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CC to Steel brakes 488

Discussion in 'Tracking & Driver Education' started by Farbod Farmand, Nov 28, 2020.

  1. LVP488

    LVP488 F1 Rookie

    Jan 21, 2017
    3,661
    France
    Performance difference is minimal as long as the steel brakes stay cool, but they actually overheat faster than the CCM ones - which eventually also overheat, just later.
    Then there is the price difference, which is in favour of the steel brakes because the CCM rotors last about twice the time of the steel rotors but cost about 5 times as much (and just to make things worse, the pads associated with CCM discs are also typically more expensive).
     
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  3. DougDish

    DougDish Karting
    Owner

    Jul 13, 2010
    152
    Northern NJ
    Full Name:
    Doug
    I have seen this with student cars at HPDE track events. Student paid for a brake fluid flush but it was not done. More often than not the brake fluid was not flushed with new fluid prior to the event.

    It is important to have your mechanic understand that a flush is ensuring a full Liter of new unopened brake fluid is pushed through the brake system from the reservoir to the calipers. (Removing fluid from the reservoir and simply refilling is not the same thing and not acceptable).


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  4. mdrums

    mdrums Formula Junior

    Jun 11, 2006
    965
    Tampa
    Full Name:
    Mike
    I am going to Sebring to instruct on April 24th. I plan on taking the car out for a few laps before lunch and the session after lunch. I am definitely not driving in all 5 sessions 30 min each.

    My Porsche GT3 can handle full days at Sebring but I've been warned that the Ferrari brakes will not survive. I will be very cautious with the 2 sessions I do and not do the full 30 min each session.

    I will let you all know how the car handles and how the brakes do.... wish me luck. ;-)
     
  5. lzplayer

    lzplayer Rookie

    Nov 4, 2003
    4
    How did it go mdrums? I've been tracking my 488 in FL I'm very interested in your experience.
     
  6. PasadenaF430scuderia

    Sep 9, 2012
    11
    Los Angeles
    Hi everyone,

    I picked up a 488 Spider a few weeks back and was out at Inde Motorsport Ranch in AZ over memorial day weekend (based in Los Angeles). I have been tracking a McLaren 600LT for the past 18 months and used giro discs rotors and sprint pads which were amazing. Over 16 track days and still going strong but will have to change out the pads soon, and I drive rather hard!

    Has anyone used girodiscs on their 488? I am swapping out the ceramics to these in the coming weeks before my next track day and was looking for some feedback. I know of one pista that changed out to giro discs but looking for any other feedback.

    Cheers!
     
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  8. DougDish

    DougDish Karting
    Owner

    Jul 13, 2010
    152
    Northern NJ
    Full Name:
    Doug
    I have had their product on my 458, very happy with the disc/pad combo they set me up with years ago.
    Be sure to call them (****disc) directly, they are knowledgeable and willing to help.
     
  9. mdrums

    mdrums Formula Junior

    Jun 11, 2006
    965
    Tampa
    Full Name:
    Mike
    It didn’t go.... here’s what went down...my student cancelled because he didn’t like tech check and he calls me on Friday freaking out because his shop told him he also has to replace rotors pads and do a fluid change. This guys doesn’t want to spend the money....lol yep...jeez.

    So my dog was just diagnosed with a red blood cell issue (IMHA) were his immune system is attacking his red blood cells causing him to be anemic. He was put on immune system suppression meds and wasn’t doing well... so I cancelled too. Doggy is doing better, meds reduced some and another check up in a few days....praying to God he continues to pull though.
     
  10. Frank_C

    Frank_C Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    May 29, 2004
    1,363
    El Campo, Texas
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    Frank Cavallo
    #33 Frank_C, Jun 4, 2021
    Last edited: Jun 4, 2021
    As others have stated, if you track, steel is the way to go.

    My Dot 1 GT3 RS guy wants me to go to AP Racing steel brakes- he ran those as a racer and crew chief. I currently use their fluid. He said no performance difference in the RS between the two.

    Yeah, Ferrari brakes just aren't made for tracking and the heat. If you just parade around like most, not a problem but put in competitive laps and you'll need to replace pads every weekend. My RS' pads lasted nearly 6000 track miles- COTA and MSRH. When I dropped my 812's lap times to the RS' the brand new pads lasted one weekend and melted the boots..

    Had to replace all 4 shocks in my '20 812 on its first yearly after 1200 track miles- not covered under warranty- tracking is a no no as are after market items......of course you can always put the OEMs back on for service.
     
  11. BMW.SauberF1Team

    BMW.SauberF1Team F1 World Champ

    Dec 4, 2004
    13,377
    Death Star
    Full Name:
    Doug Vader
    When you say no difference in performance do you mean in stopping power/distance/repetitive use for steel vs CCM or other measures? I'm not sure with street application, but F1 cars switched to carbon rotors to reduce unsprung weight and improve handling. The stopping performance of steel and carbon were the same.
     
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  13. Frank_C

    Frank_C Formula 3
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    May 29, 2004
    1,363
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    Full Name:
    Frank Cavallo
    #35 Frank_C, Jun 5, 2021
    Last edited: Jun 5, 2021
    Yes. My guy said stopping distance was the same in the RS. Other than a feel difference (bite) I wouldn’t have to make any driving adjustments on track. IOW there was no “sacrifice” made for the switch - we are talking about tracking our street cars here, not Challenge/Cup cars………

    From a real world perspective the actual goal in going from CCB to steel in the GT cars is to preserve the rotors for when you resell the car.

    For Ferraris it truly is a cost saving measure: whereas the Porsche brakes will last a season, the Ferraris will just make it a weekend.

    If I may quote the service guy when I had to replace my second set of pads after 6 months: “Ferrari pads will last the life of the car if you don’t track it…….”


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  14. LVP488

    LVP488 F1 Rookie

    Jan 21, 2017
    3,661
    France
    However if you compare the GT3 RS with a 812 it's not really fair - how about comparing a Pista with a Panamera and see how their respective brakes will cope with track use...
    Generally speaking, Porsche brakes are indeed better than Ferrari ones though.
    I replaced the Brembo CCM on my 488 with Surface Transform CCM rotors and Pagid pads, since we are just slowly going out of lock down I still have to see what the results will be.
     
  15. Frank_C

    Frank_C Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed Owner

    May 29, 2004
    1,363
    El Campo, Texas
    Full Name:
    Frank Cavallo
    #37 Frank_C, Jun 10, 2021 at 3:46 PM
    Last edited: Jun 10, 2021 at 3:57 PM
    Oh yes, absolutely. But the RS is closer to the 488, which is the object of this thread. Brembos while good street brakes are just not engineered for the excessive heat on track. You just never hear complaints in the garage with the GT cars’ brakes.

    But once again, going to steel and a racing mfg like AP for better track heat handling and durability (over the OEM) and not throwing away $$$ on both the expendables (pads) and the resale (rotors) is ideal. Just make sure you put the OEMs back on for the service photos…..


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