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Classiche Annual Inspection

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by WCH, Jun 21, 2017.

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  1. TerryG!

    TerryG! Karting

    Feb 12, 2017
    54
    south east UK
    #51 TerryG!, Jul 1, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 1, 2017
    Surely a pre-sale or pre-purchase validation of Classiche status is a more reliable way forward.

    Dependent upon time elapsed since the most recent annual check there is still the prospect that important original parts may have been substituted by inferior alternatives.

    Factory insistence on annual verification seems to me to be a profit-centred proposal.

    I understand that there are owners who substitute irreplaceable components with reproductions, in order to preserve the originals. Must such measures be reversed annually in order to qualify for factory approval? If the answer is 'yes' then I smell a 'make work scheme'.
     
  2. TerryG!

    TerryG! Karting

    Feb 12, 2017
    54
    south east UK
    "Factory insistence on annual verification seems to me to be a profit-centred proposal."

    I'd like to rephrase the above sentence from my previous post, as follows...

    Should the factory wish to offer a verification service to owners of Classiche certified vehicles, perhaps as an additional means of ensuring activities to preserve obsolete products remain viable, then that is their prerogative. Owners, the potential customers for such a service, will presumably remain free to choose whether or not and when to take up the offer.
     
  3. swift53

    swift53 F1 Rookie
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    Nov 17, 2007
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    Alberto
    Steve, thank you for the kind offer, but I do not think my Dino needs to be "Classiched",
    new verb :) , as I do not really see an immediate need for it.

    I am curious, though, how many Dino have been through the process overall?

    Regards, Alberto
     
  4. Daryl

    Daryl Formula Junior

    Nov 10, 2003
    993
    Barrington Hills, IL
    Full Name:
    Daryl Adams
    I just got my Dino back from a service visit. While the car was in the shop the Classiche subject came up and we discussed it at length. After much careful consideration I have decided to go ahead with the process.....at whatever point in time I decide to sell the car. I don't see the sense in doing it sooner unless you like spending money or wish to have a conversation piece. ( "This is my Dino. Oh, and by the way, this is my official Ferrari Factory Classiche binder!")
     
  5. miurasv

    miurasv F1 Veteran

    Nov 19, 2008
    6,347
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    Steven Robertson
    The metallurgical tests are done at the factory. Don't they repaint the parts of the frame there and then that they've removed the paint from?
     
  6. 2281GT

    2281GT Formula 3
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Oct 9, 2006
    1,121
    Germany
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    Markus
    Will this "new Rule" take effect for still certified cars ?
    My cars have got the "red book" in 2015. Do I have to let them checked every year too ?
    Or will this only take effect for certified cars after the 1st of July 2017 ?
     
  7. DWR46

    DWR46 Formula 3
    Honorary

    Jun 19, 2012
    1,075
    Steve: After much thought, both pro and con, my friend decided to begin the certification process. Due to the number of cars, the factory sent a person to us. We had to repaint the chassis areas after the inspection. The process is not complete and we are still waiting on them to let us know what cars passed and what they would require for other cars. We will NOT agree to send cars to Italy for work.
     
  8. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini F1 World Champ
    Honorary

    Mar 2, 2005
    10,524
    Some collectors prefer to not send their cars to Maranello.
    Not all metallurgical tests are done at the factory.
    250 GTO chassis #3589 GT underwent metallurgical and all other tests not at the factory but at a neutral location. Yes, removed paint has to be repainted.

    Marcel Massini
     
  9. TTR

    TTR Formula 3
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    Mar 29, 2007
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    Timo
    #59 TTR, Jul 4, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 4, 2017
    I'd be surprised if "the factory" didn't offer "for-a-fee" re-painting the areas they (are forced to?) mess up during in-house inspections. I only wonder whom they would sub-contract such service with and how much "extra" it might cost.
     
  10. Bryanp

    Bryanp F1 Rookie

    Aug 13, 2002
    3,637
    Santa Fe, NM
    I think you had it right the first time.
     
  11. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini F1 World Champ
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    Mar 2, 2005
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    #61 Marcel Massini, Jul 9, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
  12. miurasv

    miurasv F1 Veteran

    Nov 19, 2008
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    Steven Robertson
    #62 miurasv, Jul 9, 2017
    Last edited: Jul 9, 2017
    They don't seem to be up to speed on the annual inspection here in the UK. As I posted earlier I called Joe Macari in London and spoke to the Classiche Adviser who said the annual inspection hadn't been confirmed. So she couldn't give me the cost of annual inspection that I was actually calling about on behalf of a person I used to work for who is thinking of getting a Dino and a Boxer attested. Whilst discussing something else she stated a car had to be in the same colours it left the factory to get a Red Book. Hmmm.

    I called Graypaul in Nottingham to enquire about the cost of the annual inspection but nobody there seemed to know anything about it. When I eventually got through to the Classiche Adviser he said he was quite new to the job so couldn't really help. He gave me the telephone number of Tony Willis who I called but he didn't answer his mobile phone.

    I then called Maranello in Egham but the Classiche Adviser was in a meeting. I was told I'd be called back that day. I had to call back over 3 days for Chris Knight to call me back. When I asked him about the annual inspection he knew absolutely nothing about it and the cost of it. I told him that Graypaul and Maranello have a multi page spread in Classic & Sportscar in the Summer Edition where the annual inspection is actually referred to. To be fair to him he said he'd been away on a course and hadn't been informed about it so he said he would find out it about and call me back which he did. He has a very helpful attitude to his credit so top marks for that

    When he called me back he said the annual inspection is done when the car comes in to the Main Dealer that did the Classiche Attestation 12 months later for its annual service and is incorporated into that so is designed that the Classiche attested cars get serviced within the Main Dealer network. He couldn't actually give me a cost. I mentioned that many cars that get Classiche inspected/attested won't necessarily come back to a Ferrari Main Dealer for an annual service and will be maintained outside the network so I asked what happens to those cars. He didn't really have an absolute answer but advised that what he thought would happen is that those cars would be inspected at Maranello in Egham/Graypaul Nottingham and the cost of the inspection alone would be about three or four hours work so about £700 - £800 plus VAT he said.
     
  13. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini F1 World Champ
    Honorary

    Mar 2, 2005
    10,524
    I met Tony Willis last week in the UK and he verbally confirmed that there will be four (4) Classiche Centres (Officine) in Great Britain in the near future. Joe Macari's is one of them.

    Marcel Massini
     
  14. miurasv

    miurasv F1 Veteran

    Nov 19, 2008
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    Yes, I think Carrs of Exeter is the 4th Classiche Centre.
     
  15. Simon1965

    Simon1965 Karting

    Feb 8, 2011
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    Tony Willis is a great guys to speak to and work with. can't speak more highly of him
     
  16. TTR

    TTR Formula 3
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    Timo
    I wonder when will we start seeing fake "Libretto Manutenziones" in circulation, either along with cars for sale, complete with fake dates, stampings, etc or just blanks, sold separately.
    Has anyone kept track how many fake or un-accompanied "Red Books" may be out there ?
     
  17. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini F1 World Champ
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    Mar 2, 2005
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    I bought several "red books" on ebay in the past few years. Original ones. Plus a copy one as well (absolutely identical to the original one).
    One wonders why car sellers do not hand out the red book to the buyer.
    Is it simply to make an additional few $$$ ?

    Marcel Massini
     
  18. TTR

    TTR Formula 3
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    :) Why am I not surprised ?

    I wouldn't rule out the $$$s. Or perhaps some of these cars were "certified" with "borrowed" or questionable components.

    Just out of curiosity, are these eBay finds for early (i.e. vintage) or later model cars or both ?
    I understand if you wish to decline answering.
     
  19. Patrick Dixon

    Patrick Dixon Formula Junior

    Mar 27, 2012
    507
    UK
    What a complete rip-off.
     
  20. Marcel Massini

    Marcel Massini F1 World Champ
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    Mar 2, 2005
    10,524
    One a 250 GT Lusso Berlinetta Scaglietti, the other a 512 BB.

    Marcel Massini
     
  21. swift53

    swift53 F1 Rookie
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    Alberto
    Marcel, I have a friend in Italy that owns a 50,000 Euro diagnostic machine that will give you a complete metallurgical analysis of any metals in question.

    Showed me how it works on a 'Peraluman' Alfa Romeo GTA body, and the ally patches that had been 'transplanted' during the many years of hard competition, showed quite clearly in both cases, with and without paint.

    After that, our conclusion was that there is no need to be 'invasive' in the metallurgical inspection, kind of a 'CAT scan'.

    If Ferrari does not own one of these analytical tools, well...

    Regards, Alberto
     
  22. Ferri

    Ferri Formula Junior

    Dec 26, 2004
    683
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    Hugo Garritsen
    #72 Ferri, Aug 7, 2017
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    At this moment a red book for a 599 GTO is for sale on ebay.

    Regards, Hugo
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  23. miurasv

    miurasv F1 Veteran

    Nov 19, 2008
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    Steven Robertson
    Carrs Ferrari of Exeter are not an Official Classiche Centre.
     
  24. Simon1965

    Simon1965 Karting

    Feb 8, 2011
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    Simon
    I believe Dick Lovett in Swindon are now authorized
     
  25. VIZSLA

    VIZSLA Four Time F1 World Champ
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    Jan 11, 2008
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    Who'd be in the market for a red book for a car they don't own? Particularly at that price.
     

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