Considering 612, Want Advice

I've been researching them for a while but haven't bought one yet.

I wouldn't buy this car because of the mileage but only because I'd be afraid I'd never be able to get rid of it. But I think it's a pretty good deal.

 

I think that car was owned new by a member here, who put most of the miles on it. If it's the same car, I'd go for it!

 

Bob- That is a 612 for middle 575M price and matches price with another relatively high mileage car I have seen recently. Most of those miles are likely highway/freeway and easy on a car. Clutch wear on a Maranello/612 can be checked with a borescope by a good mechanic. There is a pin in a slot that can be seen inside the housing that tells you how worn the clutch is.

Beautiful color combination and you will enjoy the big V12 and its 434 ft lbs of torque. The 612s and the 575M, which shares the drivetrain, have been very reliable. I think this looks like a good deal after someone has done a PPi that confirms. Will be completely different from your F430, but will surprise you how fast it is and how well it handles. Remove the vacuum lines from the bypass valves and it sounds glorious, too.

 

The miles on it are uncharted territory for 612s also.

 

Bob- The late 575M engines (F133E) and the early (05-07) 612 engines (F133F) are virtually identical except for manifolding and ECU changes. The Sessanta/OTO had a new engine (F133H), as well as the 599 transaxle case and twin plate clutch.

The 575M/612 engines are very understressed with low piston speeds, relatively low redlines (7500 rpm), and good, soft rev limiter. Between that and the F1 software preventing the engine from being mechanically over-revved on downshifts, they are pretty much bulletproof.

 

I am not afraid of miles, as long as the rest of the car is OK. Make sure there is no rust, undue wear and tear on suspension, new brakes, new belts, etc. Make sure all seals are tight.

Then offer $75K and see. I have not seen a 612 with that many miles, but come on . . . there are lots of Mercedes and BMWs out there with a lot more miles and they work fine.

Getting a Ferrari V-12 for that price. It's a steal. But offer $75K.

 

I would spend the money and buy a lower mileage car. If you are selling in a couple of years then it's the delta you are worried about. High mileage exotics are hard to sell. I would be more worried about suspension components etc.

 

I have never bought a Ferrari with resale in mind. I bought a 355 and sold it for $5,000 more 2 years later. I bought a 360 CS and sold it for $15K less two years later. Bought an F-50 and sold it less than a year later for a big profit--unintended surprise. Barchetta--losing lots on this one.

However, the pleasure of driving makes any money spent on the car an non-thought. I bought my cars to drive and when it is time to sell, you just sell at whatever price the market brings.

If you are looking for an investment, I'd recommend leasing a S65 AMG and putting the cash difference in the bank.

 

I'm pretty sure this is the car:

http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=129873

 

Taz, do you think the HGTS sport exhaust system is louder or as loud when compared to your statement about this 2005 exhaust?


thanks
greyhair

Bob sorry to ask a side bar with Taz.

I think that 612 you are looking at is probably the best one out there with that many miles and comming from eric. I agree that most of those miles are hiway as well.

I asked my dealer about high mileage 612's, which they stated a low mileage and a 2008 and up, would not depreciate as much as a higher mileage 2005 to 2007 612 when it comes time to sale it in 2 years. They stated that with "not" having a 612 on the show-room floor to sale me. I am not sure about that statement due to $80K should be dam close to the bottom now for a 612. That is one of the reasons I started the "how long does the 612 engine last?" thread.

Happy hunting.
greyhair

 

I just looked on ebay at the 456's (the model before the 612's) and they had a 2001 with 47k miles on it and asking $69k.

Also I looked at the 575 with close to 19k miles for $89k (this car has the same engine as early 612, at least thats what Taz stated)

also the 550 (has the same engine I believe), 1998 asking $72k with 27k miles.

With that said, the 612 with the 55k miles on it does not sound to bad and is probably close to the bottom of the depreciation. However, you will probably put another 15 to 20k miles on it before trying to sale it? That means around 75k miles on the 2005 612. I would guess that 2005 612 would drop a little more, maybe around the $70k or $65k based on the other models I've mentioned above? Just a guess

Actualy that 2005 612 would be good as a keeper, but if you are like me, I never keep my cars around to long. I wish that car was close to me so I may have a look at my self . I just can not purchase a car with out looking at it in person and test driving it--------it's just me.

 

Hi Bob,

That is indeed our old car. Looks like the last owner probably traded it in for something else and it ended up on the wholesale market and was bought by the dealer now trying to sell it in San Diego.

When we had the car it didn’t have the shields. The second owner also put in the stereo system and floor mats. When we sold it there was still over 75% left on the clutch at around 43k miles. It had gotten all major services including the belts and suspenders.

When we owned the car it was sensational. We’re sorely tempted to buy it back. That color is just stunning. Only we already have another 612, and love it and are waiting to place an order on the FF.

Our current 612 has the sport exhaust system, the one you’re looking at did not. Maybe that got replaced by the second owner with a Tubi or other aftermarket system. I know he was talking about it. When we ordered the car the sport exhaust system was not yet an option, and yes, the stock exhaust on this car is considerably quieter. But it also makes a wonderful wail at high rpm, so I was always pretty happy with the car when we had it.

I can’t really help you much with the price or state of the car today. It concerns me slightly that the clutch had to be replaced after so few miles. But that could be just having been used most recently as a stop light cruiser, and a heavy right foot can eat up clutches in any car pretty quickly. I tend to steer clear of other people’s custom exhaust and stereo systems: just my own personal bias. But I also know that the stereo system was done by one of the best in the business down in SoCal, so as the ad says, it was done well and those goofy little CD holders the screen replaces used to drive me nuts.

As for price, well, it is probably at bottom. The price being asked is in the same ballpark as when we traded it in. On the other hand, drive the heck out of it, go on some long drives and even if you got nothing for it on trade, you’d be ahead of the game in my opinion. This car just begs to be driven for hours and hours.

Enough of my rambling. If you have any specific questions, send me email and I can try to answer. But I haven’t seen the car for over three years now and can’t really say much more than how much we enjoyed it when we owned it and that when we sold it, it was in wonderful condition.

 

Bob. Eric- Sounds like a better deal now that I know the clutch is new and the 5 year, 30,000 mile belt change was completed. Especially since you know how the car was treated in its early life. I believe this car was broken in correctly by Eric, and that is the most critical thing for long drivetrain life. On one of these V12s, good break-in and regular servicing make them pretty much bulletproof.

Eric answered the question on the exhaust. The sports exhaust is indeed louder, but the stock exhaust sounds fine. Pulling the vacuum lines will make it louder in the lower rev range, where most of us live, and it will sound the same (great) in the upper rev ranges where the valves would be open, at any rate. The open valves do allow more popping and burbling on downshifts during normal driving, where the valves would slam shut and cut out the burble normally.

But, like Eric, I still have the valves operational on my 575M, and it sounds fine.