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Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by mechaniker, Sep 29, 2019.
Marc are you awake yet?
On the road, will post later, hate typing on phones
Your Teutonic side is coming out: Verboten ;-)
But you do it anyway...
No I don't type while driving
On the feeling of not wanting to buy a house in which someone had died, all I can say is that here in the UK there is a growing trend for people wishing to die at home being allowed to do so. It is also proving cheaper in a lot of situations for the NHS (National Health Service) to provide home care rather than filling hospitable beds with people whose illness or disability can be treated or managed just as easily at home. It may get to the stage in the future that it is more than likely that the house our greatgrandchild wants to buy saw a death at some time in the past.
On that sobering note can we please get back to Ferraris.
If someone dies of natural causes, no big deal. If murdered in a brutal manner in that home, then surely a big deal?
Brian is absolutely right we should concentrate on Maranellian macchinas nevertheless I promised the very relevant anecdote of how a car can put people very ill at ease if negative memories or events are attached to it, I am back home after a day on the road so here it is.
In the mid seventies my father Jacques was President of Citroen Germany in Cologne/Porz for a few years. That is the era when Citroen had bought Maserati to ensure supply of engines for the top of the range Citroen SM and he brought Maseratis to our Bad Godesberg home for the weekends sometimes. I all of 11,12 years old became gaga over these cars after an Autobahn run in an Indy. But that is not the topic here.
One year he decided he would organize a cultural gastronomic oenological trip to France for the directors of Citroen Germany about 8 or 10 of them, somewhat rotund Gents. Dad chose the Lyon area where he came from and there was the visit of the city, castle visits nearby, wineries near Macon and so forth...and a car museum.
Le musee Malartre is your typical dusty sleeepy moldy old museum, dad probably had not been there in decades, I haven't been there since the early 80's and have no desire to go back, mediocre. But it was there, relevant so it was included in the programme....our Herren were having a grand old time with two hour lunches -if not longer- and trying great wines so they did not expect anything special from that museum visit. The were all in their mid fifties to mid sixties.
So they had served in the war.
And then, entering yet another hall, their hearts jumped in their throats. They found themselves facing Hitler's parade car.
Yep. Google Musee Malartre voiture Hitler.
It had been seized in the aftermath of WWII.
The shock was so violent bringing back all their wartime memories and stigma whatever they may be, but as intense as they were personal that one of them left for Germany the next morning without saying goodbye to the rest.
Dad was very sorry about that but in that era there wasn't the information there is today.
Juicy story as you said ! And the Panzer Mercedes is still there. Not your dad's fault !
Its a philosophical dilemma, I personally wouldn't touch/ buy/ collect anything specifically Nazi, yet I adore the 1930s Mercedes-Benz, especially the Silver Arrows and they have close links to that barbaric regime. There again the average 770K is worth $1 - 2 million yet the cars Hitler rode in are worth $5+ so I must be in the minority, personally I would be perturbed about the numbers of Jews and others who were killed because of decisions made in the back seat of one of those cars. Now if it were a race car that Caracciola won the x GP, I would have no issue. Morality is a tricky, personal thing and we each value certain traits more than others. Some of those values can be given a financial value and I am not alone in valuing cars owned by certain infamous people very lowly indeed.
Yet it is a highly personal subjective matter which depends on a person's education and sensitivity. For example I had a very unpleasant time in NYC in 1990 and had vowed not to go back there ever again (no desire or need for me to say more about it). Well a year ago I was on a work trip to Connecticut and Long island, we went to see Gullwing Motorcars in Astoria just outside Manhattan and then after that visit the driver in our party suddenly said let's go into Manhattan...that had absolutely not been planned but I could not say no so said nothing...but being there again 28 years later I felt nothing because time had moved on, water under the bridge.
Someone made the analogy of somebody having passed away violently in a house and how that would influence buying it or not: I don't think anybody would want a house in which someone was murdered. If others can actually ignore that well, good for them.
So, does this “philosophy” extend to everything those “decisions” might’ve been made in, on or with, like furniture, rooms, buildings, cities, countries, etc. or just cars and is the repulsion(?) limited to only one political doctrine/regime/time period or does it apply to any and all who do or has engaged in horrific/inhumane treatment of others, including many in more current times ?
I’d imagine there are many bought, sold, rented/leased, occupied daily around the world.
Its a tricky conversation, if I saw a Trump car/ hotel/ whatever, I wouldn't stay in it, others would love it and pay more for it because of those connections and those two value systems are neither right or wrong, its entirely personal based on perspective, philosophy and personal taste. In New Zealand, where I live, its not uncommon for a house where a murder has happened to be burned down because the local indigenous population are highly spiritual and again why not, if you believe that the dead can haunt, you wouldn't want to live there. Like all philosophical theories the element of personal belief is the key to deciding how you value that point. Sure there is the element of not knowing but if you knew and had a personal distaste towards whatever for any reason, you would value it lowly.
What caused the crash?