News

Coronavirus

Discussion in 'Australia' started by Ferraridoc, Mar 21, 2020.

  1. Ferraridoc

    Ferraridoc F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Jun 20, 2012
    6,775
    Gold Coast, Aust.
    Full Name:
    Patrick
  2. greg246

    greg246 F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Jun 2, 2004
    15,643
    Sydney,Australia
    Full Name:
    Greg
    Ok, dump her.
     
  3. Steve355F1

    Steve355F1 F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Aug 26, 2011
    9,061
    Adelaide, South Aust
    Full Name:
    Steve
  4. Maranello550

    Maranello550 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Aug 25, 2011
    4,876
    HongKong
    Full Name:
    Gary
    :)
     
    greg246 likes this.
  5. greg246

    greg246 F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Jun 2, 2004
    15,643
    Sydney,Australia
    Full Name:
    Greg
    Gee, must be thousands of lurkers following this thread
     
  6. Ferraridoc

    Ferraridoc F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Jun 20, 2012
    6,775
    Gold Coast, Aust.
    Full Name:
    Patrick
  7. moretti

    moretti Four Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Lifetime Rossa

    Nov 1, 2003
    43,440
    Australia
    Full Name:
    John
    He's been eating that old bag for some time ATISWWT
     
  8. Its328

    Its328 Formula Junior

    May 31, 2017
    896
    Brisbane
    Full Name:
    Kim
  9. Maranello550

    Maranello550 F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Aug 25, 2011
    4,876
    HongKong
    Full Name:
    Gary
    Is that why she had the long face?...Poor Horse.....:)
     
    Its328 likes this.
  10. Horse

    Horse Two Time F1 World Champ
    Owner

    Dec 1, 2005
    23,513
    Brisvegas
    Full Name:
    Jon
    Hay!!


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat
     
    Maranello550 likes this.
  11. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob F1 World Champ
    Owner Consultant

    Aug 10, 2002
    17,659
    socal
  12. moretti

    moretti Four Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Lifetime Rossa

    Nov 1, 2003
    43,440
    Australia
    Full Name:
    John
  13. greg246

    greg246 F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Jun 2, 2004
    15,643
    Sydney,Australia
    Full Name:
    Greg
    Self fellatio is allowed so i don’t see a problem
     
  14. IanB

    IanB F1 World Champ
    Owner

    Jun 15, 2006
    11,898
    Sydney
    Much of the alarmist political and media discussion about the China virus focuses on our shortage of ICU ventilators, which is the reason given why we need to "flatten the curve", so hospitals can cope. We are actively destroying our economy and people's livelihoods for this strategy.

    Some years ago, there was quite some concern in respiratory health circles about what ventilators do to humans, particularly people with compromised lungs.
    Placing someone on a ventilator is dangerous, the increased pressure in the lungs causes damage that is very slow to repair. In fact, only 30% of patients survive long term, largely because they're old and weak before the acute respiratory event hits them.

    https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/8404197
    "mean survival rates were calculated to be 62 percent to ventilator weaning, 46 percent to ICU discharge, 43 percent to hospital discharge, and 30 percent to 1 year after discharge"

    You can "flatten the curve" all you like, but vulnerable people will still end up dead.
     
  15. greg246

    greg246 F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Jun 2, 2004
    15,643
    Sydney,Australia
    Full Name:
    Greg
    Patients are not put on ventilators without good reason
     
  16. kerrari

    kerrari F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Oct 22, 2004
    13,192
    Coolum Beach, AUSTRALIA
    Full Name:
    Karen H.
    Ian, so if people over a certain age are unable to breathe unassisted, which is the ultimate outcome of the flu, you suggest just leaving them to asphyxiate?
     
  17. kerrari

    kerrari F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Oct 22, 2004
    13,192
    Coolum Beach, AUSTRALIA
    Full Name:
    Karen H.
    In the “it never rains, but it pours” category, I asked for extra jobs from Braille house now that I have extra time (not going into the office, just do emergency stuff from home) and got the reply that their server has crashed and techs are waiting for parts and until that’s done, NO files can be retrieved...
     
  18. Ferraridoc

    Ferraridoc F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Jun 20, 2012
    6,775
    Gold Coast, Aust.
    Full Name:
    Patrick
    It's called "triage", Karen. It's not age, it's survivability. Older patients also have more comorbidities, and are more likely to die, regardless of any intervention. Best save resources for patients that have a better chance of survival.
     
  19. kerrari

    kerrari F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Oct 22, 2004
    13,192
    Coolum Beach, AUSTRALIA
    Full Name:
    Karen H.
    Understand that, and as Greg has pointed out earlier it would seem the Italian death figures are much higher because they’re sending people to ICU that we might not... BUT Covid is NOT just affecting old people (they may be the biggest cohort, but they’re not the only) and its likely that many younger people WILL need ventilators. As Greg said, they don’t ventilate people for fun...
     
  20. Ferraridoc

    Ferraridoc F1 Veteran
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Jun 20, 2012
    6,775
    Gold Coast, Aust.
    Full Name:
    Patrick
    Health funding, on a national level, is pretty pragmatic. It boils down to dollars spent per life saved. We've already gone way past what a normal health intervention would cost. Let's say that we lose 1,000 lives to COVID-19, but without these drastic measures, we lose 5,000. What are the measures costing the economy - $200 Billion by the time it's over? That's $40 Million per life saved. Most approvals for funding of new drugs or machines work in the thousands of dollars per life saved, maybe $100,000 tops. And don't forget, creating a national recession of such large proportion will not be without lives lost, for various reasons. You're missing the big picture, as are lots of people.
     
  21. kerrari

    kerrari F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed Owner

    Oct 22, 2004
    13,192
    Coolum Beach, AUSTRALIA
    Full Name:
    Karen H.
    No I see what you're saying, but few people in the country KNOW those figures (the $100,000 dollars and the triage conditions Greg mentioned) and if the public got wind of it, there would be a major ****storm. Mind you, I'm actually in the camp that favours heavy triage and survival of the fittest in general but I don't think Fred and Doris average are ready for that, especially once Mum or Grandma are the ones on the line. It would be interesting if the current situation could be used to move that conversation and awareness along. And where do you draw the triage line in this case where it is actually NOT just the elderly or infirm who are being hammered?
     
  22. IanB

    IanB F1 World Champ
    Owner

    Jun 15, 2006
    11,898
    Sydney
    +1

    The point of my ventilator post was that we were "sold" massive economic disruption in return for smoothing the curve. I think the equation is BS.

    I've just got off a call with a colleague who lives in Las Vegas. March is normally 100% occupancy there but right now everything is closed. It's going to take 2 to 3 years for tourists to feel confident about holidays which involve a lot of people in a confined space, so you can forget about hotel resorts for a while. That means millions of (mainly low income) people out of work in one industry alone. This is not going to be a speed bump, it's a self-inflicted depression.
     
    575 and Texas Forever like this.
  23. kena

    kena Formula 3

    May 20, 2007
    1,063
    Salt Ash
    Full Name:
    Ken Abrahams
    Can Wes do a new birth certificate for me. I really was born in 1970.
     

Share This Page