Dead clutch pedal after sitting - recommendations on parts sourcing? | FerrariChat

Dead clutch pedal after sitting - recommendations on parts sourcing?

Discussion in 'Mondial' started by tdskip, Feb 25, 2024.

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  1. tdskip

    tdskip Karting

    Aug 25, 2012
    185
    SoCal
    Full Name:
    Tom
    Hi folks - hope everyone had a good weekend.

    My Mondial sat for about 4 months and I have zero clutch pedal now, so assuming I have a failed slave cylinder or failing master, or perhaps a soft line somewhere.

    Interior of the car is dry.

    Assuming it is the slave cylinder and/or soft line is there a preferred vendor or sourcing option to be aware of?

    Thanks!
     
  2. Alden

    Alden F1 Rookie
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 25, 2010
    3,604
    Central Florida
    Daniel at Ricambi.
    Alden
     
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  3. tdskip

    tdskip Karting

    Aug 25, 2012
    185
    SoCal
    Full Name:
    Tom
    Good morning, thanks for the reply. Will give them a look.

    I did find cross-reference parts that was discussed here, and look like a member here from NL has a great cross-reference list too which seems to point to a range of Alfa's too

    https://www.alfashop.co.uk/products/4021007-gt
     
  4. tdskip

    tdskip Karting

    Aug 25, 2012
    185
    SoCal
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    Tom
    Has anyone here used one of the cross-referenced parts? It is like 90% cheaper, which I know makes me a suspect guy to own a Ferrari. Ha.
     
  5. moysiuan

    moysiuan F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 1, 2005
    4,187
    Canada
    Check the slave fluid hose, it may have split and leaked. The leak would be caught by the undertray, and might not drip out on the floor. The header heat cooks this hose. It is a hose shared with the BB, available at all usual suppliers.

    There are some seals for the slave that can be purchased to rebuild the slave if it is not corroded inside. I bought some spares for eventual rebuild myself some time ago from one of the other enthusiasts on Fchat. Maybe still available.

    I recall from some older posts there may be some internal differences in the cross referenced Alpha slaves. I recall one from Lancia was a correct alternative.
     
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  6. Niklasbraun

    Niklasbraun Karting

    Nov 30, 2023
    54
    Nuremberg
    Full Name:
    Niklas Braun
    Considering the symptoms, your guess about the slave cylinder or master cylinder seems spot on. For getting the parts, I'd suggest checking out places like Pelican Parts or RockAuto. They usually have a solid variety and reliable options.

    Before you go ahead and order anything, though, make sure to give the hydraulic system a good once-over. Look out for any leaks, especially around the slave cylinder and master cylinder.

    If everything looks okay but you're still having issues, it might be worth bleeding the clutch system. Sometimes air can sneak into the lines during periods of inactivity.
     
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  7. tdskip

    tdskip Karting

    Aug 25, 2012
    185
    SoCal
    Full Name:
    Tom
    Good morning - thank you for all of the discussion.

    Would it make sense to have a custom stainless steel hose made for the flex line that is heat impacted?

    Doing reading of past discussions suggests that might be worth while.
     
  8. EastMemphis

    EastMemphis Formula 3
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    May 25, 2019
    1,853
    Memphis, TN
    Full Name:
    John
    One of my cars is an SLK320 with a stick. A couple of years ago, I tried driving the car and the clutch pedal went to the floor without any action. It had been sitting for about a year without being driven. Bad on me.

    I took it to the MB dealer for service, and told them to flush the brake fluid and bleed the clutch and brakes. That fixed it.

    I suggest before tearing apart your car, do the same. Flush the fluid and bleed the clutch and brakes. It's an easy procedure you'll have to do if you open up the hydraulic system so doing it first may solve the problem but if not, you've already flushed your hydraulics.
     
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  9. moysiuan

    moysiuan F1 Rookie
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 1, 2005
    4,187
    Canada
    The OEM hose on my 1988 car was in fact a clear plastic sheathed braided stainless hose, with a rubber type of hose inside. The replacement hoses are made of typical rubber brake line hose. The problem with the stainless covered hose is the hose inside will still deteriorate from the heat, and you can't see any signs of cracking or deterioration (this is what happened to mine). The better approach is to use the available rubber hoses, and then put a removable heat sheild wrap on the hose. That way one can actually remove and inspect the hose every few years when in there for other other service.

    eg. https://www.grainger.ca/en/product/p/WWG2RMR7?cm_mmc=PPC:+Google+PLA&gucid=N:N:pS:paid:GGL:CSM-8500:NOYSQ4:20501231:APZ_1&gad_source=1&gclid=EAIaIQobChMIyKWNx6rOhAMVlG5_AB2MzwVAEAQYAyABEgLbWvD_BwE&gclsrc=aw.ds

    Others have had the stainless type hoses custom made, presumably with the less flexible and more fragile teflon type hose inside as is typical in racing brake line fabrication. The issue is the correct end fitting on the non slave end is not available, in that the OEM type has a grove in it that allows the line to be retained by a brake line type retaining clamp at that fitting, presumably limiting vibration along that hose and the hard line it attaches to. Probably not a big deal for those who did the custom line, but there is a functional downside. The rubber replacement hoses have the correct crimped on fitting.

    Personally, I love the look of the stainless line for brakes hoses, but I don't think there is any OEM that actually uses braided stainless brake line, they all use the the conventional EPDM rubber.
     
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  10. tdskip

    tdskip Karting

    Aug 25, 2012
    185
    SoCal
    Full Name:
    Tom
    @moysiuan - get out of my head, messy and quite untidy in there. Actually had the same thought after I posted above.

    I had to do similar with an oil line on a 914/6 build I did, worked great.

    Will take your suggested approach if the line is indeed faulty, appreciate you and the whole community's help here.
     
  11. 85QVEuro

    85QVEuro Formula Junior

    Jan 15, 2021
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    Joe
  12. tdskip

    tdskip Karting

    Aug 25, 2012
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    SoCal
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    Tom
    Oh sure - taunt me with the prospect of doing this with the engine out!

    Kidding aside that’s actually a super useful picture, thank you for posting it, because I’ve not stared at that part of the car yet in any detail.
     
  13. 85QVEuro

    85QVEuro Formula Junior

    Jan 15, 2021
    546
    NYC
    Full Name:
    Joe
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  14. tdskip

    tdskip Karting

    Aug 25, 2012
    185
    SoCal
    Full Name:
    Tom
    Thank you.

    Best to try this from the top of the car or get it in the air and tackle from below?
     
  15. fdekeu

    fdekeu Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Jun 19, 2008
    631
    Belzium
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    Frank
    Alfa part is good
    I am using it for 10yrs now
    Only have to replace it every 5yrs ;-)
    Original every 2-3yrs
    Work involved is easy
    From wheel well if I remember correctly
    I don't have a lift and did this 3x
     
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  16. tdskip

    tdskip Karting

    Aug 25, 2012
    185
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    Full Name:
    Tom
  17. tdskip

    tdskip Karting

    Aug 25, 2012
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    Full Name:
    Tom
    Please forgive the newbie questions - but am I to remove the driver side wheel well liner and then reach in? Looks challenging to do from top unless the engine lid is removed?

    Thanks!
     
  18. gunn

    gunn Formula Junior

    Aug 30, 2021
    319
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    Gunn S
    I have taken the old clutch hose I wanted for my track car to a local Hydraulic Shop (ex: https://www.royalbrassandhose.com/) and they made me exactly what I wanted; a hose made out of modern materials, with the same connectors at both ends, a length that was more convenient for me (I wanted a slightly longer one) , and with a screw together fitting in the middle of the hose (so I could disconnect the hose to allow for trackside engine+transmission swaps without having to climb in and disconnect the hose inside the transmission bellhousing).

    It won't be factory original but it will be cheaper than a new ferrari part # product.
     
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  19. moysiuan

    moysiuan F1 Rookie
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    Nov 1, 2005
    4,187
    Canada
    I have the cab, which also has an access panel from the back seat. Someone with the fixed roof will have to weigh in.

    But yes, the drivers wheel liner comes off with a few philips head screws, and you should be able to gain decent engine access from inside there.
     
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  20. gunn

    gunn Formula Junior

    Aug 30, 2021
    319
    Full Name:
    Gunn S
    Just to add: it's been a few years but I seem to recall spending ~$50/hose and I've also used them for the brake lines (had one line from a premade set get super hot and discolor under the clear plastic; it still held pressure but I went ahead and replaced it because I like knowing that if I need to brake 100% into a hairpin, I'm going to get actual braking).
    So for my lemons car, a premade set of SS brake lines ran ~$150 from ClassicTube.com (vs $200 for 4 custom hoses from Royal Brass picked up locally) but I'm not sure Classic Tube would have the measurements/config for a Mondial so its a good datapoint for a hose that's a few feet long (i.e. going custom, even in a high cost area like the Bay Area CA shouldn't cost too much).
     
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