Crane XR700/XR3000 INSTALL (pics request) | Page 2 | FerrariChat

Crane XR700/XR3000 INSTALL (pics request)

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by thecarreaper, Sep 13, 2006.

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  1. Beta Scorpion

    Beta Scorpion Formula 3

    Jun 22, 2006
    1,379
    I suspect you mean the rotor that breaks the beam, but how a bout the rotor that distributes the spark? Its hard to know where the nibs on the underside of the cap are in relation to that rotor without cutting a hole in the cap and peeking in with the timing light to see if they line up when running.

    BTW new posts in the vintage guitar OT section
     
  2. thecarreaper

    thecarreaper F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Sep 30, 2003
    18,130
    Savannah
    ? i am afraid i dont quite understand the question. with the dizzy rotor on its shaft , you rotate the rotor( and whole engine) by pushing the car in 5th gear with the plugs out and match up the flywheel marks with the pointer. ( the manual warns to NOT REVERSE THE ENGINE) the red LED will light up at the point the window is in the right spot. by matching the flywheel marks in conjunction with the light just coming on, you know where you are firing at. it takes only a few more inches of rolling the car to set the timing for the other bank. ( both pickups are in the same dizzy)

    please remember, by splaying the optical pickups 135 degrees from each other, you are already "in the zone" and have only to fine tune the timing. i am running 7 degrees of advance, and will fine tune the timing and the carbs one the new spark plugs are in.

    sorry if this is clear as mud, let me know if i can help.
     
  3. Beta Scorpion

    Beta Scorpion Formula 3

    Jun 22, 2006
    1,379
    #28 Beta Scorpion, Sep 21, 2006
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    But if the light does not go on at the right location you have two options, move the sensor in the distributor or move the distributor. If you move the distributor, you are also moving the nibs on the underside of the distributor cap. If you move the sensor, the nibs on the underside of the distributor cap don't move. When you screw the sensor in place there is no 'set standard' for where the spark rotor will be pointing because unlike some other systems, this one does not use the original point cam. (of course you mark where the spark rotor was pointing to do a rough alignment) So depending on where you screwed in place the first sensor, the spark rotor may, or may not be still exactly aligned with the nib on the underside of the cap when the spark fires.

    You may have your's 'close enough' to run fine, like mine, however, with it not exactly lined up there is excessive ware on one side of the nib. Mine has already worn enough so I know which way to move the optical sensor to get it back in line with some trial and error. But I think a junk cap with a hole in it through which a timing light can be shone is the only way to really make shure it is lined up correctly without having to wait until it makes enough marks on the nibs to see where you are.
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  4. thecarreaper

    thecarreaper F1 World Champ
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    Sep 30, 2003
    18,130
    Savannah
    i dont see how it can be off enough to matter. once its close enough to run from the static timing, the inductive timing light will show you the advance curve for both pickups as you advance the motor from the 1500 RPM marks to 5000 rpm full adavce marks on the flywheel. if the marks are illuminated at those speeds with the light, the timing is good. the rotor is what carries the spark to the cap and thru the wires.

    if it helps, we marked the rotor position, cap ect with the PM marks lines up BEFORE WE PUT IN THE SENSORS so we would know where in the 135 degree window the sensors would be. the number 1 mark on the dizzy housing for the rotor has a red dot. that mark lines up with the cap when the rotor fires. i dont see how it could be off by enough to matter since it runs so weel in all traffic conditions. there is only so much room in there for the 2 sensors. i do agree that it may be off by a bit, but its no race car and it runs 10,000% better than it did with the points!!!

    :) i hate points !! :)


    best,

    Michael
     
  5. jfrazar

    jfrazar Karting
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    Jun 26, 2004
    223
    Savannah, GA
    Full Name:
    Joe Frazar
    Beta,

    I am the one that helped Mike with his install. All you are doing is setting the rotor phasing inside the dissy. If you look in your instruction manual for the XR700/3000's they outline how to do this. It is very important that you position the light relative to the direction of rotation.

    Simple instructions to static time the motor: 2 pickups in one dissy running 2 dissy's. When you bench build one of the dissy's try to get the pickup centered over the window with the rotor pointing to the red mark on the housing. This will be the pickup for that bank. The secound pickup needs to be 135 Deg away from the first. Make sure you have room to slide the pickups for the final adjustment on the car.

    1. Roll motor to 7 deg BTDC for Bank 1-4. (Ferrari Manual for Marks on Flywheel)
    2. Make sure that Rotor is pointing to the red mark on the Dissy. (Cap is Off)
    3. Refer to the picture in the manual (Crane) relative to your rotors direction of travel.
    4. Adjust the light pickup (Yes it is tight and you are working inside the Dissy with it on the car.) It should turn on just as it hits the window. Make sure you are on the correct side of the window relative to rotation.
    5. Tighten down the slide screw and you are done with one bank.
    6. Roll car forward in 5th gear unitl you see the 7deg mark for 5-8. The other distributor should have the rotor pointing at its red mark.
    7. Go inside the distributor and adjust the second pickup. You must use the same rotation rules for this distributor as the first.
    8. Tighten the pickup.

    This is how you phase the rotors and static time the motor. This must be done on all Crane systems. I hate to admit that when I first did mine I had the phasing off. Not much, but enough to have my system not work as well as it could.

    Hope this helps
    Joe
     
  6. thecarreaper

    thecarreaper F1 World Champ
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    Sep 30, 2003
    18,130
    Savannah
  7. Beta Scorpion

    Beta Scorpion Formula 3

    Jun 22, 2006
    1,379
    Jfrazar, thanks for you input here, and the idea of both sensors in one distributor is awesome.

    Yes, getting the timing is pretty straight forward, however, the only step above that ensures the spark rotor aligns with the nib on the underside of the cap is when you marked things BEFORE STARTING. You see, this is the crux of the problem as I cannot go back to that step because the system was already installed by someone else.

    What I thought I would try (short of getting a 'spare' cap and cutting ia hole in it) is to "wing it" based on the picture above that shows the spark rotor is pointing just ahead of the nib when the spark fires. So I just need to move the sensor a little ANTI-CLOCKWISE and the distributor body a little CLOCKWISE (until it is back in time again with any suitable timing method, ie static or dynamic)

    To check that the position of the rotor would now be correct I was going to put some putty on the rotor and put the cap on (right at the static timing point, of course) and see where the nib indents the putty on the rotor.

    As careaper pointed out this small mis-alignment that I currently have probably makes no difference in performance and I agree 100%.

    However, if I don't re-align the rotor to the nibs, and I ever feel compelled to RETARD the timing in the future (ie fossil fuel crisis or re-instating emission laws in my state) it may leave a big gap at the end of the rotor. I probably need to drive the car more and think about this less (should have never peeked under those caps in the first place). I think I have my little son's infantile sense of needing to have things aligned perfect. Just the other day he was all upset because those nice horsey emblems he and I put on the wheel centers were no longer all right side up....

    Anyway, carreaper, interested to hear how you jetting changes work out.
     

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