Carrera Panamericana Mexico

Discussion in 'Collectables, Literature, & Models' started by PanAm Plates, Nov 3, 2004.

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  1. PanAm Plates

    PanAm Plates Rookie

    Nov 3, 2004
    12
    Las Vegas
    Full Name:
    John
    Hello guys (and gals). I just stumbled across your site. I am very impressed. I don't have a Ferrari, but I do have a couple of Porsches. One for fun on the streets and the other is a race car. I also collect race and rally license plates. I have a couple in my collection from important Ferraris that I thought you might enjoy seeing.

    The red #20 plate is from a 340 Mexico Vignale Berlinetta driven by Luigi Chinetti in the 1952 PanAm. He finished in 3rd place behind a pair of Mercedes Gull Wings.

    The #45 plate was on a 340MM Spyder Vignale in the 1953 race. The team of Chinetti / de Portago were a DNF.

    The same car did much better the next and final year of the Panamericana race as #20 in the hands of Phil Hill with co-pilot Richie Ginther. They finished in 2nd place.

    I have done much research on these plates, cars and the race. I would enjoy hearing from others who share my passion. Any photos I have not seen would be greatly appreciated.
     
  2. FarmerDave

    FarmerDave F1 World Champ
    Consultant

    Jul 26, 2004
    14,883
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    IgnoranteWest
    Those are really cool! Do you know the history of how they came to be wherever you got them? I bet it's an interesting story. :)
     
  3. dretceterini

    dretceterini F1 Veteran

    Apr 28, 2004
    6,415
    Etceterini Land
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    Dr.Stuart Schaller
    If you want to sell them at a realistic price, PM me.

    Stu Schaller
    "dretceterini"
     
  4. SefacHotRodder

    SefacHotRodder F1 World Champ

    Dec 20, 2003
    10,914
    East Coast
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    Chris
    Thats amazing. Sweeeet
     
  5. Greg G

    Greg G F1 Rookie

    WOW - those plates are awesome (and priceless).
     
  6. PanAm Plates

    PanAm Plates Rookie

    Nov 3, 2004
    12
    Las Vegas
    Full Name:
    John
    I got both the 1952 & 53 plates from a man who rescued them in the early 60's from the trash bin in the alley behind Chinetti's dealership in New York. The 1954 plate came to me from the son of one of the mechanics who serviced the Ferrari for the race. He had many interesting stories to tell.

    Sorry they are not for sale at a realistic (or even an unrealistic) price.

    I know that Bruce McCaw owns the 340MM Spyder Vignale now. I have not been able to track the current owner of the 340 Mexico Vignale Berlinetta (chassis number 0224AT). The most recent information I have been able to find is that it was displayed at the Behring Museum 10 years ago, but they were not able to tell me anything about the owner.

    If anybody has more pictures or trivia about any of these cars, please post it on this thread. I would love to learn more about these champion Ferrari's Here are some pictures you may not have seen before.
     
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  8. vince308

    vince308 Formula 3

    May 23, 2003
    1,303
    belgium
    Full Name:
    vincent
    pictures 1952
     
  9. vince308

    vince308 Formula 3

    May 23, 2003
    1,303
    belgium
    Full Name:
    vincent
    picture 1953
     
  10. vince308

    vince308 Formula 3

    May 23, 2003
    1,303
    belgium
    Full Name:
    vincent
    pictures 1954
     
  11. vince308

    vince308 Formula 3

    May 23, 2003
    1,303
    belgium
    Full Name:
    vincent
    look at that last picture, didn't realize when posting, thats the plate on the back man !!!!

    It's really the same, and already bend in the corner, love this thread.

    greetings, vince, Belgium.
     
  12. Greg G

    Greg G F1 Rookie

    wowowow - John I almost stupidly replied ealier that you shld fix the bent up "V" plate... that is until I saw Vince's last photo and realized just how, and why it looks like that. Thank you both for sharing your collections.
     
  13. PanAm Plates

    PanAm Plates Rookie

    Nov 3, 2004
    12
    Las Vegas
    Full Name:
    John
    Ausgezeichnet! Ich verdanke Sie. That last photo of the back of the #20 car is one that I had not seen before. Thanks Vince.

    Here are shots of the 3 cars at the finish line.
     
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  15. FarmerDave

    FarmerDave F1 World Champ
    Consultant

    Jul 26, 2004
    14,883
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    IgnoranteWest
    That is soooo cool. I must admit, I had a touch of skepticism, but that #20 pic sold me!

    I think you're very smart to not sell those, even at a rediculous price if it is offered. You've got a piece of Ferrari history that even the most snobbish collector would be envious of.

    I wonder what else that guy pulled out of Chinetti's dumpster! :) LOL!
     
  16. FarmerDave

    FarmerDave F1 World Champ
    Consultant

    Jul 26, 2004
    14,883
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    IgnoranteWest
    A bit of Thursday morning trivia -

    Who can name what 1-2-3 stands for?
     
  17. borsari

    borsari Rookie

    Jan 8, 2004
    37
    IIRC it is the name of a cooking oil company
     
  18. dretceterini

    dretceterini F1 Veteran

    Apr 28, 2004
    6,415
    Etceterini Land
    Full Name:
    Dr.Stuart Schaller
    Dr.Dave Scully, who is working on a book about American drivers and American cars in the Carrera PA, has a few plates, but I do not remember what cars and what years they are from. The background colors of the plates depended on the class the car ran in, and in some years, the colors were changed.

    As to value of the Carrera PA plates, I was told the ones on McCaw's 375 are NOT real, and he had them recreated at a cost of around $7000. I do not know this for a fact.

    I have asked Dr.Scully to use the plates he has as patterns to make up some in injection molded plastic, as a "goof"....he just gave me a dirty look.. :)
     
  19. PanAm Plates

    PanAm Plates Rookie

    Nov 3, 2004
    12
    Las Vegas
    Full Name:
    John
    Is Dr. Dave Scully a member here? I would enjoy comparing notes with him or offering any help that I could.

    In 1950 all of the plates I have seen were white. In both 1951 and 1954 they were yellow. In 1952 and 1953 red plates were used. The only exception I know of was in 1953 when entries in the top class of sports cars were given white plates.

    The 197 plate was never used on a car in the PanAm race. In 1951 Bud Sennett was a DNF in car #2. This was the same 'City of Roses' Oldsmobile Rocket 88 that Hershel McGriff drove to victory the 1st year. The #65 is from a Linclon driven by Bill Voukovich.
     
  20. BigTex

    BigTex Six Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    Dec 6, 2002
    68,518
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Bubba
    Man, welcome and thanks for posting!

    I have always enjoyed reading about these great events.

    The reenactment just occured, Texas Driver sent a participant I believe.......

    Way cool plate collection!
     
  21. PanAm Plates

    PanAm Plates Rookie

    Nov 3, 2004
    12
    Las Vegas
    Full Name:
    John
    You are lucky you asked Dr. Scully and not me about making duplicates of the plates. I probably would have emphasised my dirty look with an appropriate gesture. LOL

    I have come across a few 'replica' Panamerican plates. Here are the 2 from McCaws restored car plus one from a famous Porsche. The differences from the genuine plates are clear. I have never heard anything about what the cost might have been.
     
  22. BigTex

    BigTex Six Time F1 World Champ
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    Dec 6, 2002
    68,518
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    Bubba
    Well, if they have the car, but not the plate.....whaddayagonnado????????
     
  23. dretceterini

    dretceterini F1 Veteran

    Apr 28, 2004
    6,415
    Etceterini Land
    Full Name:
    Dr.Stuart Schaller
    PM me your e-mail address and name. Dr.Dave Scully does not post here, but I will see him on Saturday AM, at a "BUBBAS" meeting...

    BUBBAS is a group of old racers and auto historians and just fans that meets the first saturday of the month for brunch at the Corral Cafe in Burbank, Ca.

    ANYONE is welcome. e-mail me at dretceterini@hotmail.com for details...
     
  24. Miura Jota

    Miura Jota F1 Rookie

    May 26, 2004
    3,606
    Toluca , Mexico
    Full Name:
    Martin
    1-2-3 was a soup-detergent brand name here in Mexico
    I assume it was a sponsor back then.
    also I think the Mexico 0224AT owner is a Brazilian collector named Carlos Monteverde not 100% sure. because I'm certain that 0228AT (the last Mexico and only Spider ) is owned by a mexican guy named Zambrano

    very interesting thread indeed.
    BTW is it true some Pink Floyd guys raced the Panamericana once?
     
  25. PanAm Plates

    PanAm Plates Rookie

    Nov 3, 2004
    12
    Las Vegas
    Full Name:
    John
    The original Carrera Panamerican race was 1st held in 1950. The last year for the race was 1954. It was stopped by the Mexican officials because to many drivers and spectators were killed.

    Since then there have been several commerative rally type events to honor the original. There are also a few other events that capitalize on a similar name such as 'La Carrera Mexico'. About 10 years ago the 'Carrera Panamericana' was reorganized and is still being run today. Only cars manufactured prior to 1954 are eligible. In 1991 Pink Floyd's David Gilmour and Nick Mason entered a vintage Jaguar and made a video about the experience. The current format of the 'race' is more of a high speed tour than the highly competitive bloodsport is was from 1950 - 1954.
     
  26. vince308

    vince308 Formula 3

    May 23, 2003
    1,303
    belgium
    Full Name:
    vincent
    Beautiful models, thanks for sharing.
     

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