Disaster/mystery on my 575

My point being that the typical DIY'er, armed with the Ferrari WSM and tools, and thinking he can do a belt swap by following the procedure in the WSM, which would be a fair assumption for "most" major car manufacturers, is headed for trouble with a Ferrari.

 

Ferrari manuals aren't very good but they have no exclusive on that. Years ago I bought a new Grand National. I had the set of manuals and one day it stopped running. Not one word devoted to theory of operation. The entire set was written for an 8 year old. I had to follow a step by step diagnostic flow chart to get anything out of it. 2 hours for a 15 minute job if only they would just tell you how it worked.

But now Ferrari is doing the same thing. The 575 manual has a full page dissertation on how to change a wheel and another on how to install the oil filter. For that they are cutting out the important information.

 

Your advice sucked too but thanks for the comments.

 

Everything is designed for zero thought output. Companies do their best to flow chart and idiot proof everything not understanding that great idiots will emerge. Medicine is the latest victim. Coming to a hospital near you are whole untrained people with your life in their hands reading a flow chart of what to do next. The reason? It takes too long to make a doctor.

 

I had a retired ME tell me his water pump bearing in his BMW was just fine, and will hold for at least another year. He went on and on about bearings and loads etc.

I warned him about the potential for big damage if it let go.

1 week later his car arrived on a tow hook. I called him when I saw the car on the back of the truck. He obviously had call display...."Don't say a word, just fix it, I don't want to hear it" click..

Sure enough I open the hood, water pump pulley with fan clutch are stuck in the rad, fan obviously lost all it's blades, took out the shroud, and expenasion tank, cut the lower hose etc..

He didn't want to spend 200 bucks on a pump. Well he just loved spending 2500.

 

OK, so we believe the timing shifted and caused damage. Back to the OP's basic question, why did he not feel the interference when he was turning the motor over by hand?

 

Jerry- Probably because nothing was jammed yet, just bent. Those 7 mm stems make pretty good mechanical fuses. I remember Brian explaining to someone else how that happened when another mechanic was assembling his 12 cylinder.

 

Seriously ?

Good advice / bad advice is not at issue ---- having a tone that is insulting to folks is --- too bad you seem to lack the capacity (and the compassion) to discern the difference..... glad to see you are back in your true form again.

You rail on the OP by implying (more than that actually) that he is basically incompetent to handle the job....... how about considering that either an understandable mistake was made, or something accidental happened ??

Ever happen to you ---- ever make a mistake.....ever have something accidental happen while you were otherwise doing a good job.....

Stick to the Forza articles. Truly you are excellent in those ---- everyone benefits from reading your expert knowledge that you generously share (and I mean that with the utmost sincerity and respect). But, your demeanor often sucks when you try to deal directly with people here on this site.

 

Let's not turn this into a pissing match. Many of us respect and appreciate Brian's advice. I found nothing condescending about his tone with the OP. He apologized in advance if it felt that way.

You provided some advice that he (and I'm guessing several others) thought would lead to further damage. I thought your advice was not sound. So please, the forum is best when we can learn from each other. No need for anyone to throw the toys out of the pram.

Philip

 

I agree with Phillip.

 

You read into things what you want to hear.

Must be terrible always assuming the worst of others.

 

I suspect that is a real possibility. The unknown to me here though is why the damaged plug. Typically with the 4 and 5 valve heads the valves just get pushed out of the way and that's it. With the low lift inherent in a 4 valve motor and the valve angles they get in each others way enough to do damage but not typically serious damage. Assuming of course we don't consider bent valves serious. It is really really rare when a valve head breaks off and mangles things up. That is why at least to myself I have not ruled out FOD. FOD would explain why it turned through OK. Assuming FOD doesn't at this point explain the cam marks but one step at a time.

Once you have a big piece floating around it screws things up. All this is also why I think the head ought to come off first. May get lucky and not have a damaged piston. One has to have hope anyway.

 

Take your time. Record some leak down numbers and let us know. Assuming the head needs to come off it is a little involved and will require a few special tools.

 

Was does FOD mean?Thank you.

 

Sorry

Foreign object damage

 

Pictures would be very helpful and make the thread more interesting

 

Once the damage has been assessed...One could easily spend more than this in a proper rebuild. When skills are lacking often this is the quicker easier route and one can end up with a second damaged engine that can be rebuilt as time money and skill increase. I am amazed at the lack of ability to rebuild motors even when simple ubiquitous V-8 chevy motors are involved and then the resultant failure of those motors. A used motor is always a chance but it is factory assembled and has history of running albeit potentially tired and in need of it's own maintenance. However, too many times I have seen newly rebuilt motors fail to survive becoming a large paper weight.

Ferrari 550 Engine Long Block 52K Miles with Warranty | eBay

 

I wonder what that's worth...will be interesting to see what it sells for. To Carl's point, I have access to people that can and do build race motors for me but when I spun a rod bearing on a Noble (Ford V6), we just replaced the engine as at $4400 it was cheaper than rebuilding. F car motors and components are a different league in costs, but it sure feels like it would be easy to spend $15k (the current bid for the engine Carl highlights) in parts and any labor the OP needs.

 

One reason we are so proactive about maintenance. On many models including some not so old models a serious motor issue turns it into a total.

 

In the post on the 28th, Chessie mentioned a bucket being away from the lobe. Maybe it was lost in translation but if there is only one bucket free from the cam and not two then I fear the worst.

 

I know.

Just have to see.

If a cam timing issue bends valves every valve on that cam takes the same hit.

We have evidence that suggests something else and we also have a cam timing issue.

 

LOL - great retort!

WebMD got sued over this ... Thank goodness Americans spend more on their cars than their medical programmes

 

In all of this that dropped bucket is the lynch pin IMHO. That's the single best evidence that you aren't going to like what you find when the head comes off....