Carrozzeria Sports Cars Modena - Ferraris bodied by Drogo

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by Michiel Mobiel, Jan 13, 2009.

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  1. Franco Lombardi

    Franco Lombardi Karting

    Nov 17, 2009
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    Franco Lombardi
    Yes, Walter,
    Pinin Farina made the entire coachwork for all four berlinettas A6G CS. My "blaue bengel" 1954 Turin Show car not only had a lower roof, but presented a split windshield and a much more appealing round tail treatment without the rear lights fins.
    I always though that this was the only original body made with the "low roof" and the above mentioned distinctive features...
    Franco Lombardi
     
  2. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
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    Mar 4, 2005
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    Caro Franco,
    #2089 (born as a bracket!) received a low-roof body in the late 50s by "Mimmo" Dei on special request by its owner Gianfranco Carisdeo. This body was originally fitted on chassis #2057.

    Back to Ferrari!
     
  3. thecheddar

    thecheddar Formula 3

    Jun 29, 2006
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    Forgive me for the question but I'm curious how much a Drogo re-body cost back then (~1960-65). Did Piero have a general number for getting one's road/race car re-bodied by his shop or are any invoices still extant? Alternatively, what were other coachbuilders charging back then for re-bodies?

    It helps color our understanding of the era to know if such an alteration was the cost of, say, a new house or just a very major repair. ;)
     
  4. Franco Lombardi

    Franco Lombardi Karting

    Nov 17, 2009
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    Franco Lombardi
    Walter,
    Your post 102 confuses me. 2089 was a well-known standard A6G CS spider (Fiandri?) raced in 1955/56 by Francesco Giardini. After an accident he required a new spider body at the Factory. Judging the estimate quoted by the Maserati for such a job a bit too high, he ended up negotiating with Mimmo Dei about purchasing the original berlinetta body from 2060 (originally in red with a light blue longitudinal stripe).
    Gianfranco Carisdeo, from Ancona, wrote in 1964 to the Factory mentioning having bought a Pinin Farina coupé #2089. This left Maserati a bit disconcerned as thay were not aware of such a body swap (letters available).
    While 2060, the rebodied Fantuzzi spider, was later sold in Germany to Doenhoff, 2089 - painted in white by Carisdeo - went around 1970 in the States to Boris Subbotin. Boris did a superficial restoration painting the car in dark red and 2089 (with the original berlinetta body from 2060) was also on the front cover of Road & Track. From 2000 the car is with Bill Marriott, with a recent major restoration handled by David Carte.
    Meanwhile Doenhoff (in the early '90s?) ended-up having a silver berlinetta replica body made in England on chassis 2060.
    As you should remember, the original 2057 body never lost its original two tones of blue livery and from Dei/Tenconi/Artom/Cupellini, was purchased by me, together with chassis 2070 in 1977.
    2060, the body fitted to Carisdeo's 2089 was never a "low roof", as clearly indicated by all the contemporary photos and the same could be safely be said of 2056 and 2059. Therefore only 2057 was a low roof.
    Hope all this might help.
    F.L:
     
  5. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
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    Mar 4, 2005
    7,489
    Franco ,
    we can discuss whats a low- and what a high body car.

    I saw the rebodied #2089 in person some years ago in the USA. Its clearer lower than the Panini-#2056 and #2059. Perhaps #2089 is not that low as your car but it definitely has differences in hight to the other two cars.

    Back to Ferrari now?
     
  6. Franco Lombardi

    Franco Lombardi Karting

    Nov 17, 2009
    90
    Genova
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    Franco Lombardi
    Walter,
    Yes, now that the relevant identity matter is sorted, we better get back into Drogo and Ferrari matters.
    I am very familiar with 2089 and I doubt there might be any significant difference in hights. I will ask and get real figures.
    In any case 2089 does not have the round tail and the split windshiel that characterize my car
    F.
     
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  8. wbaeumer

    wbaeumer F1 Veteran
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    Mar 4, 2005
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    Franco,

    nobody mentioned anything here about the round tail and splitter windshield - and nobody doubted your car....!

    Back to Ferrari now!
     
  9. OzItal

    OzItal Rookie

    Jul 19, 2005
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    Derek
    #108 OzItal, Feb 18, 2016
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    simsko likes this.
  10. MarkL

    MarkL Karting
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    Nov 3, 2003
    167
    #109 MarkL, Feb 19, 2016
    Last edited: Feb 19, 2016
    OzItal,
    I am very interested in the wallet.
    PM sent.
    Best,
    Mark
     
  11. Tom Roland

    Tom Roland Formula Junior

    Feb 14, 2006
    354
    My notes at Montlhéry in 1979 reads chassis 2301 and engine 3405...
     
  12. benmou

    benmou Formula Junior
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    Jan 21, 2015
    431
    will buy a vallet , please
     
  13. RCA

    RCA Rookie

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    375+ likes this.
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  15. miurasv

    miurasv F1 Veteran
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    Drogo may have built the bodies for the Ferrari P3 and P4 but he did not design them. Forghieri and his team including Jacopini designed them using the Stuttgart Wind Tunnel. Forghieri has actually said that Mr Drogo had nothing to do with the cars of the Ferrari Racing Department.

    P4 0856 was not converted to a Can Am car.

    Piper's P4 replica DP2 which is referred to as "0900" was built in the seventies after Drogo had died so nothing to do with him though it does use the front and rear clams from P4 0860 that may have been Drogo built in 1967.
     
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  16. miurasv

    miurasv F1 Veteran
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    The P3 was said to have been designed by Ferrari using the Maranello Wind Tunnel and bodies built by Sport-Auto Body Workshops in Modena and the P4 designed by Ferrari using the Stuttgart Polytechnic University Wind Tunnel. As stated in my previous post the bodies are also said to have been made by Carrozzeria Sports Cars (Drogo). Is there a connection between Carrozzeria Sports Cars (Drogo) and Sport-Auto or are they two separate companies?
     
  17. miurasv

    miurasv F1 Veteran
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    #115 miurasv, Jan 27, 2018
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2018
    Answering my own question here due to memory lapse when I wrote the above post: Carrozzeria Auto-Sport is Diena e Silingardi which has nothing to do with Carrozzeria Sports Cars (Drogo) and are not widely credited to have made P3 and P4 bodies but may well have actually done so. Can anyone confirm?
     
  18. RCA

    RCA Rookie

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    This may answer your question:
    "In the late 1950s, Franco Bacchelli started work at Carrozzeria Sports Cars in Modena, then under the control of the famous racing driver and coachbuilder Piero Drogo, where Bacchelli gained the specialist expertise he would use throughout his working life, including the use of lightweight racing materials. He also met Roberto Villa, who worked for Carrozzeria Scaglietti and was himself a specialist in the field of aluminum forming. Hence, in 1972, the pair founded their own company for the maintenance and repair of GT sports cars – Bacchelli & Villa.
    Thanks to the skills with fibres, resins and aluminium that the two men had acquired, the company Bacchelli & Villa (later to be renamed Carrozzeria Auto Sport) was entrusted with many important Ferrari models. In particular, the company specialised in transforming 512 BBs to 512 BB LMs, the ‘Le Mans’ versions requiring glassfibre bodywork in the style of the Le Mans racer – not to mention regular racing car repairs that they were asked to undertake during the motorsport season.
    Today, Carrozzeria Auto Sport is renowned for its repairs and restorations of very special Ferraris, whether spectacular classics or the latest racing and road-going models.".
    Source: https://www.classicdriver.com/en/article/cars/carrozzeria-auto-sport-fine-art-coachbuilding
    See also: http://bacchellivilla.com.
     
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  19. miurasv

    miurasv F1 Veteran
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    Thank you for your reply. Bachelli & Villa = Carrozzeria Auto Sport, not Sport-Auto and was founded in 1972 so was years after the P3 and P4 bodies were made so it was not them.
     
  20. miurasv

    miurasv F1 Veteran
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    RCA: Piper's P4 replica DP2 that you refer to as "0900" cannot be called a 1967 car as the chassis was built in the 1970s and completed around 1979 using the spare engine, gearbox and suspension from 0858 when a Can Am. Also it only uses the discarded P4 front and rear clams from P4 0860 after that too was made into a Can Am car. The centre section of the body was done by Allegretti I believe.
     
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  21. 375+

    375+ F1 Rookie
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    Diena e Silingardi are Sport Auto in Modena. They are not a carrozzeria, they do only mechanical restorations.
     
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  22. 375+

    375+ F1 Rookie
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    As reported elsewhere Carrozzeria Auto Sport has been sold. Franco Bacchelli is scheduled to be at Cavallino today.
     
  23. miurasv

    miurasv F1 Veteran
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    Thanks. So it is wrong info regarding Sport-Auto making P3 and P4 bodies. Looks like only Drogo made them then.
     
  24. miurasv

    miurasv F1 Veteran
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    #122 miurasv, Jan 27, 2018
    Last edited: Jan 27, 2018
    375+: Do or did Diena e Silingardi make chassis? I have been informed that it was Gianni Diena that gave/loaned the P4 drawings to Piper, not Enzo Ferrari. If not then they may have had the drawings to repair the cars?

    Pic Sport-Auto, 1975.

    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  25. 375+

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    Not to my knowledge. Founders Diena and Silingardi formerly worked at the Ferrari Clienti Assistenza. Diena(don't know about Silingardi) went to work for Serenissima(Count Volpi) for a time in the 1960's. Sometime after that they started Sport Auto Modena. I imagine that they were well connected with people at the factory and sub contractors who could provide access to materials.
    There are many on Fchat more familiar with the Modenese specialists than I, perhaps they could chime in?
     
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  26. miurasv

    miurasv F1 Veteran
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    Thanks for your reply. Yes, if anyone else could chime in that would be great. Just wondering what the reason was for Gianni Diena to have the factory P4 drawings in the first place?
     
  27. DWR46

    DWR46 Formula 3
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    Steve: This is no more than speculation, but in that era, lots of information and parts routinely flowed out of the factory by the "back door". If Piper was not able to get the drawings he wanted directly from factory personel, it would have been easy to contact "other" individuals in Modena and arrange to acquire what he needed.
     
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