Can an All Electric Ferrari really be a Ferrari?

When you really get down to the psychology behind what makes a Ferrari a Ferrari you'll see that an all electric model goes against the very essence of what made them popular.

I believe there is a primal drive behind exotic cars. Yes, styling plays a factor but deep down there is something about ICE that is programmed into our DNA and crucial to the exotic car. It is literally a masterfully orchestrated explosion. Insert cave man grunt here... Volatile fuel and air combusted in anger and then harnessed thru man's mastery of machinery in a howling cacophony of exhaust and mechanical noises. In a society where everything is castrated and watered down ICE exotic cars are the last bastion of a man's man.

It's a rolling symbol of man's conquest of fire and machines. Its raw, brutal. Unadulterated. It's unapologetic. It's a fine glass of scotch with a nice piece of rare steak. It doesn't give a **** what you think about it. It is the lone battle scarred lion that leads the pack. It's the Hemmingway of cars built and raced by real men in the face of unimaginable danger.

Diametrically opposed to the ICE Ferrari is the all electric car. It is a hermetically sealed, sterile example of the latest technology. Yes, it is faster and supposedly "better" but it is IMO devoid of soul. It's the ultimate techie's car designed and meticulously assembled by engineers in lab coats and manicured hands. It's the newer, cleaner, "let's not get dirty" automotive equivalent of the man who wipes his shopping cart's handle down with sanitizer. It's safe and emotionally detached. It's a motorcycle with training wheels and a roll cage. All fine things for sedans and daily drivers but not for a Ferrari.

Is that what people want in a Ferrari now? Maybe I guess. I have seen a recent shift in owner's mentalities. You know we are in trouble when the current crop of owners worry about their car getting rained on instead of wanting to take it around the track in anger. All I know is it took one Formula E race to convince me I'll pass on all electric for sport. Some experiences are meant to be raw and visceral in a glorious, violent way with a healthy dose or risk mixed in.

 

I don't think an electric would HAVE to be devoid of soul, but it would be a very different experience. If it makes me smile and exclaim holy excrement, it's good.

 

You have to remember battery costs are going to constantly be pushed down. As someone heavily invested in Tesla I know a bit about this matter. So a decade ago we were at $300 KWH/hr for batteries and today Tesla claims to be around $125 KWH/hr for batteries and they believe the tipping point where an ICE engine isn't comparable is sub $100. So what does that mean? That means a 100 KW battery like the 100d tesla is a 100 x $125 so $12,500 for a battery that is about faster than any car you can find. Obviously you can't race the car 1000 times bc the battery will die but the bottom line is the "cost" of such a battery is not much relative to the engine out of a Ferrari Enzo. Either way these costs will continue to fall much like plasma tvs were once $10k and I just bought one for my office 50" for under $500.

The first issue is battery technology either has to evolve or this electric revolution just isn't going to happen. There just physically isn't enough lithium,cobalt,nickel,etc out there to build billions of electric car. Secondly big auto talks about switching to electric but none of them do it, you know why? They can't. Their business model doesn't support it. The way big auto makes money by building cars and selling to a franchised dealer who sells to us wont work in electric bc there isn't much to service on a car with less than 20 moving parts and then selling parts back to that franchised dealer to service those cars. Big auto makes their money on service while the franchised dealer makes their money on sales, what happens when service costs drop drastically? Big auto has to find another way to profit.....hence why the chevy bolt is just a compliance car and big auto is trying really hard not to jump into the electric game but tesla is forcing their hands. Then what about charging networks? Tesla has 8500 charging stations, how many do the rest have? 0. So how do you charge your chevy bolt on a cross country trip without supercharging stations perfectly positioned like tesla? You cant. Ferrari thats not an issue bc nobody is going cross country in their Ferrari but electric cars in general tesla has years of infrastructure rollout on all the big automakers.

The issue Ferrari will have in the future is you're going to have $35k or less cars that have the performance of today's supercars, in a straight line. Will they be as rare and beautiful? Doubtful, but the speed will be there, which worries me a bit having all these supercars in the hands of regular drivers rushing around late to work. Either way I really do believe there will always be demand for a Ferrari in the future but I believe their price points will have to drop drastically if its electrified. If they keep making engines then by all means they make the best and its worth the premium but when a tesla roadster is going to be $250k and do 0-60 in 1.9 seconds, there really isn't much more you can do to a car other than build different shapes and try to make just rolling electric pieces of art/special editions/etc. Either way I say hold onto your Ferraris from today, most will be dinosaurs one day in a digital world and that usually ends up being something special. Whoa whats that a v-12? I've never seen one or heard one, sounds cool....that will be something someone says one day after years of electric cars.

 

i kind of agree with f355. but for the 1st world.
the developing world and the 3rd world will remain in ice engines for a good long while since they have insufficient electrical infrastructure.

and you could argue that there are even parts of the usa where an all electric vehicle does not make sense.

 

i also disagree with hotshoe.
as much as i love the noise of a powerful ice motor, that is not a relevant part to the original purpose of the vehicle, and hence it will evolve.

you wax romantically about the noise factor of the ice motor, and how it is a part of the macho dna.......well the ice motor is about 120 years old, so what did man do for the previous 150k+ years he was roaming the earth trying to be manly? fast horses, fast dogs, fast camels, fast sail boats etc. and they are all relatively silent.

i know it is hard to accept but the future will come, and just pass you by.
things change; that is the only constant.

 

You guys really need not worry, Ferrari is nowhere near being able to mass produce electric cars, they're just not. Perhaps if one day soon Tesla begins selling powertrains and we have Ferraris powered by tesla but the reality is if Ferrari were to somehow open a gigafactory like tesla, which cost $5b btw, then they could begin producing batteries in scale. If they dont do that then the batteries they produce will be at prob the $300 kwh/hr level tesla was producing batteries at in 2007 for their roadster. The issue then becomes if I have an electric car why am I paying 10x the price for a Ferrari if its not even making noise like today. I really think the future for Ferrari is still engines, the electric revolution is nowhere near as close as the media would have you believe. Tesla, they're there bc they have none of the shackles of big auto, but big auto(that includes Ferrari) they have so much invested in the internal combustion engine that you can't just change course rapidly. First things first lets hear about how Ferrari would even source the necessary batteries to build electric cars bc every automaker talks and talks but nobody shows us anything.....except tesla. The other day BMW announced a tesla model 3 killer.....to be released in 2021....well ok then. Im launching a Ferrari killer in 2035 myself, prototype is in my garage right now.....

Electric cars will probably go mass market in the $150k and under segment and engines and beauty will be relegated to the uber wealthy. Either way today's engines in Ferraris will probably soar in value bc it will be more about the sound/passion/soul of the car vs the pure acceleration/lack of maintenance the electric cars afford. Me personally I'll probably buy a nice tesla p100d for my next car when my S65 lease is up and ill just put on headphones and listen to Ferrari F1 sounds on the way to work

Evolution is not bad, people need to get over it. Spending $15k to service your mid 80s testarossa is fine, but for the level of power associated with the cost to run it, these modern electric cars are AWESOME and lack almost all the pricey maintenance. Thats what is supposed to happen over time, we improve and adapt. Look at Ferrari today, 7 year warranties? Who would have seen that in 1985.

 

You need to remember that the lore of Ferrari came in an era when their cars were no where close to being fastest. That did not happen until the 430 was introduced.
The lore of Ferrari was born in the 330-365-308 eras.

Besides, if Ferrari goes all electric,there will be no transmission to play with (no flippypadles, either).

 

I think is everyone has keyed in on parts of the whole story. I don't think I know the whole story but my opinion is Ferrari is Ferrari because of one man's determined chase for racing success. That was his dream since he was a little boy. He never stopped. Never. Not even WWII stopped him- it certainly paused his plans, but it never stopped him. Race cars are fast and people like that. People also like motion. And people like winners. So Mr. Ferrari famously placed his race engines into street legal cars- often one and the same- and he made a market for very exclusive exotic cars. I also think we respond best when more and more of our senses are stimulated. Case in point- when someone opens up a Ferrari, they often will say- oh wow, look at that beautiful Italian leather, and feel it, and smell it.... more senses to be stimulated. And then there is the sound. Ask anyone to describe a race car (today at least) and likely they will move their hand from one side to the other very quickly and make a "vroom" sound. I think this goes to @HotShoe's primal energy point. As @Traveller has said in the past: sound=energy.

Electric cars do have a sound, but I don't think that sound conveys the energy being dispersed as effectively as an ICE. So the idea of some form of hybrid has an appeal there. But now you are saddled with the weight of 2 systems. It strikes my mind a bit like a smartphone with a physical keyboard. I think Tesla was right to tear off the bandaid and go with a pure EV approach, like Apple did with the original iPhone. At the time so many thought if you didn't have a physical keyboard, you would be doomed. How did that work out?

As I see it, right now, today, Ferrari would not be advised to make and sell a pure EV sports car. The sound is too tied up into the brand. However, they could begin racing in various EV series. Formula-E comes to mind, but maybe there are others of which I am unaware. So long as they achieve success in these racing series- then I think they really could sell a pure electric Ferrari.

As to the fact that EV= performance for everyone all the time. Maybe its easier to gain performance parity, but Ferrari has an extremely strong brand and in some cases they are not the absolute fastest car out there.

What Ferrari needs to do is to capture the imagination of the youth and also of course those who can afford these cars, and I think racing is the key to that. In the electric car age, I think people will still enjoy motion and will want to see who is the fastest on the track.

PS- I could also make the alternative argument that ICE are kind of like mechanical watch movements. After all, people still buy fancy watches, even though electronic watches are more accurate and more reliable. Why spend many times more (sometimes many thousands of times more!) for a mechanical watch that's a dinosaur when your Apple / Google or whatever watch could do it for less and more reliably? I think the answer is our society still prizes the artistry of watchmaking. Is it not possible people might still appreciate ICE? Maybe EV Ferraris are an addition to the lineup and not a replacement for ICE Ferraris? When I make the watch point, some make a good counter point about how watches don't pollute. That's true. No analogy is perfect. But I do think Ferrari's mastery of ICE is something we all instinctively know and appreciate. And thus, they should also achieve a mastery of the next form of propulsion.

PS #2- I would be willing to own an electric Ferrari, but not if it means giving up my ICE ones... I just love the sound too much!

 

I think the Myth and Legend of Ferrari began before that. I think it was rounding nicely into shape during the 250 era.

 

I have to disagree here. You are probably correct, but if we are looking that far into the future, will not most vehicles be autonomous? It seems that electric vehicles are just the first step into the fully automated future (They are already running autonomous EVs on race tracks). So the real question is... will Ferrari make an autonomous EV? Maybe... but I highly doubt it. This is a company that has spent decades racing around Fiorano with hundreds of expert drivers, trying to create a unique and visceral driving experience. Ferrari may be about racing success, but they are also about driving. I expect them to always focus on the driver, and that just might mean that they will continue ICE applications for the foreseeable future, or 50-100 years

 

Exactly A Ferrari engine is more like a tourbillon in an expensive watch. It's about the work involved more than the car itself. Ferraris are by no means the fastest cars on the road but you're paying for unbelievable art. The v12 engine alone is a magical piece of art that no EV will ever replicate. Speed isn't the whole equation and EV's are faster and cheaper to maintain but they just lack that soul that makes a Ferrari a Ferrari.

 

Also, horse drawn carriages are still in use and a professional, artisan restoration can easily cost more than a new car... So Ferrari values will hold, as will the enthusiasm, though possibly in a smaller niche

 

See, when I think of the plane comparison I think we are talking gliders vs. F15's. No one goes to the airshow to see gliders.

I suppose the issue is moot anyways given the fact that social disinterest will kill off Ferrari first if sweater vest doesn't run it into the ground before then. Less and less kids care about sports cars and racing than ever before. With an ever increasing population, congestion and less disposable income the future looks dark for enthusiasts. It will only be a matter of time before an exotic car is just an electric, brand focused safety bubble that thrives not on performance but the latest social media experience. I see it in my own kids already.

Thankfully I'll be dead by then or too old to give a ****.

 

I urge you to pay attention to video games like Forza and Gran Turismo and Need For Speed. Millions of kids played or play these games, and it is how I first fell in love with cars and to a lesser extent, racing. To this day, the F50 is my favorite Ferrari just because it was on the cover of Project Gotham Racing for Xbox. Now the financial barrier will be hard for my generation, but many enthusiasts will buy the less expensive beater and fix it up over time... Or in my case, they will buy a C4 corvette ZR-1 and hope for appreciation to carry me into the Ferrari market

 

I am happy to trade an appealing ICE exhaust note for an electric whine, if it also means giving up all the gallons of combustible and/or poisonous and corrosive fluids, and their attendant:
-hoses
-pipes
-clamps
-seals/o-rings
-gaskets
-valves
-servos
-radiators
-filters
-sensors
-thermostats
-ECUs
-pumps and bearings
-belts and chains and tensioners

What I want to keep is the sexy Ferrari styling (inside and out), handling and performance.

 

I think people still race and ride horses but not frequently on public streets in populated areas.

@Rob Lay I just don't see airplanes as an good analogy because cars are the largest disposable income expenditure for a few generations of Western society. That is going to change. Ride sharing, electric, etc. However, most people never owned airplanes, and thus, never developed a bond with them. For most people airplanes are more like taking public transport. It really doesn't matter if its a Boeing or Airbus or Acme subway car.

 

One thing to keep in mind also is electrical is not that good for long periods of aggressive driving on a track. That's why even with the crazy good performance of the Model S, you won't see it beating any Nurburgring records - because after a while the car will go into 'limp' mode due to heat. This is something that is a problem in Formula E as well.

So there is always going to be a ways Ferrari differentiates itself in the next paradigm. Even if it's bragging rights - which with these ultra cars is often more then half the proposition. How many times do you use your 488 10/10ths on public roads?

 

@paulchua Yes that is correct. Right now a problem for electric is when you go to quickly pull electrons out of the battery, or try to quickly put electrons into the battery. That creates heat and that creates a problem. Even the Tesla's, if you want to engage the super awesome launch mode, it requires something like 10 minutes of conditioning..

However, I think the next 20 years are going to provide us with some interesting developments in battery technology. It makes me wonder about Tesla sinking all that money into likely yesterday's technology.

 

yes true, but if we are going to compare what % of the general adult population owns/leases cars v. owns/leases airplanes, I think it will be quite a difference!

I also think there are many people who enjoy driving. I think you might be surprised. I knew I was when I just asked some friends, and to my surprise, so many enjoy driving, despite near soul crushing commutes.