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DepositReturnedbyAutoGalleryCalabasis

Discussion in 'California (Southern)' started by JackedByAGallery, Sep 30, 2005.

  1. JackedByAGallery

    Sep 30, 2005
    12
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Daniel Johnson
    Dear Readers,

    I recently found out about this web site by one of my customers who had the same situation happen to him. In September 0f 2003 The Auto Gallery of Woodland Hills had taken a deposit from me for a 360 F1 Coupe. I was told at the time by Eric Prince and Obi Okeke that it would probably be two years wait and by that time the deposit would be transferred to the new model. It took an act of God to get on the list but since I wanted a coupe (yes I track my 99 360 F1) they took my deposit and I was finally going to get my Ferrari built for me by the factory.
    Well in July my deposit was sent back to me stating that they no longer make the 360 and "a limited supply have made it commercially impracticable for the vehicles to be delivered to customers who place orders with us. Well I think we all know what's happening here, I went into the dealership and saw several 430'S for $75,000.00 above sticker.
    If you have had the same situation happen to you, please shoot me an email at alarmla@aol.com or call me on cell 626-945-4038 so we can share our horror stories. Ferrari N.A. really dosen't give a **** about some of the crap their dealers pull, but I'm will to throw money at this on principle. My father is an attorney and I trying to get him to take up my cause, if I had more documented info from others it would help my cause. I posted a note to all my alarm customers and surprisingly I have already gotten two responses.
    The Auto Gallery ruined my new Ferrari experience and I have made it a goal to do everything I can to discourage people from dealing with these types of dealerships. Finally, I found a wonderful independent repair facility that specializes in Ferrari in Redondo Beach. Tillack and Company Ltd. and the Sevice manager is Craig Calder 310-318-8760, they do a wonderful job and I must admit that I saw more new and vintage Ferrari's there than at the factory museum. Please reply.

    Thanks
    Danny Johnson
     
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  3. SrfCity

    SrfCity F1 Veteran

    Nov 1, 2003
    9,842
    Orange County, CA
    Are the 430's selling for market, brand new or have they been flipped? I'd be curious if dealers are allowed to just sell at any price they want now? Someone recently told me that they can but Ferrari slaps their wrists by threatening to lower their future allocation.

    Good luck with this battle.
     
  4. Peloton25

    Peloton25 F1 Veteran

    Jan 24, 2004
    7,566
    California, USA
    Full Name:
    Erik
    What sort of guarantees do you think that leaving a deposit gives you? What do you have in writing from the dealership in regards to this transaction? How much communication did you have with them in these past two years, especially as the introduction of the F430 became a reality?

    Was this deposit a check that they held, or did they actually take funds from you and hold onto them for 2 years?

    In my not-so-professional opinion, the only way they could really be at fault in this situation is if the car they ordered for you came in and was sold to another customer while they still retained your deposit. The dealership or store can't control when the manufacturer or supplier no longer has an available product, at least not in my mind.

    If they wanted to do the right thing, they could have flipped your deposit onto an F430 when it became apparent that 360 production would run out, but I don't think they are necessarily obligated to do that. Businesses don't always do the right thing in all cases, but I'd be surprised if you could earn a judgement against them for this unless there is a lot more evidence than verbal promises in your favor.

    >8^)
    ER
     
  5. JackedByAGallery

    Sep 30, 2005
    12
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Daniel Johnson
    Erik,

    Yes, they actually had cashed the check I had written them. To bad I didn't know at the time that the new model was going to be called a 430. Yeah, I may not win but the satisfaction of seeing all the fine folks at the courthouse in El Centro may be worth blowing a few bucks.
     
  6. Shift or Lift

    Shift or Lift Rookie

    Oct 1, 2005
    3
    Did Autogallery tell you when the 430 list started? and why weren't you given the first opportunity to be put on the 430 list? I heard AutoGallery hasn't taken deposits for the past year, how could their 430 list get filled up so fast? I would be interested in seeing exactly who is on their 430 list and how and when they got there. hmmmmm..... good luck
     
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  8. darth550

    darth550 Five Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jul 14, 2003
    58,839
    In front of you
    Full Name:
    BCHC
    Some guys get the girls and some guys don't! The same applies to Ferraris I suppose!

    Sounds like you may or may not have a gripe. It also sounds like you are pissed off now but do you really want to spend all of the ($$) difference in legal fees and NOT be driving in the meantime?

    Oh, and the free legal work from your father??? I don't care who he is to you, no lawyer will put the requisite attention into litigating and winning a case like this pro bono. You'll end up nagging him to begrudgingly fire off a letter once every three months, watch!

    BUT, witch hunts are fun around her so what the hell do I know??????
     
  9. The K Reloaded

    The K Reloaded Formula Junior
    BANNED

    Oct 28, 2004
    563
    Los Angeles
    Let it go. The line forms to the right, if you want the car get in it. Ferrari of NA hoped to create these conditions, you the buyer who'll wait in that line, pay any amount over sticker and just generally bend over and grab counter top made it reality.
     
  10. JackedByAGallery

    Sep 30, 2005
    12
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Daniel Johnson
    The line forms to the right but at The Auto Gallery in goes in circles and you never get to the end. If I had known that all they do is jerk people off I wouldn't of bothered getting in it. The frustrating part is two years is a long time to waste when I could of been in one somewhere else. As far as getting it at sticker, Ferrari would be better served if they didn't have a policy that their dealers sell the cars at sticker. The whole reason so many cars are flipped is because of this. If the dealers let prospective customers order their cars and charged market value, the up front bump up charge is only one time insted of two one would think?

    Finally, speaking of lines is their any dealers in California or Neveda that will take and honor a deposit? I've already waited two years in the round line at The Auto Gallery. Is there really any lines out there that have an end in the next two or three years or are all Ferrari's lines round? If I ever get to the front of a line they'll probably have to wholsale my 360F1 because it already has 15,000 miles and at the rate I'm going and the time I have to wait it might be ready for a new drive train or the crusher.
     
  11. Racer98

    Racer98 F1 Rookie
    BANNED

    Aug 7, 2005
    4,653
    Encino.
    Full Name:
    K-Fence.
    "Ferrari N.A. really dosen't give a **** about some of the crap their dealers pull"


    I think that you have just about summed up FIAT in general.
     
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  13. The K Reloaded

    The K Reloaded Formula Junior
    BANNED

    Oct 28, 2004
    563
    Los Angeles
    My understanding is that there is a 4 to 5 year waiting list on the 430's. Also, I've never heard anything but bad things about Auto Gallery and their waiting list over the years so I am unclear as to how this is all news to you after waiting for two.
     
  14. 911Fan

    911Fan Formula 3

    Apr 15, 2004
    1,291
    Southern California
    Just a suggestion -- visit another So Cal dealer and let them consign your 360. In exchange, negotiate a place in the 430 line within the next year or two. If you let them earn some money by selling your car, you'll significantly improve your position in line.

    If you want an even better spot, offer to take a Maserati off their hands! :)

    Just play their game and you'll get your 430.

    fwiw, you'll actually be better off getting a later model year 430 -- many of the new model bugs will get discovered and fixed by then. Plus, the early MY cars will obviously have the worst resale values when it's time to move on to the next model.
     
  15. Doody

    Doody F1 Veteran

    Nov 16, 2001
    6,099
    MA USA
    Full Name:
    Mr. Doody
    how about some data like:

    * how many used cars have you bought from auto gallery in the last 10 years?
    * how many new cars have you bought from auto gallery in the last 10 years?
    * do you service your exotics exclusively at auto gallery?
    * how much money per annum are you giving them in service revenue?

    this is NOT a DEPOSIT game, gents. it's a RELATIONSHIP game. build a relationship with your dealer. they sell a scarce commodity and they're going to sell them to their "good customers" first and foremost. why? because they're the good customers!

    doody.
     
  16. darth550

    darth550 Five Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jul 14, 2003
    58,839
    In front of you
    Full Name:
    BCHC
    Bada BING!
     
  17. Hubert

    Hubert F1 Rookie

    Jan 3, 2002
    2,642
    The Left Coast
    Then why even "allow" someone who's is not a "good customer" to put down a deposit? If they had no inclination to actually sell or get him a new 360, why did they take his deposit and tie up his funds under the premise of a new car allocation? Seems like bait and switch; take the deposit, make the buyer wait and wait and wait, then bump him off list, return the deposit but offer a car at 300% of MSPR right now.
     
  18. darth550

    darth550 Five Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jul 14, 2003
    58,839
    In front of you
    Full Name:
    BCHC
    Can you think of a better way for a used car dealer to get a 0% interest floorplan loan?
     
  19. Hubert

    Hubert F1 Rookie

    Jan 3, 2002
    2,642
    The Left Coast
    Ding! That's exactly what I was thinking... And now you see why I think it's BULL****. I'll just stick with ind. and used cars thank you. I hope the org. poster can get something done against the dealer that used him, his deposit and wasted his time (isn't that fraud? going into an agreement with the pretense of fullfiling a promised responsibility but never delivering?).
     
  20. darth550

    darth550 Five Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jul 14, 2003
    58,839
    In front of you
    Full Name:
    BCHC
    Litigation?

    It all boils down to the fortitude of the would be customer and the value of time and $$ spent in doing so.

    A lost cause.
     
  21. cshargh

    cshargh Karting

    Apr 18, 2005
    233
    Redondo Beach, CA
    Full Name:
    Cyrus
    Like anything else that's in demand with supply too short, the dealers know that they can't please everyone all the time. For every person that's pissed off at Auto Gallery, there are 5 that are happy, it's just that you don't hear from them ususally. They're too busy having a good time.

    This type of behavior, whether it's from this F-car dealer or others is nothing new. We've heard about it over and over, whether it's here in So Cal or elsewhere. I think that the price of continuing the misery is higher than just spending the money on getting the car you want, and enjoying yourself.

    Just let it go, life's too short.

    Cyrus
     
  22. FastRed355

    FastRed355 Formula 3

    Oct 3, 2003
    1,485
    Westwood
    Full Name:
    Steve
    I have been happy with the Auto Gallery. I got my F355 from them (used) and had my 30K service done by them(Eric is one of the best mechanics in the country). I recently got a 430 Spider at MSRP. Had to wait 3.5 years. Now that I have the car, well worth the wait.
     
  23. Doody

    Doody F1 Veteran

    Nov 16, 2001
    6,099
    MA USA
    Full Name:
    Mr. Doody
    reasonable question hubert.

    from what i can tell, the answer is that the deposits are an insurance and marketing play. other than actual customers with cars, the folks who put down $5K $10K $20K or whatever deposits are probably THE most qualified sales leads the dealership gets. those folks get emails and calls from the dealer when new preowned cars come in or when unsold new cars (infrequently) show up. the insurance angle is that if the market goes south for some reason, the marketing exercise has created a long list of prospects to move the vehicles to. very useful tool to have if you need it!

    plus, you always need to be cycling your customer base. some of these guys are in their 70s and 80s. people die eventually - or at least stop being able to drive their ferraris (not sure which fate is worse!!!!). so you HAVE to bring the next generation of customers into the fold. how would you have them do this? alphabetically? randomly? the deposit setup solves a lot of business issues: the guy is in theory serious; the guy can drop $15K without batting an eye; the guy becomes a qualified lead to sell stuff to in the interim; etc.

    fwiw, in some states these deposit monies are regulated more than liquor sales. in MA for example, as i understand it, dealers have to keep these funds in distinct accounts separate from other funds and they can't be touched for anything at all. in addition, i believe the accounts don't accrue interest for the dealer or the buyer.

    doody.
     
  24. Doody

    Doody F1 Veteran

    Nov 16, 2001
    6,099
    MA USA
    Full Name:
    Mr. Doody
    fyi/fwiw - i've been told i might have my head up my ass as it concerns MA deposit rules. haven't talked to any lawyers yet :) but my information may be incorrect. caveat emptor.

    doody.
     
  25. SrfCity

    SrfCity F1 Veteran

    Nov 1, 2003
    9,842
    Orange County, CA
    FWIW, I hear that Ferrari dealers can sell cars at market now. Now, how they are able to get the cars to sell at market is another story. If they are all spoken for then it would seem like they'd have to shake someone off to do it. Either that or I'm sure that if someone bails on their spot then the dealer grabs it rather then calling the next guy down the list.
     
  26. AJUFC

    AJUFC Formula Junior

    Sep 11, 2005
    263
    Brea OC, Cali


    You GOT a 430 Spyder at MSRP?????? NO MARK UP???
     
  27. FastRed355

    FastRed355 Formula 3

    Oct 3, 2003
    1,485
    Westwood
    Full Name:
    Steve
    It is possible, no mark up.
     
  28. JackedByAGallery

    Sep 30, 2005
    12
    Southern California
    Full Name:
    Daniel Johnson
    Well Doody,

    I guess your right I fit right in that category, I'm in my 40's and figured I start smelling the roses after all these years of hard work. Unfortunately, the Auto Gallery isn't interested in getting any new blood flowing threw their dealership so what can I do. My partner got feed up with them and bought a Bently insted of dealing with their lip service. I'm just frustrated with the whole experience and looking for a dealer who wants to establish a long relationship. I've never had any problems with my BMW and Mercedes relationships, I ordered the cars I wanted and when they came in I went in and picked them up.
    I guess the Auto Gallery is in a position where establishing new blood is contrary to company policy.
     

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