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car design thread

Discussion in 'Creative Arts' started by jm2, Oct 19, 2012.

  1. jm2

    jm2 F1 World Champ
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    Old school photo of how it used to be. FoMoCo Styling/Lincoln photo. Can't be a '49 however as that would have been finished when this photo was taken.
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  3. energy88

    energy88 F1 World Champ
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  4. jm2

    jm2 F1 World Champ
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  5. Edward 96GTS

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    the el camino is a strangely popular design.
     
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  7. Qvb

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    Engineers wanting more headroom, designers saying NO!
     
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  8. jm2

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    The GM-80 Project Almost Became the First FWD Chevy Camaro and Pontiac Firebird
    BY ALEX REID | POSTED ON MAY 8, 2022
    carscoops.com


    By the late 1980s, most of GM’s fleet was front-wheel-drive, and the Chevrolet Camaro/Pontiac Firebird could have been next as shown by an early development project called the GM-80.

    Carmakers in the late 80s were eager to capitalize on the transition to newer technologies, with one of the most prominent examples being Ford’s attempt to offer the Mustang with front-wheel drive. Codenamed the ST-16, the project angered long-time Ford fans and was eventually scrapped – although it would live on as the Ford Probe.

    During development, the idea of making the third-generation Camaro/Firebird front-wheel drive instead of rear-wheel drive was floated but quickly shelved. When engineers started working on the fourth generation, however, the FWD idea returned. Under the codename GM80, General Motorslaid out a front-wheel-drive platform that it hoped would underpin the upcoming Camaro/Firebird.
    In keeping with the muscle car aspect of the Camaro, the GM80 would have to be powered by something spunky. The days of big horsepower V8 powerplants were thought to be over, due to tightening emissions regulations which choked most engines, so something else would have to be used.

    GM planned to utilize a 3.4-liter “Quad 4” V6, which in testing was able to pump out 285 horsepower. However, the brand didn’t have a transaxle that could handle that kind of power, so they were forced to detune it to 200 horses. The number was was still higher than the 185 horsepower V8 found in the 1986 Camaro, but with less torque.
    In order to regain performance, the GM80 was to be lighter than all previous generations of the Camaro/Firebird thanks to plastic panels that would bolt to a sheet metal space frame, similar to the Fiero. The panels would be cheaper to manufacture and also offer better corrosion resistance than regular steel.

    In the end, it wasn’t internal disapproval of the front-wheel-drive platform that killed the project, but testing data. GM80 failed to meet its weight targets and performed poorly in crash tests, and the development costs for the plastic body panels meant that the finished vehicle would be much higher priced than previously thought. The project was put on hold in the summer of 1985 and eventually canceled in October of the following year.

    The project was not all for naught however, the “Twin Dual Cam” 3.4-liter V6 would make its way to GM N-Body cars like the Pontiac Grand Prix and Chevrolet Beretta, and the styling of the GM80 would largely make it to production in the fourth-generation Camaro and Firebird.


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  9. jm2

    jm2 F1 World Champ
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    Exactly!
     
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  10. jm2

    jm2 F1 World Champ
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    Popular in Australia.
     
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  12. energy88

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    Holden's rock! Here is a USA/Pontiac conversion.

     
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  13. jm2

    jm2 F1 World Champ
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    Personally, never understood the appeal of the car/truck concept.
    Doesn’t do either task well IMHO.?
     
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  14. F1tommy

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  15. jm2

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    HOME TRANSPORTATION
    Why car companies still spend thousands on clay models
    Daniel Gessner


    • Since the 1930s, every car has started as a full-size clay model before being manufactured.
    • These large clay models can cost automakers hundreds of thousands of dollars.
    • We explore why, in 2022, clay modeling is still a crucial step in the design process.

    Narrator: Every automobile you've ever seen once started as a full-size carefully sculpted clay model. Constructing these models can cost automakers hundreds of thousands of dollars per vehicle. With major advancements in 3D imaging and virtual-reality technology, why are automakers still investing so much money in giant hunks of clay to design their cars?

    James Gillies: Well, typically inside a clay model, it's just usually a steel frame with your wheel hubs attached to it. On top of the steel frame, it will get blocks of foam glued to it. And then from there we'll pack 1 to 2 inches of clay on that, which will be machined, which then we start sculpting on or refining the design.

    Narrator: From there, the details vary based on how intricate of a model it is. Still, a full-size clay model may feature $20,000 worth of materials. And the hours of labor contributed by digital designers, sculptors, and milling by CNC machines add up. Depending on how many adjustments are made to the model, it can take a couple of years to finalize.

    The origins of clay modeling can be traced back to General Motors in the 1930s. Harley Earl, head of GM's styling studio, was the first to turn sketches into full-scale models using malleable clay. It changed the industry by how much it simplified and sped up the design process. Designers could now visualize shapes and forms that were difficult and time-consuming to create in steel. But in the 21st century, the age of all things digital, why is clay modeling still worth it?

    Robert Fallon: As much as you can do on a screen digitally, mathematically it's still in essence a 2D image. So at some point in the process very early on, we need the 3D image that we can see, we can touch. We can evaluate proportion. It's very difficult to evaluate proportions of a car on a screen. And the thing is, with a 3D model, you can't lie. There's no cheating. It is what it is. What you see on the tube or on the screen, it might look great, even in VR, for example, but when you mill it out, there's always a lot of surprises. For example, certain lines, on a digital model, for example, they might look sweet, but when it's milled in full size, they might hang and the proportions might look wrong. Like I said, you can't lie with 3D.

    Narrator: Clay models can also be useful for aerodynamic testing. In the wind tunnels, where engineers evaluate a car's drag, or how easily it passes through the air around it, they're the perfect time-saving tool.

    Robert: Well, ultimately, you need to lower the drag coefficient. Particularly in an electric car, the lower figure, the better, obviously, because it's more efficient. And the thing is, with the wind tunnel, it's very expensive to rent per hour. It's thousands and thousands of dollars sometimes. So we do work on a clay model in the wind tunnel so we can quickly implement changes, because time is money, basically. And although we have computer models for aerodynamics, we still need to double-check to see, to be 100% sure.

    Narrator: Perhaps most importantly, what clay models reveal that digital imaging doesn't is what the vehicle will look like in natural light. One of the crucial tests is taking it outside, where designers can see what the car will look like where it will actually be driving. It's here that they can see how the sun bounces off of its curves and whether it looks like they imagined or just plain wrong.

    This doesn't mean clay models are an ancient design method that hasn't changed. Decades ago, when the entire model had to be developed by hand, it could take weeks upon weeks to create a model to begin working with and testing. Today, with CNC machines and data-driven systems, a detailed model can be milled overnight for sculptors to begin working on. Just like the entire car industry, it's evolved to be faster.

    Jenny Ha: In our design process, too, we make many variants quickly in digital data and quickly review in VR every single week. But whenever we need a validation, we always mill it out again in clay overnight and check it again. If it needs some handwork, we do it quickly.

    Narrator: Despite how much quicker computers have made carving whole cars out, there's still an area where human modelers have the advantage: finesse. Sometimes a detail on a car's body may need to be changed as little as a millimeter. An edit like this can be tedious, but using the malleable clay allows designers to visualize and make multiple changes with real-world proportions, something a computer rendering can't compete with. Even if digital technology continues to make car design less labor-intensive, only clay models finished by human sculptors will help car companies achieve what they're aiming for.
    https://www.businessinsider.com/why-car-companies-spend-thousands-clay-models-2022-5?fbclid=IwAR3cW8FT-Ek7SkwIMpaYQ6E02wGoOmpGO9-0R6o9Lez4ZCgSiSv_2Cu4AN0
     
  16. jm2

    jm2 F1 World Champ
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    Lincolns That Never Were
    By Jim and Cheryl Farrell

    At one time each of these Lincolns was planned for production, and each of them is much different than what was actually produced. For one reason or another none of the following Lincolns made it into Lincoln showrooms—but they sure could have.

    Photos: Ford Design and The Henry Ford

    1939 Lincoln-based Mercury
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    Conventional wisdom is that Edsel Ford decided to produce a higher-priced Ford in 1939 and it was called a Mercury. Here is a photo of a car that has been identified by Ford designers and clay modelers as a 1939 Lincoln proposal designed using a Ford body and chassis—a Ford that’s dressed like a Lincoln. Was it originally meant to be a smaller Lincoln called the Mercury? Head of Ford design at the time, Bob Gregorie, disagreed, but designer Tucker Madawick and modeler Fred Hoadley believed what became the Mercury started our as this Ford dressed as a Lincoln.

    1942 Lincoln-Zephyr, Continental and Custom
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    Ford was slow to incorporate the wider look Cadillac adopted from Cord in 1941. Jack Davis, Ford’s head of sales, pleaded with Gregorie to design a more substantial looking Lincoln for 1942. He did, but according to Madawick, before the “more substantial” look was adopted in 1942, this Zephyr proposal, similar to the 1941 Lincoln design, had already been designed and was planned as the ‘42 Lincoln.

    1958 Continental Berline
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    If Continental Division had not been terminated in 1956, a new Continental called the Mark III Berline would have been in Continental showrooms in the fall of 1957 as the new ‘58 Continental Mark III. Could this car have saved Continental Division if it had been given one more year? Probably not.

    1964 Continental Mark IX
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    Elwood Engel’s proposal for the ‘61 Thunderbird became the ‘61 Continental. George Walker, head of Ford’s Styling Department, was due to retire in 1961. He wanted Engel to succeed him. He thought if Engel also designed the next (1964) Continental, it would help Engel ace out Bordinat. Because Henry Ford II was sick, Bill Ford was able to engineer Bordinat’s selection as the next head of design instead of Engel. That was the end of the Mark IX. But if Engel had become head of Ford design this car was planned as the ‘64 Lincoln.

    1976 Mark V
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    In the mid-1970s, Henry Ford II wanted to downsize all Ford products. Although this smaller Mark V was planned for introduction as the ‘76 Mark V, a Lincoln plant (Wixom) engineer determined Ford couldn’t build both the smaller Mark V and the smaller (‘77) Thunderbird without additional but very expensive equipment. That information later turned out to be incorrect, but it meant this smaller Mark V was not to be. But for one engineer’s mistake this car would have been the Mark V.

    1976 Lincoln Continental (Town Car)
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    Bordinat didn’t want to downsize Lincolns. He planned a big new Lincoln Continental for 1976. Bordinat’s bigger Continental (Town Car) had already been designed when Henry Ford II decided the next big Lincoln would be built on the downsized Panther platform. That not only delayed a new Continental (Town Car) until 1980, it meant Bordinat’s bigger Lincoln Continental went by the wayside, although a lot of its design features were incorporated in the 1980 Continental.

    1988 Continental
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    Until it was decided to build the new mid-sized Continental based on the Ford Taurus, a new Continental was then planned for 1985, and it looked a lot different. Would it have sold better that the ‘88 Continental?

    1990 Lincoln Town Car
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    The 1990 Lincoln Town Car was originally supposed to be a downsized Lincoln, and it was no longer going to be called a Town Car, Originally planned for 1990, this smaller front-wheel-drive Lincoln was to be powered by a V-6 engine. When GM downsized, more car buyers switched to the bigger Lincoln Town Cars. As a result, between 1983-85 Town Car sales skyrocketed, so Ford decided not to downsize even though the downsized Lincoln had already been designed.
     
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  17. Qvb

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    Mark V pretty cool.
    1988 Continental :eek:
     
  18. energy88

    energy88 F1 World Champ
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    The '64 Mark IX looks like a combination of a Chrysler and a Cadillac. :(

    The '88 Continental looks like it was designed by AMC.:(

    IMHO, it was probably a good thing for Ford that they got cancelled.
     
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  19. energy88

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  20. tritone

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    yaaaah....of course electric cars need those really big grilles.......and they're so aerodynamic too......:cool:
     
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  21. jm2

    jm2 F1 World Champ
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    What is that thing in front of the driver? Steering wheel?
    If you’ve ever experienced the inside of the infamous GM APV’s you can’t appreciate that distance from the driver’s eye point to the base of the windshield.
    Automotive Architecture 101.
     
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  22. energy88

    energy88 F1 World Champ
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    No problemo! The glitzy bling on that big grill is probably hundreds of ultra-efficient solar panels to help feed the beast!:eek:
     
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  23. Qvb

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  24. VigorousZX

    VigorousZX Karting

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  25. energy88

    energy88 F1 World Champ
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  26. jm2

    jm2 F1 World Champ
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    Motion. Autos, Art, Architecture - Guided Tour by Norman Foster



    Automotive art is finally getting it's due. Only took 100 yrs.
     
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