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Changes for 2008

Discussion in 'Other Racing' started by jknight, Mar 22, 2006.

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  1. jknight

    jknight F1 Veteran

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    #1 jknight, Mar 22, 2006
    The possibility of a 20-race calendar and the removal of the confusing 10-place grid penalties form some of the major changes to Formula One's sporting regulations for 2008.

    The rules were approved by the FIA's World Motor Sport Council on Wednesday and, although there are a great deal of similarities to the current regulations, there are also some major changes.

    As well as the much talked about engine freeze for three years, there is now the possibility for the F1 calendar to expand to 20 races, which suggests that the sport may well expand beyond last year's record-breaking 19 events.

    And following the huge amount of confusion caused by the 10-place penalties handed down on cars in Malaysia last weekend for engine changes, the FIA has announced an alternative punishment.

    Should an engine (or gearbox) change take place before the stipulated number of races has been completed, then cars must carry a 15 kilogram penalty.

    The FIA has also confirmed that the $48 million deposit for new teams has been dropped, and that testing will be restricted to 30,000 kilometres during a calendar year.

    The parc ferme regulations are also being expanded with cars needing to be put under the FIA's remit every night of the race meeting, rather than just the Saturday as happens presently.

    A single tyre supplier will be chosen for the 2008, 2009 and 2010 seasons, with tyre blankets being outlawed. Also banned are spare cars.

    Car manufacturers will also not be allowed to supply engines for more than two teams without the consent of the FIA.

    Carol
     
  2. Senna1994

    Senna1994 F1 World Champ

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    #2 Senna1994, Mar 22, 2006
    Thanks for the information Carol. Sounds like the FIA is trying to control things a bit too far if you ask me. Engine freeze for 3 years?
     
  3. Bab

    Bab Formula 3

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    #3 Bab, Mar 22, 2006
    You got that right! No spare cars? I don't see the logic in that one. The rest I can live with, although I'm not a supporter of limiting technological advancements
     
  4. GrigioGuy

    GrigioGuy Splenda Daddy
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    #4 GrigioGuy, Mar 22, 2006
    Other than the no spare car rule, I like the package. (I wonder if no spare car means that the extra practice drivers are gone too?)

    Dropping the bond means more teams can enter, the engine design freeze avoids having to reengineer every other season and lower costs also (I presume incremental upgrades are fine, as is engineering a new motor that meets that frozen spec if your original one is lacking).

    Single tire means that they're not pushing so close to the edge, eliminating the Michelin disasters, and makes the series a chassis/engine/driver series again.

    Get rid of electronic driver aides (traction control, rev limiters and clutchless shifting) and this will be a real racers' challenge
     
  5. RP

    RP F1 World Champ

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    #5 RP, Mar 22, 2006


    My engine has been frozen for years.
     
  6. Senna1994

    Senna1994 F1 World Champ

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    #6 Senna1994, Mar 23, 2006
    Yeah but your Avatar isn't...
     
  7. AJT

    AJT Karting

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    #7 AJT, Mar 23, 2006
    No engine development for 3 years ? Formula One is dead. Motorsports will not have a pinnacle from 2008.
     
  8. Remy Zero

    Remy Zero Two Time F1 World Champ

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    #8 Remy Zero, Mar 23, 2006
    engine freeze? does that means no development for 3 years?
     
  9. Anthony_Ferrari

    Anthony_Ferrari Formula 3

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    #9 Anthony_Ferrari, Mar 23, 2006
    I like the rule about no tyre blankets. Could make the first few laps on cold tyres interesting!
     
  10. jknight

    jknight F1 Veteran

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    #10 jknight, Mar 23, 2006
    I think you are quite right - it appears that it's not going to be the pinnacle of motorsports anymore - just another over-controlled series of mundane racing. F1 may be replaced here by the America's Cup in Valencia Spain next year along with ALMS and LeMans (it will be the 75th running in '07).

    Carol
     
  11. jknight

    jknight F1 Veteran

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    #11 jknight, Mar 23, 2006
    You're welcome Tony. I think it just keeps getting worse instead of better:

    Here's this morning's newest - (it will be interesting to what the "breakaway group" does in response to Max's edict and read the last paragraph - sorta sounds like what the teams might agree on doesn't mean a hill of beans if the "commission" doesn't like it)


    The FIA has announced that it will publish the list of entrants to the 2008 Formula One world championship as early as next month - further increasing pressure on the manufacturers to commit to next week's entry deadline.

    While FIA president Max Mosley has talked openly about his plans for the 'window of opportunity' for 2008 entries between March 24 and March 31, it was not thought likely that details of the entry list would be put into the public domain until the eve of the championship.

    However, revisions to the Sporting Regulations agreed by the FIA World Motor Sport Council on Wednesday have included the fact that the list of teams eligible to race in 2008 will be published on April 28.

    The 2008 Formula One Sporting Regulations said: "All applications will be studied by the FIA and accepted or rejected in its absolute discretion. The FIA will publish the list of cars and drivers accepted together with their race numbers on 28 April 2006, having first notified unsuccessful applicants as set out in Article 41. Out-of-time applications will be considered separately."

    This means that those teams involved in the Grand Prix Manufacturers' Association will have to make a swift decision about whether they sign up to the championship, or whether they press ahead with their breakaway plans.

    Mosley's justification for the short entry window is that the FIA needs to finalise the 2008 regulations by the end of June this year, and wants to do it in consultation with the teams who will actually be racing.

    Should the manufacturers not sign up by the entry deadline then they will be frozen out of these rules talks.

    Mosley did make it clear in a letter to the GPMA on Wednesday that the only way they could make changes to the sporting regulations was to sign up to the 2008 championship.

    "Although the 2008 Sporting Regulations are now fixed, any element could be changed on proposal of a simple majority of the entered teams sitting in the Sporting Working Group (Appendix 5) and that the Formula One Commission of World Motor Sport Council would only reject such proposal in the overall interests of the Formula One World Championship or of motor sport in general."

    The fact that the GPMA launched a last-minute bid to make changes to the Sporting Regulations, which came at 10:11pm on the night before the World Council meeting, indicates that the manufacturers are not happy with the rules as they stand at the moment.

    However, their only way of making alterations will be to sign-up to the F1 championship – and in doing so all-but end the threat of the breakaway championship.

    The FIA has created a Sporting Working Group, made up a representative from each team, to discuss changes to F1's sporting regulations.

    Like the Technical Working Group, which is involved in changes to the technical regulations, changes agreed only need a simple majority vote before they are put to the Formula One commission.

    The commission, which has been reduced to 13 members, will then only be allowed to reject or approve the proposed changes before they go to the FIA World Motor Sport Council for final approval.

    The manufacturers, in their letter to Mosley on Tuesday night, said they were not happy with the fact that the commission could veto the changes agreed by the teams.
     
  12. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    #12 tifosi12, Mar 23, 2006
    It is crunch time now for the alternate series to either stand up or go away.

    My money is on "go away with their tails between their legs".

    20 GPs, no 48mio deposit and 15kg added weight? Love it all.

    No spare cars and engine development frozen? Not a good idea.
     
  13. GrigioGuy

    GrigioGuy Splenda Daddy
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    #13 GrigioGuy, Mar 23, 2006
    Is it development, or design? The way I read it is that the design of the motor (V8, V12, whatever) can't change, but I would doubt that development and updating would be prohibited
     
  14. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    #14 tifosi12, Mar 23, 2006
    *IF* that's the case, then it is a great idea as it gives stability to the series.

    I still think the single biggest change in F1 will come from the tire monopoly. Once there is no more tire war everything else will become a much smaller problem. Testing and costs will go down (or the money spent on something else), speeds will go down, safety will become less of an issue, the contest will be a lot fairer.

    And most importantly: All the tinkering the FIA does right now in order to control speeds will stop. They will simply ask BS to mix a harder compound and the speeds will drop. It will be golden years for F1 again!
     
  15. GrigioGuy

    GrigioGuy Splenda Daddy
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    #15 GrigioGuy, Mar 23, 2006
    Lowers costs, makes privateers viable again, etc etc

    However, I think they should just define an engine size and induction type

    2 litre, naturally aspirated, build what ya want. Hi revving V24? Torquey boxer twin? Trabant-based V5? Go for it! BUT ... no traction control, and a foot operated clutch/stick tranny
     
  16. tifosi12

    tifosi12 Four Time F1 World Champ
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    #16 tifosi12, Mar 23, 2006
    Agreed on all.

    Speaking of Trabants:
    - How do you double the value of a Trabant? Fuel it up.
    - What's a Trabant with sneakers in the trunk? Sports edition
     
  17. bretm

    bretm F1 Rookie

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    #17 bretm, Mar 23, 2006
    I got the impression too that they were just saying the 2.4L V8 is here for 3 years in the two race scenario. It seems nonsensical to interpret it otherwise. "Here Renault, take the next 3 championships on us...", etc.

    It's funny though that they need to coerce teams into signing on two years in advance. I can't help but think that F1 would benefit by signing some of NASCAR's management.
     
  18. dealerjack

    dealerjack Karting
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    #18 dealerjack, Mar 23, 2006
    In an ideal world, I'd like to see this approach to the engine regs, too. However, I'd be afraid that we'd see at least one manufacturer come in with cubic bucks and totally dominate. The nice thing about the "free" formulas back in the 60's and 70's was the availability of the Cosworth DFV which allowed privateers to be competitive against manufacturers. Perhaps your proposed regs with some type of limitation on exotic materials, cylinder shapes, ECUs, etc. might work.
     
  19. kirill

    kirill Formula Junior

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    #19 kirill, Mar 23, 2006
    Than somebodys runs into a wall. Kills or injuries himself. and Moosley issues "Please be careful" order. Just to save his ass from going to jail for putting drivers in danger by banning tire warmers.
     
  20. CRG125

    CRG125 F1 Rookie

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    #20 CRG125, Mar 23, 2006
    It says no engine development for 3 years. What happens after 3 years and why 3 years? Sounds like F1 is becoming like cart, one engine supplier and one tyre supplier.
     
  21. kirill

    kirill Formula Junior

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    #21 kirill, Mar 23, 2006
    I am telling you - Moosley wants to turn F1 into special olimpics where everybody can win.
     
  22. CRG125

    CRG125 F1 Rookie

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    #22 CRG125, Mar 23, 2006

    Isn't the A1 GP series trying to do the special olympics of racing. If Mosley wants to make an Olympic series than he should go join A1. The guy gotta go! Or the manufacturers need to take action and start their break away series they been talking about for sometime.
     
  23. jssans

    jssans Formula Junior

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    #23 jssans, Mar 24, 2006
    Agreed

    WOW! These rule changes really open the tracks to more teams. I like that idea. The elite super-rich teams will still kick the crap out the new teams even if the engines tech is stagnate. I see these rule changes as compassion on behalf of F1. The current road F1 has been trying to balance is technology versus a good show. F1's current course would lead to its ultimate demise. You would end up with a few well funded and tech established racing teams so elite that no one could enter their ranks(super-aguri!). These rules also doesn't take technology off the table, just stretches it out. I like this idea because it puts more competetion on the track & out of lab(money). This allows the technology to ferment instead of being rushed to the track at break neck speed. This is the future of F1.
     

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