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Dead Battery = Constant Alarm Trip ? (456M)

Discussion in '456/550/575' started by Mirek, Mar 25, 2020.

  1. Mirek

    Mirek Karting
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    Oct 20, 2019
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    Battery was EXTREMELY low. Jumped it drove around for 1/2 hour. Parked it, tried to start it after one minute, no dice. The battery did not hold a charge and would not start the car or even crank. I BARELY had enough juice to get the windows up.

    Anyway, now the alarm goes off no matter what I try to do (open, door, hit button on key fob, turn key, etc...). I tried the battery switch off and the alarm continues to sounds even when turned off.

    The alarm seemingly turns off on its own after a while....and the. chirps THREE times (?).

    So my plan is to pop the hood and disconnect the battery completely while the alarm is going off. Which is gonna suck. I just hope the alarm stops when I do that.

    On a side note I notice that after you turn the battery off with the switch you do not have to use your radio code to turn your radio back on. So there must be some juice still going to the car when you turn that knob. I think.
     
  2. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    When the switch is off it should kill everything unless someone has done some wiring modifications. If that is so it should be undone to prevent something being damaged during servicing. Before turning off the battery roll the drivers door window down so it doesn't damage seals, rubber, regulator opening the door.
     
  3. Mirek

    Mirek Karting
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    Thanks for that heads up !
     
  4. Qavion

    Qavion F1 Rookie

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    #4 Qavion, Mar 25, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2020
    Isn't the basic design philosophy of a car alarm to have the siren not stop if someone tries to kill the car's battery? I believe that the siren has its own battery with a memory circuit to remember that it has been armed or disarmed.
     
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  5. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    #5 Rifledriver, Mar 25, 2020
    Last edited: Mar 25, 2020
    No. The alarm should only go off if one of the sensors is tripped, not the battery status.


    Sounds like a possible alternator issue too. Those little Japanese alternators are hand grenades. Repair shops are getting rich fixing that junk. Driving with a compromised battery is near certain death for them. They are not tough enough to survive long term high output levels.
     
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  6. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Common method for stealing C4 Corvettes was the stick a screwdriver through the battery (easily accessible on the port side) and wait for the sulphuric acid to drain. Alarm was dead at that point. Later systems like ours have a separate battery to prevent that. Still should not go off if the battery drains. A few rogue electrons floating around in there, like maybe the siren battery circuitry is partially shorted.
     
  7. Mirek

    Mirek Karting
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    Thanks for the tips gentlemen.

    I just went and bought a new AGM battery (old one is completely dead) and sure enough when I disconnect the old dead battery the alarm still stays blaring. It seems to trip with any interaction with the car or fob and does not shut off until it completes an alarm “cycle”.

    and now........the key is stuck in the ignition (again) !
    The steering wheel will just turn and turn and no longer “lock” so that I can get the key out by that method (again).

    Gotta call a flat bed.
    Question: Is there any way I can just pull out or deactivate this entire alarm/immobilizer ?
     
  8. Laserguru

    Laserguru Formula Junior
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    It is a 15 min job to remove or replace the siren with the Corvette equivalent (exact same Bosch part number) and no doubt the internal battery is likely dying.
    Removing the immobilizer system is not possible as far as I know. I've had mine looked at (new fobs and extract the secret factory PIN number by FerrariFobs. So I know how to physically get it out. But I don't know how to get it out of the car's life and still have the car run.
     
  9. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Trevor over in the 360 section has been successful in removing the immobilizer on the 7.3 360s (and 7.1.1 F430s with a different alarm system), which has essentially the same alarm as the 5.2 456s and later V12s through the 7.1.1 575s.
     
  10. Mirek

    Mirek Karting
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    Thanks Taz, we really are left to our own devices with these things and I appreciate everything I have learned here thus far. In the first month of ownership it now has to go back to the dealer for a repeat repair (not this issue) via flatbed with a NEW issue. I feel like I am in “the club”. I am glad my wife is so cool about it :).

    I should be able to jump it (with the alarm blaring) just to back it down the angled driveway for the flat-bed. I hope.
     
  11. Qavion

    Qavion F1 Rookie

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    Did you cycle the gear lever out of and back into Park?
     
  12. Laserguru

    Laserguru Formula Junior
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    You're definitely in the club, Jeff.
     
  13. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    If you feel like you are left to your own devices you have chosen the wrong service provider. You are in LA, where there are more choices per square mile for Ferrari service than anywhere in the world. Some good, some bad. For the electronic issues Rod Drew at FAI in Costa Mesa is very likely the best in the country.
     
  14. Mirek

    Mirek Karting
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    Thanks man, there are certainly no shortage of recommendations here and one would think that Ferrari of Beverly Hills would be a better source of info than here but it has not been.

    The car just “passed” a thorough post purchase inspection there last week, specifically looking at electronics and battery draw per my request. The repair they actually did find and make has to be re-repaired. I am way up in LA so I will try Blackhorse when things get back to normal someday but FBH has offered up a flatbed.

    Man my key would still be stuck in the ignition (the first time) if not for this forum.
     
  15. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Two Time F1 World Champ

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    Most auto mechanics suck when it comes to anything electrical. Your other mistake was assuming the big yellow sign in some way conveyed talent or ability. Get over that. I was shop foreman at what at the time was the biggest Ferrari service department. I had some good guys and some train wrecks too.

    I am one of the better ones I know in automotive electrical but Rod is much better.
     
  16. Qavion

    Qavion F1 Rookie

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    How did you fix it the first time? I recall you have an automatic gearbox? If so, there is a microswitch on the gear lever which senses when the lever is in park. This energises a solenoid in the ignition lock to release the key. I assume if your battery is flat, the solenoid won't work. You can release the key by pulling on a knob below the ignition lock. If that doesn't work, the ignition lock may be faulty.

    An intermittent gear lever microswitch may be causing your problems (that's why I suggested cycling the gear lever). Or just wiggle it in PARK.
     
  17. Qavion

    Qavion F1 Rookie

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    Thanks, Brian. I had my alarm go off unexpectedly. The last thing I remember touching was the battery switch.

    Perhaps coincidence. I tried to reproduce it today and couldn't.
     
  18. Mirek

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    Yes it is an auto, that little switch does not work to remove the key unfortunately.

    How I got the key out before involved twisting the locked steering wheel back and forth and pulling the key back and forth. It came right out, I was very thankful for that tip too. NOW the car is completely dead, the steering wheel will not lock and any effort to do anything to the car triggers an automatic alarm. The windows are cracked down so it thinks it is open, maybe because there is a key stuck in it haha.

    I hope BHF can sort this out in one visit and actually have a tech working on Monday. The SM is sending a flatbed and I have to somehow angle it out of its current spot in my tiny/long driveway alarm blaring.....because Ferrari.
    Wish I could blast the F car on these empty Hollywood streets some more.



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  19. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob F1 World Champ
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    actually it can and does as in this case. Once you have a semi dead battery all kinds of ghost appear. I have only been stranded once in one of my two 550s and it was due to the alarm going crazy after too rapidly pressing the button when in a hurry. I could not get the right sequence of standing on my head scratching my butt eating a pickle to get it to cycle. Finally, I got it to shut off then properly cycle after about ten minutes of screwing with the fob (including new battery I keep in glovebox just for this occasion) and after I called home to get my wife to search for the pin because I still got a no start. For some reason after starting my car with the pin the FOB would again work normally and I could now start the car like normal and the problem has not recurred since. I know Rod Drew. He is a genius but I doubt he would have an answer for my situation. More owners are stranded by the Ferrari alarm than thefts thwarted! I always say I'll send my ECU to trevor to exorcise this demon but I never seem to get around to it.
     
  20. Mirek

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    “I could not get the right sequence of standing on my head scratching my butt eating a pickle to get it to cycle.”

    That is hilarious and how I felt. The FOB at this point is not even affecting the alarm cycle one way or another and I can tell the FOB battery is good as the red light illuminates.

    Yea this dead battery threw everything sideways for me.
     
  21. F456M

    F456M Formula 3

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    A big barbeque and no shortage of meat is at least a good thing these days.
     
  22. F456M

    F456M Formula 3

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    Hi Fatbillybob :) I have never had any real problems with my alarm in the seven years I have owned the 550 now. But this winter, a few times the alarm goes off beeping loud and even If I press the remote (red LED lights right up), the alarm still beeps at full force. I can still start the car like normal while the alarm is on!! Central locking works too. There is no way to make it shut up other than wait 10-15 minutes. I don’t Want to drive the car either when this has happened as people might think I have stolen my own car!! Pretty strange.
     
  23. tazandjan

    tazandjan Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Be advised that the little LED can have enough electrons to illuminate without much of a signal getting out.
     
  24. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob F1 World Champ
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    The immobilizer works even if the siren does not. I always unplug the siren so it cannot work. They are ignored anyway.

    Funny story...I'm in pasadena california nice business district dropping my taxes off to my accountant in jeans and T shirt. homeless guy sitting on street. I park my Ferrari homeless guy about 20 feet away. I lock my car walk about 20 feet siren of my alarm goes off. I can't stop it. I open passenger door open the fuse panel under carpet head deep in there with legs hanging out onto the curb looking for the wire to pull to stop the alarm. Cops come by I do not see them. Cop car is double parked int he street blocking my ferrari in. Cops standing in front of homeless guy as I kill my alarm and stand up see cops and shut door. Cops hassle the homeless guy never ask if the Ferrari is mine. I just shut the door and walk off to my accountant ignoring the police. That is how valuable a siren is.
     
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  25. Mirek

    Mirek Karting
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    Man if I could just disable/cut the wire/unplug that blasted alarm siren I would consider that a win. At least then my neighbors would be less annoyed. I bet the key is stuck because the car is dead. The key still cycles forward and back. Just does not come out.

    Taz, thanks good tip, I will try my red FOB when it comes time to do the dance and get it on the flatbed.

    I have a power jumper-pack that SHOULD jump the car when time comes to get it on the flatbed but who knows.
     

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