Camel build | Page 17 | FerrariChat

Camel build

Discussion in 'Aviation Chat' started by snj5, Sep 17, 2009.

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  1. Bob Parks

    Bob Parks F1 Veteran
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    Nov 29, 2003
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    The drag of these old biplanes is ever present. Low aspect ratio, a forest of wires singing away, struts, parasite drag, induced drag, etc. When the engine quits you push the stick forward as if it has a bad disease , and it does if you don't. The aerodynamics of a rose bush in full flight.
     
  2. snj5

    snj5 F1 World Champ

    Feb 22, 2003
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    Russ Turner
    That is CLASSIC!!!!
     
  3. snj5

    snj5 F1 World Champ

    Feb 22, 2003
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    Russ Turner
  4. tommott77

    tommott77 Formula Junior

    Feb 1, 2009
    652
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    Tom
    Awesome, awesome stuff! I actually came across airdrome's website last night after watching 'The Red Baron'. I then remembered about aviator chat over here performed a search on airdrome and am now floored.

    I had no idea that it would be so affordable to build/have your very own WWI fighter. Makes somebody who's only experience with flying has been sitting my hiney on a commercial plane, want to procure a light sports craft license, build a Focker DR-1, and buy some acreage to launch and land the bugger. I'm sure once all the ancillary costs are taken into consideration it would make this into a project several years down the road, but nonetheless I now have an idol ;-) Well done!
     
  5. snj5

    snj5 F1 World Champ

    Feb 22, 2003
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    #405 snj5, Mar 9, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    All re-work and upgrades done, re-inspected, test-run, and she is ready to go.
    Waiting on a nice windless day. In the next week or so I think.
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  6. toggie

    toggie F1 World Champ
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    Nov 30, 2003
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    ^^ Great picture of the Camel keeping an eye on the sky.
     
  7. Gatorrari

    Gatorrari F1 World Champ
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    Jim Pernikoff
    It looks like the airplane is saying "Where are you, Baron, I'm waiting for you!"
     
  8. solofast

    solofast Formula 3

    Oct 8, 2007
    1,773
    Indianapolis
    Looks like a painting that Bob should do... Leave off the 172 in the background and put in a couple more Camels and it would look just like it was on the Western Front...
     
  9. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Jul 19, 2008
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    Great idea. Have to get rid of the concrete, too.

    Taz
    Terry Phillips
     
  10. snj5

    snj5 F1 World Champ

    Feb 22, 2003
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    Russ Turner
    Had the small Flip video camera today and did this brief poor boy video tour of the Sopwith cockpit. Thought this might be interesting to some. My home build is definitely not museum quality, but it's a fun cockpit for amateur history buffs like me. Hope some find it entertaining:
    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3PL1FTX-7xA[/ame]
     
  11. Bob Parks

    Bob Parks F1 Veteran
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    Nov 29, 2003
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    Thanks for the tour, Russ. A look back in time through a modern looking glass. I wish that I was having as much fun as you but you have earned it.
     
  12. Fastviper

    Fastviper F1 Rookie

    Nov 20, 2003
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    Dash
    #412 Fastviper, Apr 20, 2011
    Last edited: Apr 20, 2011
    Hey Russ, next time you fly, text me I will come out and shoot some video...

    Oh and bring your Ferrari to the Coffee and rides on the 30thm and please bring a few cans of food.
     
  13. snj5

    snj5 F1 World Champ

    Feb 22, 2003
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    #413 snj5, May 17, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    I flew the Sopwith for the first time today, and now I am kicked back having a Woodchuck cider.
    Without going into the intensely emotional aspect of it all, which was there, here are a few first impressions. As the sun began setting in the west on a calm Castroville evening, she powered up to 1700 prop rpm ( 2550 engine rpm on the Rotec R-3600) on runway 15 and tail came up in 50 feet, and the plane lifted off in what was described by observers as 200 feet. She looked to come off about 45 - 50 mph IAS, then rapidly accellerated to 80 IAS in the climb, which I did not push at all and seemed 600+ fpm. Much like flying accounts I have read of Camels, she was sensitive fore and aft, and a little heavy on the ailerons, but very little movement was needed for the gentle first flight maneuvering. She seemed a bit left wing heavy, but that could be almost anything from rig to torque to me not really expert on this rudder bar thingee - it will require some practice. The wing heaviness did vary a bit with rpm, so maybe it thinks it has a rotary.

    I think she will be faster than I expected, at LESS than 1/2 throttle I was indicating over 80 mph at 1600 prop rpm. The prop is a Culver 90 x 48. Another interesting unexpected impression was that with the deep cockpit of the Camel, it was fairly comfortable and not very breezy as expected - and the engine was relatively quiet. In fact, the whole thing was quieter than the inside of a 100hp Champ at cruise, even being open cockpit. Oil temp was good, mid range on the tank sensor.

    A side note is that the Clarity Aloft headset works FANTASTIC under a leather helmet in an open cockpit.

    Landing was much easier than expected, she trundled in at 70 mph, cut the power over the end of the runway. The over the nose visibility on final was also surprisingly excellent (considering), but as moved to the 3pt attitude it became all peripheral cues. A little bump (I hit a bit tailwheel first I think) and she was down. Qnce going in one direction, she did not want to change that direction much, which may be to the camber/toe as previously discussed.

    Many thanks as always to Robert and the Airdrome folks and Family of builders - and to so many folks here that helped make a dream come true.
    Well, I'll think it's time for another cider.
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  14. Bob Parks

    Bob Parks F1 Veteran
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    Nov 29, 2003
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    Any Red barons out there will have to watch their six now! Russnoopy is on the prowl! Great news, Russ. WONDERFUL!
     
  15. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

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    Awesome stuff. Living the dream :).

    Pete
     
  16. GrigioGuy

    GrigioGuy Splenda Daddy
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  17. solofast

    solofast Formula 3

    Oct 8, 2007
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    Russ, that is sooooo Cool!!!
     
  18. toggie

    toggie F1 World Champ
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    Nov 30, 2003
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    Holey moley, that must have been exciting!

    Congrats on such a wonderful milestone. Wow, that is impressive.
     
  19. Gatorrari

    Gatorrari F1 World Champ
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    The lighting in your first shot makes it look like you're heading out in the dawn patrol to hunt for Fokkers! And the last one ably shows the "hump" that gave the Camel its nickname.
     
  20. snj5

    snj5 F1 World Champ

    Feb 22, 2003
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    Thanks everyone - to build and fly a plane is something I thought I would never do, let alone a replica of the iconic Sopwith.

    Although not the best quality, here's a short clip of my first take off:

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hrv9UdKeNok[/ame]

    Over the next months, I'll post a bit on the flight testing, which is a new and actually rigourous discipline for an old hayseed flyer like me.

    All advice, as always, is welcome. Especially from Mr. Parks.

    best to all
    rt
     
  21. MarkPDX

    MarkPDX F1 World Champ
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    Apr 21, 2003
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    Congrats Russ :)
     
  22. Bob Parks

    Bob Parks F1 Veteran
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    Nov 29, 2003
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    Russ, I'm humbled by your comment for I am certainly not one who has accumulated the experience that so many others have, including you. I must commend you on the way you have approached the Sopwith project. First, you had fun with it. Second, you treated it with respect because it was something new to you. Third, and most important, you flew the airplane when YOU were ready and comfortable with it. I have seen fatalities when the opposite was true. I envy you and what you are doing for you are doing it properly so that all of us can enjoy it with you. Today I was putting myself in the seat of your airplane and I wonder if I ever did anything like that.I did it several times but now it seems like it was done by someone else. Lordy, if I tried to do anything like what you are doing now I would hate to think of the consequences BUT I dream of it every day AND I can still feel it. Keep it going, we love it!
     
  23. snj5

    snj5 F1 World Champ

    Feb 22, 2003
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    #423 snj5, Jun 12, 2011
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    The initial left wing heaviness is slowly being tweaked out by the usual way by twisting the wings slightly around the front spars by shortening/lengthening the flying/landing wires to modify the lateral angle of incidence. Good progress on today's flight, so left the power up a little and verified the 90 - 93 mph IAS cruise at 1750-1800 prop rpm ( 2625 - 2700 rpm engine) at a density altitude of about 3500 feet. This is about 70% power on the Rotec engine. I will say that she feels a bit happier loafing along at 85. I know some of you are wondering if she will do 100 if pushed - I don't know but will expand the envelope gradually as the wing issue is resolved.

    Take-off is very straightforward - I've found initially keeping the tail down for a moment helps directional control, then bring it up once you have just a bit of speed is no problem. She settles in for a nice 70 mph climb. I tried stick forward at power up and it got squirelly until the speed was up.

    As said before, so far, approach behavior is exactly like an Aeronca Champ with similar descent rate/speed/power relationships. Once in transition, just close the throttle, put it in a three point attitude pointed the direction you want to go and wait. She'll waft down about 40 - 45 mph, take a little bounce, land and track the direction she was pointed and slow pretty quickly without brake in turf, as most tail draggers. In the grass, the steerable tail wheel is quite effective but still getting use to the rudder bar.. The temptation is to make it harder than it really is. In summary, it is a bit easier than a Champ to three point, you just have to be comfortable not seeing over the nose and steering with your legs and not your ankles.

    Another interesting Camel-referable skillset I am developing is not using brakes. I look back and I discovered that I really was overusing brakes on planes prior to the Camel. Now, I typically use brakes a total of two times: To hold at engine start, and rolling to a stop when the sortie is over - the rest is energy management on the ground and staying ahead of the plane.

    Spent this afternoon chasing oil leaks, tweaked the wings a bit more, and added gap seals to the bottom ailerons. I used the Rick Bennett "inverted "U" fabric type. Will check curing tomorrow - if look good, will do the top ailerons.

    best to all
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  24. snj5

    snj5 F1 World Champ

    Feb 22, 2003
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    A good morning of flying, now sitting here with a nice British hard cider.

    The left wing heaviness is now almost completely gone. The blowing oil leak from the sump overfilling is rectified as well - yea!

    Today was the first flight with the aileron gap seals. The ailerons do seem a bit stronger, but I am not throwing the airplane around at all. Most noticable was I am about 6 - 8 mph faster at the same power settings than last time. At 1800 prop rpm (2700 engine) she is a solid 90 mph IAS airplane (density altitude ~3500 ft), and this is with the throttle pulled back to about 4 - 3 (0 is full throttle, 10 is idle), and the engine is about at 70% at this cruise speed. I did ease her up momentarily to 1900 rpm and we were around 93-95 mph IAS. As I continue to work out the flight envelope, the max recommended cruise rpm for this engine is 2000 rpm. She does pick up quite the descent rate below 70 mph, so I am still coming in for a fairly flat approach for a reliable bump and threepoint on the grass. I am sure it will slow down with time.

    As a somewhat comical aside, I kind of like the soft little bounce it always seems to do as it allows me a moment to correct any last few degrees of heading before she plants down for good.

    I will go and measure, but she can take off and land from the end of the runway to the PAPIs, however far that is.

    I was in the pattern today about 300 - 500 feet below a broken deck, and it was pretty bumpy. You really are flying this thing all the time, and I am also starting to get used to this rudder bar thingee. And, as it says in all of the original texts, you sometimes have to carry top rudder in at turn. I have not tried any steep turns or horsing this thing around, so that will be a little later. She does lose a bit of IAS noticibly in a turn as well.

    I think I will hold with the rigging I have for a bit longer, and tweak that final left wing bias out a little later.
     
  25. sparky p-51

    sparky p-51 Formula 3

    Aug 8, 2004
    1,375
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    steve
    WOW...You did it. Great looking airplane Russ. Love the panel...where did you find a Height meter?
     

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