedback and my official dealer, the mechanical failures typically associated with pre-2012 cars also happen with post-2012 cars, and even F12 and FFs. Seen them all getting serviced for the same problem at my dealer.

    It seems more of a Getrag transmission issue across the range than anything else, and more dependent on other factors rather than model year alone. On top of that, I seem to recall a poll here some time ago that specifically targeted the reliability of 2010 and 2011 458s, and owner feeeback showed the same levels of reliability than post-2012 cars.

    Kind regards,

    Nuno.
     
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  18. TALON30

    TALON30 Karting

    Jan 8, 2010
    171
    I am getting ready to by a 2015 458 spider with 11,000 Miles.

    Would you spend the extra 5k for the power train warranty?

    Anything to look closer at on the 15?

    Dealer has a ppi
     
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  19. Rdwaggie

    Rdwaggie Karting
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    Nov 6, 2018
    64
    I would buy an 11k 2015 all day long if it checked out as well taken care of. Nothing specific to look at there.

    I personally would not pay $5k for one year of power train warranty. The probability of something happening is low if well maintained and you are half way to the repair cost most likely of any main issue. A lot of the transmission issues (which is really the main thing I would care about) relate to leaking of the seals, which is specifically not included in the power train warranty.

    Also, just me, but I wouldn’t rely on dealer PPI. Would get my own.

    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
  20. Cigarzman

    Cigarzman F1 Veteran
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    May 7, 2014
    6,114
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    Kirk
    I think it all depends on how you want to sleep. I did the 10k bumper to bumper on mine and didn’t use it. While I did sleep well ,I think my car sold quickly because it had the extended warranty. Best , Kirk.
     
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  21. Viper830tt

    Viper830tt Karting
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    May 10, 2017
    115
    When do we get to see some pictures? Currently shopping for a spider myself.

    Sent from my SM-N920V using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
  22. SoFLFerrari

    SoFLFerrari Karting

    Apr 23, 2015
    183
    South FL
    Agree wholeheartedly with Rdwaggie. I would not spend $5K on an extended power train warranty. The 2015 is rock solid and 11k miles is reasonable for the year. This is anecdotal but I know of no one who owns a 458 of any model year that has had any issues with it.
     
  23. Drew 88TR

    Drew 88TR Rookie

    Mar 5, 2018
    5
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    Drew
    The 458 is amazing. There are many 458 that are still under and qualify for a CPO warrently. Find one of those. Ferrari has a fantastic CPO warrenty, and it's a great way to ghet a 458 and rest easy.
     
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  24. sam Klapholz

    sam Klapholz Rookie

    Sep 10, 2017
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    sam Klapholz
    I bought my 2010 458 and had a PPI done by an excellent shop in Redondo Beach, Ca. It had 12000 miles and checked out perfectly. I drove it back to Dallas, which was a great adventure over the weekend and it has been perfect. The 458's are solid and bulletproof. Buy one and have some fun
     
  25. IloveGT

    IloveGT Formula 3

    Oct 17, 2015
    1,566
    Where are you getting the ppi done at? That's the real important question.
     
  26. Jason B

    Jason B Formula Junior

    Apr 7, 2006
    318
    Hbg, PA
    Also just curious, how rare is the front lift option on these cars? They are standard on the Lambo's, but wondering why all the 458's I keep seeing don't have the option on them.
     
  27. phatteus

    phatteus Rookie
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    Nov 20, 2007
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    When I spec'd my 2013 I wanted the lift, but was annoyed it required the expensive headlights that followed your turns (AFS). I bet if they sold them separate you would have seen a lot more, but because it paired with another high priced option many people just figured they'd take the risk of a few spoiler strikes. I am glad I got the lift tho, I put my car on a Bendpak 7W lift and I need the lift to make it over the standard ramps without bottoming out. I could also have solved that with longer ramps, but those wouldn't fit in my garage without me taking them on/off each time which I would hate.
     
  28. Jason B

    Jason B Formula Junior

    Apr 7, 2006
    318
    Hbg, PA
    Ah, well crap. You'd think this would be standard, but I guess I'm too used to Lambo as it's standard on 2005+ Gallardo's. How much is the headlight option? I know the lift is around $4k.
     

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