Dear Dino lovers: I had the sliver euro dino at Dallas Lamborghini tied up this week and had a PPI performed on it. The PPI was stopped 2.5 hours in due to a host of problems including a resounding failure of the compression test. Other highlights include rust all over the undercarriage, low quality paint finish, no books or records, spraypainted wheel wells to conceal rust, etc. If anyone wants a $70 k coupe with $40k of guaranteed headaches, then this is your car....
Gary, Let me begin by saying that we are not defending this car, but we are defending our reputation in this matter. Your salesperson recommended Norwood Autocraft for a PPI so that you could gain a third party description of the car. Since we traded for this car it has been represented as a "driver," not a concourse show car. It has been described as an older repaint and the fact that we do not have the books, tools, or records has been disclosed numberous times. We traded for the car over the phone sight unseen from Ohio. The car is in overall nice condition, but has been sitting for some time and needs a good detail, including the undercarriage. After speaking with Norwood Autocraft, we have been told that the #5 cylinder showed a compression of 115 and the remaining 5 cylinders showed compression between 140-155. Knowing this information we would strongly disagree that that qualifies as a "resounding failure of the compression test". That, as told by Norwood's to yourself and us, could very easily be due to the fact that the car has been sitting and driven very little over the past few years. Just a note, in driving the car to and from Norwood's the car actually drove quite well. We are going to drive the car for a few days and have Michael Luongo, our head Ferrari tech, do another compression test to verify the numbers. As most of you on the forum already know, by no means will we ever misrepresent a car to earn a sale; our reputation is far more important. Lamborghini Dallas
$70,000 car minus $40,000 worth of headaches = $30,000 sale price. Who will bid $30,000 for a Dino driver?
ghewson, You joined this forum today specifically to complain about a car, and by extension the dealership? That strikes me as rather petty. Jonathan and LoD are good people and have an excellent local reputation.
I have seen the car in person It is really not as bad as the first post (one post on Fchat and this is what he puts up) says it is. Yes it needs work to be a show car, no one would ever say any different and the number of Fchat people who have had Great experiences at LOD far outweigh one who is (i think) trying to pull something
Dear Dino lovers- My email was sent as a caution on that specific car so as to not spend alot of hours or money, as I did, to end up with not much to show for it. I do not believe Lamborghini Dallas knew about the larger problems with the car; I think they were as unhappy as I was to find out as I was. But if you are going to sell expensive classics, it would seem logical that you would make sure the engine was not going to cost your new customer thousands of $$$$ in the near future.....
Welcome to old Italian cars. You now have 3 posts on Ferrari chat all three have been in reference to this car. All have been negitive I don't know you. I know Jpeck and the rest of the dealership at LOD Please attempt to understand any time you are talking about something like this (especially the fashion in which you introduced yourself to the board) there are many eyes. The issues you are dealing with are not by any means unique to this vehicle and you should not be shocked by rust on a dino or any other almost 40 year old car. In short THEY ALL HAVE IT I talked to the dealership when the car came in. And I also know how they represent themselves and their invintory. The mechanic Jp taked about Mike L is one of the top Fcar wrenches in the country if there is in fact any issue beyond the seals being dryed out due to sitting for an extended peroid they will know and be very up front with anyone looking at the car. This board is a great place to learn what to look for, Might just be you should have come around and asked a few questions instead of slamming the dealership and the car.
Not so, my friend....there's a reason for the "No Warranty" stickers prevelant in such dealerships....this is an old car after all......... As are mine, by the way. They are diversions....toys......nothing more. Not investments. Not transportation. A used car, no more, no less. Make sure you can afford not only the purchase price, but also the annual maintainance that goes with light usage. To enter into the restoration or Track Use level, is double again the expense. A wise man once told me the reason Dinos are so valuable today is you have to factor in not only 25 years of scheduled maintenance, but the cost of the garage required during that period, to avoid them rusting back down into a pile of iron oxide! LOL! I think that was not far from the truth! I would second the endorsement offered above, on J. Peck's integrity and that of his dealership. Try some Marvel Mystery Oil to free up those rings, man! Most likely the cause, as Mr. Peck suggests. Poor cars........no one uses them, afraid they'll break. As I showed dear old Mom the Ferrari, last weekend.. "No, go ahead and floor it...HARD!" (She totalled out her Buick, I had to loan her the "spare".) She taught me everything I know! Bubba 1998 Texaco Grand Prix of Houston Pole Position 1998 Texaco Grand Prix of Houston Winner Racing for Children Sprint Race 1999 Texaco Grand Prix of Houston Pole Position "Try looking two - three seconds ahead, Mom"......(poor thing, it's getting harder to see out of these new cars!)
Routine maintenance on any Italian can cost thousands in itself......the enjoyment of ownership is worth it in most cases. A few miles under the Dino's belt and I will report back with the results.... Thank you all for your responses , they are very much appreciated. Lamborghini Dallas
Not that Motorcars Intl. needs vouching for in any way; but I've purchased from them in the past (parts only, thank you Jason) and must say that their service is just top notch. I can't imagine that they would ever be less than forthright. Honesty and service seems to be their philosophy, not just an advertised sales tool. In my experience they were extremely up front about the condition of the parts etc. Probably undercharged for packaging and shipping. It was a ten pound wheel in a twenty pound Speedline box. I'm just a guy up in Canada and they treated me with the same courtesy as someone that purchases and services with them locally. Best of luck in your Dino pursuit. Steve
I sold one car to Motorcars International and almost bought another one from them. Another individual I know of has made several purchases from them. All have been very positive experiences. You would be hard pressed to find better people to deal with when buying an exotic car.
So do you think you will be able to find a Dino for $70k or under that doesn't need any work? I don't think so.
oddly enough, i happened to look at this dino today, prior to knowinh what was going on here on f-chat. i have emailed jonathon several times over the last several weeks regarding the car. he never represented the car as anything other than a nice driver. i actually was trying to buy the car from the previous owner before it was sold to lamborghini of dallas, but i couldn't come to terms on the price that was being asked. once again, when i finally showed up today, after several missed viewings, jonathon was upfront about the car and what had happened at norwoods. there is no doubt in my mind that this was unexpected. here are my thoughts after viewing this car. i would agree with jonathon, this car is a nice driver. it isn't a show car. it is 34 years old and looks good for the age. looking under the car as it sat on the showroom floor, i didn't see ANY undercarriage rust, that isn't to say that it isn't there, i just couldn't see it from that angle if it is. i looked over the coachwork of the car. the typical areas did not appear to have any rust. i didn't check with a magnet, but they appeared to be solid. the reference to the spray paint over rust in the wheel wells is something i can't address. i saw nothing that looked like this. the paint finish looks typical, if not good for it's age. i am sure it can be buffed and the car would show better. the books and records were never an issue for me, as the car was clearly represnted as not having them (a very common thing for a 30 year old car). the interior has had parts redone in nice materials but not completey accurate, but it is presentable. i am not certain about the statement of a $40k headache. if you were to put this car to like-new (ie-going to show) condition, this is not the car for you. if you were going to drive and enjoy the car, it maybe. i didn't evaluate the operational aspects of the car, so i can't say anything. i know that the engine should show compression in the 135-140 range. for a car that hasn't been driven very much or hasn't been rebuilt in the recent past, i am honestly surprised the other cylinders did as well as they did. i think your assessment of the car is not a fair one as you stopped the ppi. when buying any car like this, you need to understand it will need things. to be honest, i felt the interior wasn't as i would like it. it is up to the buyer to determine what he wants and buy accordingly.
I think that this type of information is an important part of FChat and ghewson is to be commended for sharing his findings. As he says, the aim is to leverage his time and money spent on a PPI to let people know the true condition of this car. Whether other buyers conclude that it is worth buying is up to them, but at least they have more to start with in their decision process.
After reading the posts, I am mystified that people are so defensive about the dealership, considering I never mentioned anything negative about them at all. In fact, I dealt exclusivley with John Hrad, and he was a nice guy to do business with. My problem lies in the fact that a car was described on Ebay in a certain manner; "comes from a private collection" was kept by a "fussy older gentleman" in a "climate controlled garage" and you do the PPI and you end up with a litany of issues that say otherwise and of course the compression. If I were selling a showroom of million dollar cars to high-profile people, I would probably do an inspection before sale of the major things to ensure your customers are happy. As far as the PPI, Norwood stopped the PPI, not myself, when they discovered the compression deficiency. I was on an airplane and picked up the message. The next morning, after reading a 5 minute list of smaller issues and talking about the implications of the compression problem (Norwood said the engine would very likely need rebuilding), I called the head service tech at Ferrari of Beverly Hills to get a second opinion. He concurred that it would probably need to be rebuilt; a full rebuild costing minimum $15k and possibly into the $20's with a 2-3 month downtime. So relying on Norwood and Ferrari of Beverly Hills as people that might know a thing or two about Ferrari's, I decided that this car was not close to what I had imagined. I thought it would be helpful to those in the Dino market to benefit from my expenses of time, energy, and $$$ in regards to the Dino that was owned by a "fussy older gentleman" and kept in the "climate controlled garage".....I guess some are fussier than others and like the engines to work, and some climate-controller garages have alot more salt on the ground than others....
I am basically a lurker but thought I would add my 2 cents. I think the sharing of information is the basic benefit of forums and people should not loose sight of that fact. As long as everyone realizes that we are each entitled to our opinions the forum is a great vehicle for discussion and the exchange of information.
When we as a community are treated well by a company and they become not only perveyers of our dreams but our friends. I think you would back your friends too. You came here talking smack about a car and the way it was represented by the dealer... This is most likely not true because many of us have dealt with that dealership and they are among the top and few honest dealers around. (there are others) I would seriously question the motives of any FIRST TIME poster who starts a thread claiming things you did. Norwoods is one of the best places to PPI a car and If I know LOD they probably recomended them to you. Have you seen the car in person? I also Know Norwoods and Mike and James are members here on the board. Wanna ask if that statement is factual or "A gross Misrepresentation" not by the dealer but by the "buyer" Now let me get this one, your second opinion has never seen the car.... I don't know if you have ever seen the car..... the people on the board here who have seen the car seem to have a different opinion of what is reality. Now think again Why are we defensive of our friends
I believe the issue most probably have is the title of the thread, and the various negative implications of "If anyone wants a $70 k coupe with $40k of guaranteed headaches, then this is your car...." To me, this implied that LoD is a <blanky> dealership that sells overpriced <blanky> cars. Having bought my own car from Jpeck during his pre-LoD days, I know that's not how he does business. The reactions of others also show they picked up the same vibe from the post. Tone and body language don't come across in an internet posting, so perhaps you didn't mean what everyone else here read.
With that said, I think that the asking price for this car reflects the fact that it will need some work. If you think you are going to find a really nice car with no issues in that price range I think you will be looking for some time.
That is very interesting, especially since that is not quoted from our Ebay ad. "Comes from a private collection" is the only statement from above that is mentioned in our advertising of the car on Ebay. The rest of the quotes come from the previous owner's advertising of the car......
So we're hearing a lot of debate but nobody has stepped up to the plate with a $30,000 offer for a Dino driver needing some work?
i am a willing and able buyer for a dino that needs some work at $30k. it all depends on what typeo fwork it needs. i will also say that this car isn't a $30k car even considering the "work" it needs.
