Do Old Carburated Ferraris Have Exhaust Heat Crossover? | FerrariChat

Do Old Carburated Ferraris Have Exhaust Heat Crossover?

Discussion in 'Technical Q&A' started by AlpenJäger1914, Mar 1, 2025.

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  1. AlpenJäger1914

    Jan 15, 2021
    31
    Hello, i do not own any ferraris but i have a 1976 ford taunus with 1.6 pinto engine with a single barrel carb on it. Majority of carbed cars generally had a method to heat the intake manifold since carburetors chill the intake air a lot and then intake needs to be heated to counter this to make them more driveable in everyday life. My car for example has a coolant jacketed intake manifold, some cars like opels used an exhaust heat crossover to heat the intake manifold from down below with exhaust gases. American V8 engines generally also had intake manifolds with exhaust crossover built into them that routed exhaust thru the intake manifold (without mixing it to intake of course) to heat up the intake air. The crossover stuff was eliminated in ultra high performance engines like 426 hemi where the buyers didnt care about everyday driveability but 99% of american v8s still had them for everyday driveability.

    My question regarding the Ferraris is that did they have any device like this to heat the intake manifold? Im not seeing any on the 308s etc when i look at pictures and diagrams online and it would make sense for them to not have it since they are very high performance cars but i wanted to ask just to be sure. Or what about the more comfort oriented Ferraris like the 330 GTC, do they have a heat crossover or coolant jacketed intake manifold?

    In the case that they dont have it, how do they fair in regular driving? Are they unresponsive at low rpms and at part throttle operations?

    PS: blocking the heat crossover passage on american v8 engines generally gave around 15-25 extra horsepower at the top end but made everyday driving a lot worse at low rpms and part throttle. Of course none of this is a problem with efi that gives both great driveability and performance at the same time without having to compromise between the two :)
     
  2. wmuno

    wmuno Formula Junior
    Silver Subscribed

    Dec 24, 2007
    513
    Wilmette, Illinois
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    Bill Muno
    #2 wmuno, Mar 1, 2025
    Last edited: Mar 1, 2025
    Vintage Ferrari V-12s had the carburetors in the middle of the V attached to short intake runners. There was no heating for the intake runners. Once the engine reached normal operating temperature, there was plenty of heat to prevent the fuel mixture from puddling in the runners. There was an exception: the Ferrari 365 GTC/4 which had 3 Weber DCOE carburetors on the outside of each side of the engine.
     
  3. Ferrari Tech

    Ferrari Tech Formula 3

    Mar 5, 2010
    1,201
    Georgia
    Full Name:
    Wade Williams
    The carbureted Ferraris have no provision for heating the intake manifolds. I have never had any driving issues with Ferraris that could be addressed with a heated intake. I also have had many small block chevy engines personally and have built many other American V8 engines. I have always blocked the intake heat crossover or used an intake that didn't have a crossover. Also, I have used special filler to fill the back side exhaust port to the intake to allow better port flow on a couple engines. After market heads available don't have heat crossovers. I have never had any drivability issues. I never really understood the technology behind heating of the intake. When building performance engines, we try to keep the carb and intake cooler. There are manifolds for SBC that have gaps under the runners for better cooling of the intake charge and they are considered the best on the market in there application range and dyno testing and driving proves this to be correct.

    Anyway, no Ferrari does not warm the intake on there carb cars.
     
    AlpenJäger1914 likes this.
  4. spirot

    spirot F1 World Champ

    Dec 12, 2005
    14,953
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    Tom Spiro
    may be a stupid observation but the gas used in older carb cars, could have been more susceptible to freezing vs. today's gas with more ethanol. Lead vs. alcohol...
     
  5. raemin

    raemin Formula 3

    Jan 16, 2007
    2,272
    Lyon (FR)
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    R. Emin
    The engine bonnet of any ferrari is close to hell on earth in terms of temperature... many cylinders, multiple exhausts, lots of friction, shoe-horned engine, tons of heat.

    Most of the vintage v12 I've seen had the choke system removed. Same story for the winter toggle on the air-filtre-box.

    Last but not least, who would be brave enough to have a ride on a freezing/sleepery road with a vintage v12?
     
    AlpenJäger1914 likes this.
  6. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
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    Jan 11, 2001
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    30°30'40" N 97°35'41" W (Texas)
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    Steve Magnusson
    #6 Steve Magnusson, Mar 5, 2025
    Last edited: Mar 5, 2025
    The exhaust crossover isn't for "driveability" -- it's for improving "cold-running driveability". That's why there is usually some sort of thermo-mechanical gizmo to (mostly) block it off for normal warm-running. Keeping the car outside overnight in freezing winter conditions and expecting to jump in it, fire it up, and drive away in 30 second to get to work is why they were almost forced to include it on V8s with a centrally-mounted single carburettor (with a large horizontal area directly below it, perpendicular to the airflow direction, where the intake charge impinges upon it and liquid fuel would condense out and pool).
     
    Ferrari Tech likes this.
  7. Steve Magnusson

    Steve Magnusson Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Jan 11, 2001
    26,516
    30°30'40" N 97°35'41" W (Texas)
    Full Name:
    Steve Magnusson
    If you had 4 single-barrel carbs each with a very short intake runner with no intake manifold surfaces perpendicular to the intake charge flow direction = then you'd be like a carbed F and not need any intake manifold heating to improve cold-running driveability. "Short intake runners with no intake manifold surface(s) perpendicular to the intake charge flow direction" (that the intake charge would impinge upon and condense liquid fuel out of the intake charge if the intake manifold is really cold) is the secret sauce of carbed F that eliminates the need for any intake manifold heating.
     
    raemin likes this.
  8. AlpenJäger1914

    Jan 15, 2021
    31
    it actually never gets blocked. the heat riser bimetallic spring unwinds as the engine gets to operating temp but that just decreases the amount of exhaust gas going into the crossover passage, it doesnt completely eliminate it.
     
  9. AlpenJäger1914

    Jan 15, 2021
    31
    twin weber dcoe with very short runners is very popular mod on the pinto engine and i ve heard from people that it kinda ruins every day driveability especially with warm up sequence but i have not tried it myself i have the stock single barrel carb with the coolant jacketed intake
     
  10. AlpenJäger1914

    Jan 15, 2021
    31
    #10 AlpenJäger1914, Mar 7, 2025
    Last edited: Mar 7, 2025
    Yeah its important to keep everything cold for performance but for part throttle cruising etc uncle tonys garage in many of his videos says that with the crossover blocked and if you floor the car for a couple of minutes straight, the intake manifold gets very very cold and that it starts to suffer at part throttle and low rpms after those couple minute long wide open throttle applications until it eventually warms up again, but i ll also take your word for it because i havent had one myself, hopefully one day :)

    edit: found one of the videos where he mentioned it, watch from 7:19 until 8:43

     
    Ferrari Tech likes this.

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