Cost per flight hour

BJ,

Please be more specific on what to include in the costs. Fuel, oil, maintenance reserves. Are you trying to get to annual budgets with crew costs, hangar, insurance, etc. MSP calculation?

Jeff

 

Westwind is a wonderful airplane-- I have around 1200 hours in them. Unfortunately, the last time I flew one was about 10 years ago, so I can't help you on the costs too much. I recall using around 1500 pounds per hour of fuel, maybe a bit less on longer trips. You should be able to find the MSP rate on the internet, so you'll be pretty close. Or just look it up with Conklin & DeDecker.

The Westwind is just about the best value out there. Carries 8 people easily, 420kts true (440 in a Westwind II), 6+00 endurance-- all for less than $1MM!

 

Does the Westwind have Garrett 731's? If so Im paying $408 per hour for both turbines for MSP Gold on 731's

 

I have heard some very good things about the Westwind, the only downside I have heard is that they need a lot of runway for takeoff, but Im not sure as I have never flown one.

 

I dont think in the real world it will be as much difference, also you have to take into account that the Westwind is a much faster plane so in the end its not that much.
It all depends on the kind of flights you want to do.

 

Don't discount the fact that a Westwind II is at least 100kts faster, has a usable lav, and as you point out seats more people. And has far more range.

That 100kts makes a big difference, especially if you are going into a 100kt headwind westbound. In the Mustang, you'll be doing 240kts while in the Westwind you'll be doing 340kts. So the cost per mile will be a bit closer than the cost per hour comparison would indicate.

They are really not in the same class, in any way. A Citation V or Ultra is a decent comparison to a Westwind.

EDIT: jgcferrari, the Westwind's runway performance is pretty good. It uses a lot of runway at high weights , but at high weights you can go 2000nm. At lower weights, I've operated Westwinds in and out of 3000 foot runways-- shorter than I would go in a Lear 35. However, it's not nearly as good on runway requirement as any of the straight wing Citations.

 

MY family use to own one for about 12 years. It was a 1979 westwind not a westwind 2. For the money it was the best plane out there. We would fly pretty much everywhere in the US. Range on it was pretty far where we made several trips to New York non stop. Our monthly cost back then( 83-95) was about 60k per month with everything, that was also including a full time pilot that was on our pay roll. Dont know cost per hour, but I am guessing something around $1,500 an hour.

 

Never heard of that happening, no. I once landed on a runway which was too narrow to turn around, and didn't have a turn-around at the end (doh-- I rolled past the parking area "saving the brakes" and because I thought there was a turnaround at the end).

The problem with the Westwind is simply that it's old. Having experienced both old and new airplanes, I'm not really sure that one is better than the other from a maintenance perspective, but newer airplanes are certainly nicer to fly. And if you have a warranty or a guaranteed parts or maintenance program, new airplanes are usually cheaper to operate-- at least until the warranty runs out.

The only airplane which comes close, IMO, is the Sabre 65. For a little more money, you get an airplane with a bigger cabin, an APU, and a bit more range. And it's faster. But it's still old.

 

Keep in mind that is only variable costs per hour. That does not include hangar, insurance, capital costs or other fixed costs. The Conklin variable costs also add in reserves for maintenance, hot sections, overhauls, etc.

 

It really all comes down to suitability for the mission. If you have someone who wants to do 1200+ mile legs frequently, they aren't going to be happy in a Mustang, regardless of the price differential. Likewise if they want to carry more than 3-4 people.

Of course, for the cost of a Mustang you could get a decent Westwind and a -10 Commander 690, put a Garmin 430/530 setup in both, along with new paint and a re-rag, and have both a 300kt low cost of operation, short field airplane for the short trips and a world-wide capable aircraft for the longer ones. Something to think about, anyway.

New avionics actually does quite a bit to lower the cost of maintenance.

 

Plus, some Sabres have "hard points"!