Considering Withdrawing from FChat | FerrariChat

Considering Withdrawing from FChat

Discussion in 'Ferrari Discussion (not model specific)' started by Lloyd, Feb 20, 2007.

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  1. Lloyd

    Lloyd F1 Rookie

    Aug 25, 2001
    2,714
    Austin
    I am considering withdrawing from FerrariChat. Like many of us here, I enjoy this site and have invested a lot of time reading the various posts and posting a few silly posts of my own. I feel as though I have become more a part of the Ferrari community by my involvement here. This is a credit to Rob and his vision for this site. However, it appears that my investment here is very fragile and can be taken away with little provocation. This makes it hard to justify continuing to invest in a community from which I can be summarily evicted.

    I have just discovered that TexasMike has been banned from FerrariChat. Mike is a member of our local Ferrari club and I consider him a friend. He has contributed hundreds, if not thousands, of photographs for our pleasure here at FChat. In his many years as a member he invested a great deal of time here and with his over 5,000 posts he contributed to the quality and popularity of this site. In his years here he has grown, as have we all. As many of the old timers at FChat know, there was a feud which developed between various users on this site. It became an annoying distraction which compelled Rob to take action. Mike took a stand on this issue in favor of one of his friends. To put it mildly, his stand was not appreciated by some. Frankly, I thought all sides shared in the silliness that made up this feud and for the most part tried to ignore it. I thought the matter was forgotten. Apparently, it was not.

    In an innocuous thread entitled “Relocating to Texas, Dallas TX” (http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=137400) ,which I missed until today, a minor dispute arose between Rob and Mike as to the relative merits of the roads in the Ozarks and the Texas Hill Country. It was a silly dispute and like silly disputes often do, they snowballed. When Rob did not like Mike’s perceived favoritism of the Hill Country Roads, Rob told Mike to grow up and called him a snob. Mike responded by saying that he was just stating his opinion. Rob seemed disappointed at this mild response and Rob started his own thread entitled “Don't Mess with Texas!” http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=139650 ,where the inception of the thread was as follows:


    As Rob is the King here I suppose it is his right to ignore Posting Rule 1.1 “No ‘Flaming’: Please do not post any messages that harass, insult, belittle, threaten or flame another user.” It would appear that this was Rob’s real intent in creating the “Don’t mess with Texas” thread. He seems to be baiting Mike to respond in the manner in which he did. If this was one of a series of recent transgressions by Mike, I can at least understand Rob’s actions. But in the same thread Rob admits as follows:

    The tread was closed with at least a glimmer of hope that another moderator would discuss this matter with Mike and try to resolve the issue. Mike responded to a personal attack by Rob. Rob's initial attack was unwarranted, considering Mike’s responses in these threads and his activities on Fchat for over a year. When the King calls you a dip____, I guess you are supposed to sit back and take it.

    Perhaps there is more to this issue that took place in prior PM’s or in other communications. I have not talked to Mike about this matter and am not writing this on his behalf. I am writing this because; I don’t like to see a valued member of our community discarded. It leads me to believe that we are all dispensable. Such feelings do not comport with the feeling of a community, at least not a community in which I want to remain an active member. Therefore, it is my hope that cooler heads will prevail and that Mike will be welcomed back to our community.
     
  2. Kieran

    Kieran F1 Rookie

    Jul 23, 2006
    4,202
    Westchester, NY
    Full Name:
    Kieran
    I can see your point, great post. I'd never heard anything about this, and after reading into it, I feel that Rob was very harsh on TexasMike.

    I remember from watching "Schindler's List" recently a quote that went along the lines of, a ruler kills a man for stealing, but the real power the ruler has is when he pardons that man.

    I think it really applies to this situation, because Rob, you look weakened in my eyes now because of your immature actions. Is it really fair to ban someone because he called you a name back? I would love to see these other "missteps" he took.

    Rob, reconsider what you did.
     
  3. fiorano94

    fiorano94 F1 Veteran

    May 26, 2006
    6,892
    MW/NW/SE
    Rob, reconsider this.
     
  4. BWS550

    BWS550 Wants to be a mod

    Apr 1, 2002
    8,933
    NEW JERSEY
    Full Name:
    BRUCE WELLINGTON
    LLOYD

    RIGHT WITH YOU BROTHER

    I THOUGHT "CALLING NAMES OR LABELING" WAS PART OF THE FERRARI RULES..

    I GUESS "SNOB" AND "DIP****" AND 'DUMBASS" IS NOT LABELING OR NAME CALLING

    I GUESS I BETTER QUIT MY JOB AND EARN ANOTHER DEGREE IN ENGLISH TO HANG ON MY WALL...


    C,MON ROB....WE HAVE BEEN THRU ALOT OF YEARS TOGETHER HERE .ADJUST YOURSELF........


    BRUCE
     
  5. Ace503

    Ace503 Formula 3

    Feb 22, 2006
    1,492
    Full Name:
    Korben Dallas
    I have to agree, I never heard anything about this quarrel or dispute but it does seem kind of hypocritical that the founder of the site seems to have some disregard for some of the rules he set. :-/
     
  6. PhilNotHill

    PhilNotHill Two Time F1 World Champ
    Owner

    Jul 3, 2006
    27,855
    Aspen CO 81611
    Full Name:
    FelipeNotMassa
    There are ALWAYS two sides to every story.

    I am not taking sides.

    I'd like to know BOTH sides of the issues involved.

    IMHO some people take stuff way too seriously. Ferraris are fun. Racing is just a sport. It's just entertainment. Taking everything with a grain of salt is better for everyone. I try to see the humor in the post and look at it from the other's point of view. What's s/he really trying to say. Some of us are not great communicators either writing and/or listening. Clarifying the other person's position BEFORE going to nuclear war is a good practice. Try it, you'll like it.

    Let's have fun. Keep it light and impersonal. It is a hobby, not life and death.

    I am convinced that misunderstanding accounts for the vast majority of human problems. Let's be problem solvers where we can. We all have a chance to review our posts before we send them. If we do that we can make sure we are saying what we really mean. Haste makes waste and often leads to rash statements and misunderstandings. Good communication is a common courtesy we all have a right to.

    Phil Not Hill
    Life is too short not to own a Ferrari and be an F1 fan IMHO.
    Now, go take on the day.
     
  7. BT

    BT F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Mar 21, 2005
    15,291
    FL / GA
    Full Name:
    Bill Tracy
    I agree that a ban was uncalled for. Isn't a personal dislike of someone the reason the ignore button is available? Man, reading those threads makes me feel 'less good' about the owner of this site. I think most everyone would acknowledge that Mike was not in the wrong here. Bullfighter should be posting a poll any minute now...
    :D
    BT
     
  8. fiorano94

    fiorano94 F1 Veteran

    May 26, 2006
    6,892
    MW/NW/SE
    Very well said!
     
  9. Ace503

    Ace503 Formula 3

    Feb 22, 2006
    1,492
    Full Name:
    Korben Dallas
    +1
     
  10. SrfCity

    SrfCity F1 World Champ

    My guess is this same scenario has happened about a dozen times on F-chat. An instigator guy takes on Rob and gets banned. Then someone comes on in the instigator guy's defense threatening to leave F-chat with his side of the story and looking for sympathizers. In most if not all cases a banning is something that builds and is warranted and helps to maintain the quality of the site. Everyone should be required to abide by the rules however.
     
  11. Kieran

    Kieran F1 Rookie

    Jul 23, 2006
    4,202
    Westchester, NY
    Full Name:
    Kieran
    aha, but what if the instigator appears to be Rob this time?
     
  12. SrfCity

    SrfCity F1 World Champ

    "In most if not all cases a banning is something that builds and is warranted and helps to maintain the quality of the site. Everyone should be required to abide by the rules however."
     
  13. GrigioGuy

    GrigioGuy Splenda Daddy
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Nov 26, 2001
    33,092
    E ' ' '/ F
    Full Name:
    Snike Fingersmith
    That thread was split out of the original thread by the mod who is intervening between Rob and Mike. It was not started by Rob nor titled by him.

    This thread here cannot help Mike's case, and will likely disrupt whatever discussion is occurring between them.
     
  14. LetsJet

    LetsJet F1 Veteran
    Owner

    May 24, 2004
    9,334
    DC/LA/Paris/Haleiwa
    Full Name:
    Mr.
    very unfortunate..........
     
  15. JLP

    JLP Formula Junior

    Aug 18, 2006
    659
    Bay Area, Ca
    The fact is this is Rob's sandbox and he can do whatever he wants.......right or wrong.
     
  16. PAP 348

    PAP 348 Ten Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Dec 10, 2005
    100,216
    Mount Isa, Australia
    Full Name:
    Pap


    Indeed it is. :(
    I like Mike. He always posted very nice pics and seemed like an all round good guy. Hope all this gets resolved soon and Mike is back with us on Fchat. :)
    IF he wants back after this is the real question...........
     
  17. pippo

    pippo Formula 3

    Sep 25, 2005
    1,913
    FL
    Full Name:
    pippopotemus
    Maybe if yous both cerimoniously shake hands and commit to going back to being friends, not only will yous (Rob/Mike) patch it up, but you will also set an example for all of us, you know, as role models in such matters.

    Joe
     
  18. PAP 348

    PAP 348 Ten Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Dec 10, 2005
    100,216
    Mount Isa, Australia
    Full Name:
    Pap
    Going to start taking tabs on when this thread gets closed or deleted. ;);)
    Who's in......? :D

    100:1 on closure of this thread. :p
    200:1 on deletion of this thread. :p
     
  19. fiorano94

    fiorano94 F1 Veteran

    May 26, 2006
    6,892
    MW/NW/SE
    I add one to both!
     
  20. PhilNotHill

    PhilNotHill Two Time F1 World Champ
    Owner

    Jul 3, 2006
    27,855
    Aspen CO 81611
    Full Name:
    FelipeNotMassa
    Elegant Solution:

    Just don't resubscribe. You can still contribute to Fchat and will be saving some dough. Having your cake and eat it too!

    Whadya think?
     
  21. SoftwareDrone

    SoftwareDrone F1 Veteran
    Sponsor Owner

    Jan 19, 2004
    7,857
    San Jose, California
    Full Name:
    Mike
    Tell me about it!
    I cannot believe that Rob would say such a thing.
     
  22. Ferrari Rebel

    Ferrari Rebel Karting

    Dec 27, 2006
    180
    Houston, Texas
    Full Name:
    Ferrari Rebel
    After reading all of this, I'm a bit discourage to speak my mind. I'm afraid someone might misunderstand. I'm fairly new here with only a few post but I learn a considerable amount about Ferrari from all the Fchat contributors. I think this is the reason we are all here, to discuss/learn/help each other and share our passion for Ferrari. I hope all things ends well.
     
  23. rob lay

    rob lay Administrator
    Staff Member Admin Miami 2018 Owner Social Subscribed

    Dec 1, 2000
    63,954
    Southlake, TX
    Full Name:
    Rob Lay
    Geez, all of this for something a little dated and a little minor.

    I’m always disappointed in users that take public platforms against me without first talking to me one on one. Everyone has my PM, easy to find my email, even guests have access to Contact Us, and many of you know my number. Not related to this particular incident, but I ask why the need to make public statements as these, the gang mentality, and the go after Rob attitude? After 6 years of putting my passion and time into FerrariChat.com don’t I deserve better than that? You don’t have more respect for me and FerrariChat.com than that Lloyd, Kieran, BWS550, Ace503, BT, fiorano94, LetsJet, PAP 348, and SoftwareDrone? I’m very disappointed. Do I go around banning users on a whim? Do I loose my cool that often? Do I overly censor the community? Do I really make that bad of decisions that FerrariChat.com is where it is today?

    I’m human. I make mistakes. I’m a very driven, passionate, intense, analytical, and can be very deliberate in making decisions on the fly for right or wrong. Hopefully over 6 years you’ve learned I’ve made more right decisions than wrong ones and the wrong ones I’ve gone back and reviewed to learn from.

    I can tell you right now I made a mistake in how I publicly spoke to Mike in that thread. I don’t care how anyone speaks to me or what names they call me, I should hold myself above that as administrator of FerrariChat.com and be more level and cool headed. This has been a tough lesson to learn over the years as users have constantly tried to push my buttons or with alternative motives tried to get a rise out of me however they could. I’ve had many meltdowns over the years, but I think all the good longstanding members of FerrariChat.com that have grown with me as they have grown with FerrariChat.com can confirm I have improved. I actually get more concerns these days that maybe I am too thick skinned and don’t react as aggressively as I should in some situations.

    Regardless, the delay speaking with Mike is purely logistical. MarkPDX is friends and knows both of us personally, so he was acting as the intermediary and has been unavailable. Since the day after my intention was just to talk things over with Mike and then we would be over with it. Ban is not intended as permanent.

    So this shouldn’t be anyone’s concern except Mike and I. The same reason we should have kept our personal problems private is the same reason I shouldn’t be seeing some of you post on here. We’re all human and have personal problems that should be worked out personally. Please show me a history or trend of banning good users that would make other users concerned? Bad users are bad users and it is obvious who they are most of the time. Unless you are a bad user, then there is nothing to be concerned about.

    After I cooled down everything would have just been better to delete the thread, but that’s not how I operate things. I’m not for censorship or making things “pretty” even when it makes me look bad. That’s not honest and I honestly lost my cool with Mike, there shouldn’t be any problem working it out. Now you other users are another matter. :D;):D
     
  24. Kieran

    Kieran F1 Rookie

    Jul 23, 2006
    4,202
    Westchester, NY
    Full Name:
    Kieran
    Rob, I can see where you're coming from and I'm sorry I took a quick defense. To us the ban seemed really out of hand and I, along with some others I'm sure, had no clue this ran deeper than the site. You are a great person to run this site, and you can get slaughtered for some really small things due to the spotlight you're in. I guess I'm guilty of accusing you. I also was lead to believe that it was a permanent ban, so that lead to a big part of my reaction.

    So for this, I owe you an apology

    Sorry.
     
  25. Five

    Five Formula Junior

    Jun 15, 2006
    443
    Silicon Valley, CA
    Hey Rob,

    you're a real dick. hahaha.
     

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