CraneCams XR-i Installation Notes - '79 308

Yes.
That's what I did, as it was simple enough for me to understand and do self maintenance on my daily driver.

Cryptic? I posted the entire conversion between the old and new board, . It was extensively covered with photos and wiring schematic in all of my posts retrofitting my car to Webers about a year ago. Perhaps it got lost in there. The whole process started 2 years ago with the unfortunate Millermon distributor affair for many of us on the board - not worth re-telling here. Everything is on the old board in great detail.

Adapter plate, drive dog, seal and gaskets. Everything I used (except MSD, which is optional, and a hot coil) is shown in the photos below. I dropped my car off today at Norwoods and spoke to Mike about it, and he said he'd make up as many as anyone wanted. I think the initial price was steep, but for me the final outcome of $800 or so it was worth it. The secret was the distributor is so inexpensive, reliable, simple and available - it even looks happy on the motor. I have had single bank Marelli ignition failure THREE times and each time was stranded - unacceptable for a daily driver (and then my only car). As is the concept of paying $400+ for a coil pack each time. And the concept of $500 for just two Marelli distributor caps. Et cetera. No parts stamped Ferrari were harmed or removed, just Marelli crap.

The drive dog simply replaces the rotor drive in the cam end with a push pin. The distributor base is removed by the 3 mounting bolts. The adaptor plate is held on the head by the same mounting bolts. The distributor is placed on this assembly with three hex screws. I wish I could say it's more complicated, but I'm not that clever. That's it. See picture below in previous post. The tach drive for a carb car requires a commercially available signal splitter available from engine swap shops. For Marelli Digi/Microplex, I used existing ECU to drive my tach (see below). I've also included a picture to show the MSD mounted in the trunk (a cooler place for better reliability). You can mount the distributor on the front or rear bank obviously, but I chose the rear as it is EXTREMELY easy to get to and DIY when needed (YET another photo to show how easy and out in the open the whole thing is to DIY)

Well, we've just summarized about 50 posts over a year's time from both boards. Still cryptic?
Hope this helps
best
rt
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Paul
I understand about not liking GM, as I do not as well. If it helps, Mallory is an longtime independant custom ignition manufacturer (now belongs to Mr Gasket), the Euro 308s had a single distributor from the factory, and if you say it fast Mallory sounds like Marelli. I like the line about keeping the car looking like it is supposed to - for some silly reason I just didn't think the Electromotive HPX looked right like an elegant and simple distributor on the Ferrari V-8 engine, so looks factored into my equation as well. The real inspriration came from a photo that used to be on the Magnacor wire site of a Ferrari racing V-8 with a similar conversion. I also REALLY like the way my engine looked WHEN IT WAS RUNNING.
Last I checked, the flat (or 'crab') caps were for the flathead Ford V-8 only.
Good luck
best,
rt

 

Russ, thank you for clarifing this for us. i will call Norwoods ASAP and see about getting the Mallory thingy done . i switched all my GM muscle cars over to electronic ignition, i hate points that much. having the 308's i have had, i cant "enjoy" the car, as i amalwayswondering when the ignition is going to crap out.


one more question : how does the advance set up work with the Mallory conversion? the advance weights are getting to be a problem in many 308's as they get older, and few shops can mess with then and set them up. the MALLORY swap will take care of the points issues, expensive cap and points issues and the wimpy advance weights.


thank you for the pics and the info, the crappy ignition was the number one reason i wanted to sell my GTB and get a different car, Ferrari or not. i really dont like points. my gtb has been very reliable, but i refuse to take it on long trips, becasue of the ignition system. this conversion will change that, and i could care less what the concours folks think, i dont do car shows. everything that has been done to my gtb can be reversed anyway off to work!!!!!

 

I COMPLETELY UNDERSTAND ABOUT BEING SPOOKED. It became so very annoying to worry if the car was going to make it to work every day with the Marelli system after the recurrent failures. Because of the Mallory conversion, I didn't give a thought as I hopped in the Mondial and drove 5 hours from San Antonio to Dallas yesterday. What a restful and relaxing drive!! Routine cross country in a Ferrari without a support vehicle!

Say what you want about originality, but peace of mind is a wonderful thing for those of us that DRIVE our cars as cars.

The advance weights and springs are very sturdy in this performance designed distributor and have not been a problem in the Marelli distributors that I have heard. And all are readily adjustable, available and inexpensive. Also look at the new MSD flathead flatcap distributor now that you can choose between MSD and Mallory.

Hope this helps
Russ
Scuderia Insomnia

 

Do you know how the advance weights are set when the original Mallory (that you switched to) is purchased or did you get it all from Norwoods all set up?

Thanks for the reply. I just missed the old thread. Is it on the old board? If you happen to know where could you post if for the rest of us?

Thanks

 

You can set up the advance and curve anyway you want with a $20 kit. The only gotcha is that the distributor has to go to Mallory to have the rotation direction changed, which was coordinated by Century Performance, when I ordered from them in the first place. That was 3 days and $25 extra. $25! Mallory threw in the custom curving for free since it was there. The wonderful Mallory tech people were all over this and enjoyed the project as much as I did and wanted pictures!

Norwood's just made the adapter, and I gathered the distributor and MSD separately.

The distributor thing is spread throughout the Weber threads. Would suggest just doing a search on 'Mallory distributor'.

best
rt

 

i am going to call Norwoods about the adapter. i am glad you added the fact about Mallory having to fiddle with the new dizzy. good to know!

 

Okay, more thoughts. What exactly could be so possibly wrong with a Marelli distributor that the Mallory would fix? Yes, the Marelli caps are spendy, but mine are probably 27 years old and still work fine. Outside of that, the distributor is all ball bearings, and the advance can be worked out and parts are available. Could the Marelli unit have its guts (the shaft and advance mechanism) altered or replaced with a Mallory or MSD shaft or parts thereof ? Seems like that would be easier and less expensive than cutting out an adapter or whole new distributor and all the parts to make it work. Maybe adapt a different rotor at the same time to work with the OE cap and save that expense as well?

 

I think either way works fine. I'm sure any good machine shop could retrofit the innerds just as you say. That's what Norwood's offers now I believe for $1400. Since I did not have a distributor on my car initially, this seemed the way to go. Heck, I could buy a whole new distributor for the price of one cap.
Again, either way works fine, but machine shop costs do add up. I know.
best
rt

 

One of the goals of the changes everyone looks at on their dizzy's is to get rid of the points, and costly replacement parts.

But mineworks just fine like yours. But getting the advanced checked and re-set is going to cost $100's of $$. First you've got to find someone with a machine to run them on, then the parts to rebuild them, and the knowledge to rebuild them. I talked with a guy about doing this to mine and the min. was $250 per dizzy. Look, I just paid for that Norwoods things and I can have it checked and reset by the manufacturer in a week for less than $50 in mailing and costs.

THAT is what we're looking at. A reliable and inexpensive system that we don't have to worry about killing us financially when it needs fixing.

 

Don King at Elite Auto in CA still does this. I just talked with him last week. $550 total. Resets the advance curve, cleans everything, etc. You get back one dizzy with proper advance and two pertronix units (you're old one stays in but no longer does anything but deliver the spark).

 

So when everyone says Pertronics units, am I to assume your talking the ignition unit inside the distributor, the pickup coil or light unit etc..? Then the question would be, which one is the best : MSD magnetic pickup, Mallory Unilite, Pertronics, or the crane light and shutter? And, what is the best ignition box out there cost wise that works with those pickups and allows rev control? MSD? Seems amazing that a simple set of points needs all of that to replace them, but I degress hotter spark does seem to work better, and if a side benifit is rev control, lets go.

 

If you guys are chattin abou the old crane xr700 previously allison xr700 and if anyone needs an optical pickup I have one or maybe two for free. Just email me an address and I'll put them in the post.

 

Are you going to put them both in one dizzy? Make sure you get them 135-deg out.

The two Ignitors are ~$150, that leaves just 4-6 hours of labor for him to set it all up, clean, set the advance, and check it on the machine.

Really, I think the price is quite reasonable.

But let us know how yours comes out.

 

great info......... another alternative.

 

please keep us posted if you do get yours from Summit and how long it takes to get it one .

 

great question, and as the others have said, its getting very hard to find anyone to mess with carb cars with points ignition. the local ferrari guy where i live charges almost $1000 to replace the points and set up the advance weights. plus the damn caps and rotors are so expensive. if its not broke, dont mess with it. but when it comes time to mess with the weights and the caps / points i am going to replace all of it. the crappy ignition system and high costs have been the reason i dont enjoy the car as much as i could.i have put about 1500 miles on the car sinc ei got it in october, no issues it starts and runs great. however, i dont trust it to go to say Orlando 4 hours away to visit freinds. thats where the QV and 328"s are great, you can just drive them. i still prefer carbs+ some modern upgrades.

 

How long would a set of points last firing an ignition control unit such as a MSD? We wouldnt need a condensor would we? I'm just trying to not re-invent the wheel here.

Seriously, I dont understand the fear of an ignition breakdown on a point type car at all. If the points are good with good shoes, they should last quite a while without fidling with them if they are set up right. If the advance has 27 year old grease thats turned to cement, that surely is not the cars fault, just lack of maintainance. The reality is, that its the electronic junk that cant be trusted when away from home out on the road. When your electronic pickup goes dead what will you do sitting on the side of the road, call a wrecker? At least points can be massaged back into some runnable peice with a screwdriver and a pair of pliers unless they are FUBAR, which is not very likely. Are they perfect? Not at all. Are there hotter spark systems? absolutely. But remember that hotter sparks are harder to keep contained and spark plug wires didnt grow logrithmically along with voltage. The higher the voltage, the harder it will seek a way to bypass the plug. Moisture and oil will help it do that. Yes, its finicky to monkey with and get "just right", but it has to be almost bullet proof reliable if its set up right to begin with with good parts. Its not 21st century, but what is 21st century out there we wanna drive? I bet a 63 GTO has points and they still drive the snot out of those, yes?

I probably will stay with this electronic crap for now, but I am seriously thinking of just getting some stupid points and buying a add on rev limiter and calling it good. Like Big Tex said, it probably ran pretty well when it left the factory. And along that line, I would imagine that the two sets of points in each distributor could be wired together, adjusted for correct dwell, and combined into the same thing as a dual point distributor. Don't points last longer in a dual point setup?

 

One thing I've always been told is that in addition to the old grease, et. al., one of the things that eventually will burn points is the voltage across the point gap. Using an ignition controller such as an MSD greatly reduces the voltage across the point gap, giving a much greater point life in addition to the MSD thing. This is what a Dinoplex box did using early technology, and why an MSD is such a great replacement for the Dinoplex box 'guts'.
best
rt
Insomnia Motorsports