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Depreciation & general advice please

Discussion in 'United Kingdom' started by Garyh, Sep 18, 2004.

  1. Garyh

    Garyh Karting

    Jan 10, 2004
    140
    Guys i would like some advice & opinions and I figure this is the place to get some strong and diverse ones. I have reached a bit of a crossroads in F - car owneship. When i bought the first a 1996 456 GT spent about £65K and put 7500 miles on it in about 12 months. Fell in love with a 575M and bougt new 01/04 with high spec which listed at £170K. 9 months and 3000 miles on I get less use out of it than i would like ( cant get this work/life/family balance right!) and with the 575 replacement and GTC version imminent can see value dropping like a stone (have you seen what a great deal (buying)you get on 550's now!) in next 6 months. So i popped into a Ferrari dealers i was passing in Midlands where i noticed a stonking Nero 360 CS on the forecourt and said i was thinking of a swap. To my horror he showed me his 03/04 575M (no extra's) which will go for £120K !! So i reckon as a trade in I might squeak a staright swap on the CS which is ok as i hope (do you agree?) the CS will hold its value better despite the 430 coming. This leads me into the next part of the equation. I LOVE TO DRIVE the car not garage it and wash it and look at it but actually get out in it a lot. 2 things bug me on this point - extra miles kills value and its getting really hard to enjoy these cars on public road in UK. So i thought either get CS and then i can start going to track days etc or just buy older car so i dont worry about depreciation too much and just run it till it drops (355 would seem up to it ?) . My last resort is ditch the F car and my 4wd audi and just get an RS6 but i'll know it wont ever be the same feeling. Any thoughts advice welcome!
     
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  3. 360CS

    360CS F1 Rookie

    Nov 1, 2003
    2,641
    Kent
    Full Name:
    Joe J

    Hi Gary,


    I traded a 360 Spider for the CS despite the new 430 , Buy the car you want , enjoy it !! Ive found that the 550 575 prices to be very poor on resale, so much that the 456 GT would be my choice.

    I dont think the CS prices will fall as low as the 360m, but the miles will kill any fcar resale value despite what your told.. :-(

    Id go for the CS as the car is just great if you in to track cars on the road...........

    Whatever you decide good luck and enjoy..
     
  4. Robertb

    Robertb Formula 3

    Nov 19, 2003
    1,330
    South Oxfordshire, U
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    Robert
    I'd suspect that a 360CS will hold its value a bit better than a 170k 575, because it is limited edition and more affordable, hence more demand.

    That said, the CS will still lose value when the 430 comes out, not least because of the no-doubt imminent 430CS.

    If you can stomach the loss on the 575, the 360 CS will be great fun, and has cult status (at the moment) which will support residuals.

    The RS6 is a fab car, but will not give you the buzz of a Ferrari.

    At the end of the day, 99% of new cars depreciate in the end. But, the loss will be less painful on a cheaper car.

    Robert.
     
  5. 360CS

    360CS F1 Rookie

    Nov 1, 2003
    2,641
    Kent
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    Joe J


    Robert,


    Do you think that people will sell the CS to purchase a 430??? :)

    Id be very surprised....But i have to say that cos ive just bought one
     
  6. steve f

    steve f F1 World Champ

    Mar 15, 2004
    12,030
    12cylinder town
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    steve
    why buy one if you are frightened its going to lose money every thing loses money buy it use it enjoy it and dont worry
     
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  8. F328GTS

    F328GTS Formula 3

    Apr 27, 2004
    1,628
    Cambridgeshire, UK
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    Nigel R
    Good call. You are only on this earth once....
     
  9. ZYMOL348

    ZYMOL348 Karting

    May 1, 2004
    167
    Minehead Somerset
    Full Name:
    Anthony Rea
    Your right Steve whats the point of being the richest person in the graveyard

    If you are not harming anybody buy and enjoy you are only here once !!

    ZYMOL 348
     
  10. Garyh

    Garyh Karting

    Jan 10, 2004
    140
    Thanks for the opinions. I dont worry about losing the money per se but it just seems the 550/575 ' s get hammered more than the V8's .
     
  11. Robbo

    Robbo Karting

    Feb 16, 2004
    102
    Gary,

    I've just got out of the 360m due to winter coming/430 and basically too many on the market. I put 2500 miles on it at a cost ex petrol of approx £6.40 / mile. Heavy, but nowhere near that of the 575m. The big v12' always seem to drop and agree that the 550 looks superb at £60-£70 k. The dealer I sold the 360 to had that moring bid £ 50 K on a 17,000 mile 550 2 years old. That would go for mid around the mid £60 k mark. Or so he said.

    I have also had an RS6 but got out of it after 9 months as again too many were coming on to the market. The RS4 run was limited and values held. A friend of mine paid 59 k second hand, and was offered £38 k 8 months later by Audi, so beware, This type of car can drop at the same rates as a supercar, look at the CSL. The RS6 was great by the way, but massively wooden to drive.

    This is just my opinion, but 360's will take a big hit over the next 6 months, and as more CS's come on to the market, so will they. Even the one dealer agreed they are overpriced, off the record ofcourse!. Look at the Sunday times, they're coming on in numbers.

    One final point, if a 430 was offered in place of the 360cs to an existing owner.....I would almost guarantee there would be a trade. This will happen, and 360CS's will be at the £ 100k mark in 9 months. I'd get out of the 575 NOW, pick up an RS6 for under £40K and wait. The dealers make their money on the impatient. Just my opinion.
     
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  13. Garyh

    Garyh Karting

    Jan 10, 2004
    140
    Thanks - makes sense!
     
  14. Blow Dog

    Blow Dog Karting

    Jan 9, 2004
    87
    Perfect sense and great advice.
    I'm also looking at a 360 right now and, well, the 430 is making me a little nervous.

    Damn but this Ferrari ownership experience is a business in itself!

    It seems as though V8's are far more sensible when treating the car as a valuable asset and V12's are to be avoided unless you're a football player or lottery player or you've bought an early example.

    I guess if you make the dealer take a hit, you can be pretty safe. Offer official dealers 10k off their sticker prices I reckon and you should be ok for 6 months. I know 355's are not the same as 360's because of the limited supply, but they've been the same price for a couple of years now and have hit a plateau of about 55k for a good example at a dealer.
     
  15. markcp

    markcp Karting

    Feb 3, 2004
    67
    North London
    Full Name:
    Mark Parsons
    A friend of mine works for a well known specialist car dealer, and it really scares me when I hear of the values they trade good quality cars at (355's in the £30k's and 550's in the £40k's!). That said, what surprises me more is that his first F-car will be a 550....

    Mark.
     
  16. paul360m

    paul360m Karting

    Jan 8, 2004
    53
    Nr Heathrow
    Full Name:
    Paul
    There is NO WAY i would trade my 360CS for a 430! Despite the extra bhp, the 430 will almost certainly be a softer car (a la 360m, that i got out of to get the cs) so what would be the point. i think most cs owners have bought the car because it is harder edged & a more hardcore driving experience.

    As for depreciation, its a 'mare but unfortunately a fact of life!

    Cheers
     
  17. Robbo

    Robbo Karting

    Feb 16, 2004
    102

    Buying and running a Ferrari is expensive as we all know, and I agree that depreciation is a 'mare, BUT there remains degrees of depreciation and the impact can be lessened with a little thought and less of the 'I want it now'.
     
  18. 360CS

    360CS F1 Rookie

    Nov 1, 2003
    2,641
    Kent
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    Joe J

    Paul ,

    One more thing the 430 is gonna have loads of Software probs as did the first batch of 360m F1,s this e-diff will prob go through the learning curve..

    I hope the CS doesnt lose 40k in 9months Robbo????

    Given the choice 430 for 120k or CS for 130k id still go for the CS as its a happening car.....

    But if it does its only money!!!! Its only a car!!!!


    Paul you coming over to Brands in Oct???
     
  19. stevep

    stevep F1 Veteran

    Jan 19, 2004
    8,330
    Geordie Land
    Full Name:
    steve
    doubt cs will drop, if it does i'll buy one though, but every car depreciates, i wouldn't drive if i ahd to worrry about it
     
  20. Robbo

    Robbo Karting

    Feb 16, 2004
    102
    Another friend of mine has just got out of his 360 for the reasons outlined above, and has the 3rd F430 coming into the country through Carrs of Exeter. He told me he will trade straight away to try an recoup the 40k he lost in just in depreciation, and 20K running costs over 2 and half years on his 360. The CS will become real value in 9 months, and I will seriously consider purchasing at more realsitic price. I agree with you that if I worried about it I wouldn't have bought a 360, but to justify that sort of depreciation & running costs through the winter months with the 430 imminent...no contest.
     
  21. steve f

    steve f F1 World Champ

    Mar 15, 2004
    12,030
    12cylinder town
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    steve
    Easy soloution if you are worried what it will cost or loss dont buy one and die a sad old fart then you kids will enjoy spending what you didnt and you can lay in the wooden box looking down saying i could of done that life is for living
     
  22. Robbo

    Robbo Karting

    Feb 16, 2004
    102

    Excellent financial advice...never heard that one before, could you run it by me once more ?.
     
  23. steve f

    steve f F1 World Champ

    Mar 15, 2004
    12,030
    12cylinder town
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    steve
    yes not a problem but if ask again i will charge for my advice


    Easy soloution if you are worried what it will cost or loss dont buy one and die a sad old fart then your kids will enjoy spending what you didnt and you can lay in the wooden box looking down saying i could of done that life is for living
     
  24. paul360m

    paul360m Karting

    Jan 8, 2004
    53
    Nr Heathrow
    Full Name:
    Paul
    Hi Joe
    Havent booked it yet but will probably do so - I love the GP circuit & have only driven my little lotus there so would love the chance to take the strad very carefully round it! There are some very fast sections with not a lot of run-off (compared to Silverstone anyway!)
    Hope to see you there.
    Cheers
    Paul
     
  25. mal

    mal Formula Junior

    Jan 12, 2004
    615
    Kent
    Gary,

    Your predicament is rather similar to the one I had a 18 months ago. I had a 4 x 4 as my everyday/ family car and a Maserati 3200GT for fun. I loved the Maser but it dropped like a stone in value. So I sold both and bought a RS6 Avant which is fantastic, It lacks the feel of a Maser/Ferrari but as a useable supercar it is second to none - it does exactly what it says on the tin - wet/dry whatever and is as fast as most Ferraris. The difference is you can use it and its power all the time.

    So to regain the Ferrari 'feel' I bought a 1972 Dino GTS which will hopefully will appreciate in value - As a car this is the most 'raw and stimulating' driving experience I have ever had
     
  26. murph7355

    murph7355 Formula 3

    Nov 30, 2002
    1,691
    SE England Yorkie
    Full Name:
    Andy
    I have to agree with this.

    Surely it robs you of all the enjoyment, bricking it about how much money you're losing?

    Best off buying a second hand mkII Escort. Great laugh to drive and you'l probably get all your 50 quid back :)

    I thoink 430 will knock the values of 360s badly. Not sure on the CS, but everyone I've spoken to reckons it was toppy on the list price. A well spec'd 100k car would make more sense.

    Not sure on the 355. I'm obviously biased, but I reckon there'll be fewer and fewer good ones for sale. Plus a lot of people wanting one as they're tantalisingly in reach and, CS excepted, more "Ferrari" than a 360 (flame away).

    430 still doesn't do it for me, so I suspect I'l get an alternative marque next (and will hopefully keep the 355).
     
  27. murph7355

    murph7355 Formula 3

    Nov 30, 2002
    1,691
    SE England Yorkie
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    Andy
    A classic is definitely an option, but they're a totally different ownership proposition.

    Plus, many people simply won't fit (oh to fit in a Muira! 85kish of pure awesomeness).
     
  28. stevep

    stevep F1 Veteran

    Jan 19, 2004
    8,330
    Geordie Land
    Full Name:
    steve
    love the 355, but my 360 has been less trouble (touch wood)
     

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