Daytona #14273 - Is there life after death? | Page 4 | FerrariChat

Daytona #14273 - Is there life after death?

Discussion in 'Vintage (thru 365 GTC4)' started by gtospoons, Jan 20, 2012.

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  1. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

    Nov 20, 2002
    17,673
    Tauranga, NZ
    Full Name:
    Pete
    Agree, but man made it originally so somebody can fix it.

    Pete
     
  2. John Se

    John Se Karting

    Mar 15, 2005
    205
    Scottsdañe
    Badly Repaired in what way? If it was returned to square and plumb and with damaged tubes repaired or replaced that would be normal post crash repair.
     
  3. matumorales

    matumorales Formula Junior

    Jun 8, 2011
    470
    Asunción, Paraguay
    Full Name:
    Daniel Morales
    I believe what he means by "badly repaired" relates to the fact that when someone sends a car to be repaired, he expects the outcome to be a safe vehicle, at least, and in the case of a crash repair, for the car to look like it wasn't evidently involved in an accident (of course, if you "dig up" most crash repaired cars, you'll eventually notice some signs that the car was repaired at some point, but those would be minimal).

    In this case, the right tubes weren't used for the frame; nobody knows wether this units are rated for the application they've been used and, to worsen things up, the technique applied (butt-weld) does compromise the frame's performance, increasing the chances of a negative outcome eventually, in the form of an accident due to this key element failing. That tube must be replaced a whole unit, or at least a reinforcement plate should be welded to the joint in order to make this union stronger (that of course will compromise the looks of the undercarriage). I do realize that the original spec tubes are available for sale, so I guess that would be the way to go.

    The car is beautiful... please don't be discouraged by this "bump in the road", my friend. Just keep the eye on the prize and go for it!
     
  4. gtospoons

    gtospoons Karting

    Jun 16, 2011
    105
    Suffolk, UK
    Full Name:
    Chris Withers
    Matumorales is correct. I suggest you read the posts numbered 43 onwards which answer your question about how the car was badly repaired.
    Chris
     
  5. John Se

    John Se Karting

    Mar 15, 2005
    205
    Scottsdañe
    Hi and thanks for responding, I was just curious what sort of contract and repair specifications you established with the shop doing the work.

    Did you establish any written requirements or define the acceptable quality and originality standard you expected them to meet?
     
  6. gtospoons

    gtospoons Karting

    Jun 16, 2011
    105
    Suffolk, UK
    Full Name:
    Chris Withers
    Would you not automatically expect an honest Ferrari Specialist to produce a good result? Not Concours, not perfect in every way, just good. After all it is a classic Ferrari that we are talking about here. Originality was discussed and understood to be paramount. I was told, by the MD., to leave it to the experts!
     
  7. John Se

    John Se Karting

    Mar 15, 2005
    205
    Scottsdañe
    I feel your Pain, I would expect more also.

    My own experience is often the words of thin air from Management (who dont use tools) means little to the man who does pick up the tools.

    Likely that the persons executing the work thought it was all "good enough for a crashed daytona" as did the management.

    Maybe they were trying to save you money?

    I hate it when people try to save me money.

    You should have been presented with the options along the way.
     
  8. gtospoons

    gtospoons Karting

    Jun 16, 2011
    105
    Suffolk, UK
    Full Name:
    Chris Withers
    John,
    Point 1. They quoted for the job and I paid up front. There was no secondary thought of saving me money. They messed up big time. All they wanted was my cash and bugger the job! Maybe they had a cash flow problem and saw me as their saviour.

    Point 2. It does not cost more to do a job properly. It just takes care and ability, neither of which do they have!

    Point 3. "Good enough for a crashed Daytona". You clearly don't understand what a Ferrari Daytona means to me and other people.
    Chris
     
  9. John Se

    John Se Karting

    Mar 15, 2005
    205
    Scottsdañe
    Sorry, I am not insulting you or your daytona, just sharing what some people's attitudes are when working on old used cars.

    Seems like the guys who did the work "clearly don't understand what a Ferrari Daytona means to me and other people."
     
  10. gtospoons

    gtospoons Karting

    Jun 16, 2011
    105
    Suffolk, UK
    Full Name:
    Chris Withers
    I'm not insulted but surprised that anyone could think that they might have been doing me a favour. I understand your comments about some mechanics working on some old cars but this is a Ferrari and all old Ferraris are historically important.

    I agree with your second comment.
    Chris
     
  11. matumorales

    matumorales Formula Junior

    Jun 8, 2011
    470
    Asunción, Paraguay
    Full Name:
    Daniel Morales
    Hello, Chris!

    So, what will be your next step with the project? Have you already found someone to to make it right?
     
  12. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

    Nov 20, 2002
    17,673
    Tauranga, NZ
    Full Name:
    Pete
    In the end you just need to move forward. Get the car OUT of that place that have not enough knowledge of a Daytona, and get the car done/finished.

    I would plate and/or reinforce where they have butt welded the chassis and that simply becomes part of the cars story ... no different to the fact that the accident that caused all the damage is all part of that story and makes the car interesting. There is a 250GT or 330 that has had it's chassis repaired like this and that is simply now part of it's history ... no body laughs at it.

    My concern though is what they have done to all the framing around the engine bay ... is that all correct?

    But this car can be finished, it's all just metal, rubber and plastic :).
    Pete
     
  13. matumorales

    matumorales Formula Junior

    Jun 8, 2011
    470
    Asunción, Paraguay
    Full Name:
    Daniel Morales
    My thoughts exactly! Go for it, Chris!!!
     
  14. DaytonaKP

    DaytonaKP Karting

    Sep 6, 2007
    104
    West Sussex
    Full Name:
    KP
    Is there any intention to name and shame the idiots who have robbed you of a considerable amount of money in return for a complete and utter shambles of a job? I certainly want to be sure I do not find myself at this bucket shop any time in the near future (ever!). KP.
     
  15. Tojo

    Tojo Formula Junior

    Apr 12, 2002
    481
    Sydney
    Full Name:
    Tim
    Just read through your saga. I hope it all comes good for you in the end. Just out of curiosity, the shop that did the repairs, was it Mototechnique?
     
  16. gtospoons

    gtospoons Karting

    Jun 16, 2011
    105
    Suffolk, UK
    Full Name:
    Chris Withers
    I couldn't possibly comment
     
  17. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

    Nov 20, 2002
    17,673
    Tauranga, NZ
    Full Name:
    Pete
    Surely not. Heck they really are Ferrari specialists and have done old cars before ??????
    Pete
     
  18. Patrick Dixon

    Patrick Dixon Formula 3

    Mar 27, 2012
    1,083
    UK
    Gosh that is shocking.
     
  19. PSk

    PSk F1 World Champ

    Nov 20, 2002
    17,673
    Tauranga, NZ
    Full Name:
    Pete
    That does not make sense. They have worked on Daytona's before (according to their site) thus they would know about the bonnet, etc. Doesn't add up ...

    Pete
     
  20. Daytonafan

    Daytonafan F1 Rookie

    Oct 18, 2003
    2,748
    Surrey, England
    Full Name:
    Matthew
    Way back in 1985 Moto Technique did a bare metal respray and remedial body repairs on my Daytona. I have to say the quality of work was exemplary and the car still wears the same paint today. Very few people believe the paint is that old.

    I have no knowledge of the quailty and standard of their more recent work.

    I am slightly confused reading back through this thread as MT (assuming as is implied that it is MT we are taking about) has a reputation for being very expensive. I doubt they would quote only £30K plus materials for a work of this magnitude or was the actual quote much higher and that was only a deposit?
     
  21. gtospoons

    gtospoons Karting

    Jun 16, 2011
    105
    Suffolk, UK
    Full Name:
    Chris Withers
    I gave my repairer new Scaglietti front and rear clips, new roof, new inner support frames, new bonnet frame and new bonnet skin, worth some £60,000 today and all now ruined.

    It seems obvious now that just because a repairer can paint well it doesn't mean they can do extensive structural work, despite what they claim.

    The £30K was for labour only and represents some 240 hours on chassis work and 270 hours on bodywork. - The repairers figures, not mine.
     
  22. miurasv

    miurasv F1 World Champ

    Nov 19, 2008
    10,013
    Cardiff, UK
    Full Name:
    Steven Robertson
    Some time has now elapsed since your discovery of the work to your dissatisfaction. Are your repairers offering to remedy the situation or discussing a solution?
     
  23. Daytonafan

    Daytonafan F1 Rookie

    Oct 18, 2003
    2,748
    Surrey, England
    Full Name:
    Matthew
    Thanks for clarifying.
     
  24. gtospoons

    gtospoons Karting

    Jun 16, 2011
    105
    Suffolk, UK
    Full Name:
    Chris Withers
    Unfortunately not.
     
  25. jjeffries

    jjeffries Formula Junior

    Sep 4, 2012
    250
    Connecticut
    Full Name:
    John Jeffries
    I have been following your story, but am confused. You described the car's frame as being damaged from not one but two crashes (or maybe by a crash and then by the tow truck driver /recovery team), then you say you gave the shop you're now dissatisfied with a straight chassis to work with. Does this mean you had someone else or another shop work on the chassis in the interim? John
     

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