Discussion in 'Ferrari Discussion (not model specific)' started by mondial86, Feb 14, 2004.

  1. mondial86

    mondial86 Formula Junior

    Nov 1, 2003
    Full Name:
    David Holmes
    I spent a few hours at my dealer having some service done on the 355 yesterday and got talking to the "BIG SALES GUY",he was upset that Ferrari is opening 3 or 4 new dealerships in the us this year.He said that production is not going up so the cars that the new dealers are going to get will come from the existing dealer network.Given all the chatter on this board about how hard it is evan for a good customer to get a new car,lost cars, dameged cars cain't get on the list for a new car ,ect.If what "BIG SALES GUY " sayes is true than I wonder what is Ferrari doing opening more dealers when they cain't suport the existing dealer network.
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  3. Doody

    Doody F1 Veteran

    Nov 16, 2001
    MA USA
    Full Name:
    Mr. Doody
    i do not know the situation, but i guess i have a couple comments.

    * didn't they CLOSE one or two dealerships in NA in the last year or so? FoLG lost their franchise and didn't one of the shops in Canada close up as well? they've added FoSD (and las vegas?), but that's all i'm aware of. so that's a net-zero-sum. if my data is wrong, please someone educate me.

    * in my opinion, if FNA and F S.p.A. understand nothing else about business, they understand supply and demand maths. if they're opening new dealerships in NA, that's almost certainly based on a long-term plan by both FNA and F S.p.A. and they're not doing it haphazardly.

    * from what i've been able to tell, FNA moves very slowly and with long-term plans. they don't do things quickly (like it or not). shutting down "lesser" dealers takes years and years and almost always seems to end up in court (if you search the legal databases you can find all sorts of dirt (FoLG, Gaston Andrey, etc. - it's amusing reading). i'd assume that FNA didn't decide to open a few new dealerships just last week. i'd also assume they are shutting more down (cf. "supply and demand" point above). how many people would be bowled-over if they shut down one of the FL dealers? how about the two in IL (Chicago ain't the cash colonic town it used to be) that are about 30 minutes apart?

    * and maybe the sub-optimal behavior of some of the dealers or some of the dealers wrt FNA can be cleaned up some with more competition? FNA remains in the driver's seat, but that's never going to change. machiavelli talked about the "benevolent dictator". today, FNA is a dictator (we can depate as to its benevolence) but the dealers in many cases are also dictators. dictatorships only work with one dictator, and at the end of the day FNA must run the show. woe is the dealer who gets too powerful, or bypasses the dictator in NJ to get to the king in Maranello.

    my tuppence, worth well less than you paid for it.

  4. nberry

    nberry Formula Junior

    Nov 1, 2003
    Excellent analysis. Also to keep in mind that they now sell Maserati and production numbers for that car are not nearly as restrictive as the Ferrari.
  5. FerrariFrank1

    FerrariFrank1 F1 Rookie

    Aug 15, 2003
    Full Name:
    We are fortunate to have 2 Authorized Ferrari Dealerships in the Chicago area. But,I think that they are far apart enough from each other as to not 'Step on each others toes',so to speak,in both the Sales aspect,and,the Service aspect. :)) Although,the owners of the Dealerships might disagree with me about that...:) ) They are both expanding,and both seem to be selling plenty of cars,and their Service bays are always full. And,they both have very good reputations. And,both have been in business for a very long time.

    And,there are also a couple other "High End",and "Exotic Car" Dealers in the Area,too.

    When I was looking for my own car alittle over 3 years ago. I called the one Dealer,first,(they were closer to home) But,they didn't have what I was looking for. I called the other Dealer,and he had 2 to choose from. So,it's probably a good thing.
  6. shelbee

    shelbee Guest

    I think it is nice to have at least two dealers in the state for competitive pricing, and they can compete each others for the sake of getting a valuable and returning customers.

    Servicing the car will more convenient too, don't have to go out of state.
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  8. Peter

    Peter F1 Veteran
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Dec 21, 2000
    B.C., Canada
    Yes, Brian Jessel Sports Cars here in Vancouver closed last year. Their service shop is still up-and-running, but they only sell now... ehhh... Kia's.

    That makes only two dealers for the whole country. A country which spans a couple thousand Km's (or miles if you prefer, in any case, its still freakin' big) in any direction...
  9. labcars

    labcars Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed

    Jan 22, 2003
    Phila. + Scottsdale
    I know of at least one "incremental" dealership being opened, Roger Penske's United Auto Group store in south NJ, which will compete with Algar.

    I think Doody is spot on in his assessment of Ferrari SpA's understanding of supply and demand, but they are limited by their production capacity, so more dealers WILL mean fewer new cars per dealer. In as much as most dealers actually make their money on used cars, service, and parts, I don't know how much this simple fact will hurt them. What will hurt them though, is their growing inability to satisfy new car customers, both longstanding and new buyers, and the consequent inability to develop customer loyalty. Now, I'm sure there are those dealers who someone(s) on this board believe will suffer a wel deserved fate, but by the same token, there are those dealers whose business and reputations will suffer unfairly.

    Ferrari NA will also be, as Doody rightly identifies, be even better placed than it is today to play favorites within the dealer base. How exactly this will affect us, the end consumer, I'm not yet certain.

    Equally, Ferrari NA will be opening some stand alone Maser stores. Doing so will further hurt the existing Ferrari dealer base (the original Maser dealers), as I'm sure we all understand that a high(er) volume dealer group can better absorb the expenses and lower profit margins of a slower selling, prestige brand, while cannibalizing sales from the existing Ferrari/Maser dealers.

    At the end of the day, I think that adding dealers without an increase in production capacity may, in the short term, provide us with more options used vehicles, it wont change the availability of new cars and will only further alienate a growingly disgruntled customer base.

    Just my $.02
  10. cmparrenzo

    cmparrenzo F1 Rookie

    Mar 3, 2002
    Full Name:
    Chris Parr
    It should be illegal to have 2 Ferrari dealerships in one city, much less two in one state!

    In kansas, our closest dealer is over 600 miles away, either in Denver, Chicago (x2) or Dallas..

    Ferrari NA does not have a clue!

    Chicago should only have one dealer, send Continental to us PLEASE!
  11. Mark(study)

    Mark(study) F1 Veteran

    Oct 13, 2001
    Clearwater, FL
    Full Name:
    You might need more dealers in the USA.

    In the 80's you only had 10,000 or so Ferraris to make money off of repairs.

    but for the last 25 years Ferrari has added 25,000 more cars...that's huge growth in the number of cars that need repairs... and that's where ferrari makes it's money.

    Reminds me of a joke.... someone started a thread..."where do you see the most ferrari's?" - the wiseguy answer- in a ferrari sevice bay :)

    The number of repair bays need to keep pace.... plus add in the used-car resale market now at 40,000 Ferraris in the USA and new Masers.... means you need more dealers. The "NEW CAR market" for dealers, if the network expands, may become like the ENZO is now-a-days... only a trinket to keep people interested.
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  13. AJS328

    AJS328 F1 Veteran

    Apr 23, 2003
    New Jersey
    Full Name:
    Augustine Staino

    Did I read that right? Penske is opening a F-car store here in South Jersey? Seriously? Please correct me if I'm reading this wrong. By the way, how are you? I still can't wait to see your blue 246! :)
  14. ernie

    ernie Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Nov 19, 2001
    Full Name:
    The Bad Guy
    Before they get to open their dealership, they have to graduate from the, How to mistreat and rip off your customers 101, class. Hahahaha. Woopty flipping do, they are opening up three new dealerships. Unless they are gonna offer better treatment and honest prices, I could care less. I don't give a rip if they open up 100 new dealerships. Bottom line is we need honest prices, and honest treatment more than we need more dealrships.
  15. Dr C

    Dr C Formula Junior

    Dec 1, 2002
    Kansas City
    Full Name:
    In kansas, our closest dealer is over 600 miles away, either in Denver, Chicago (x2) or Dallas..

    Chicago should only have one dealer, send Continental to us PLEASE![/QUOTE]
    Wonder how many Ferraris are within or near the Denver, Chicago, and Dallas triangle? That would probably be the determining factor whether we would ever get another Ferrari dealership here in Kansas City.
  16. Bart

    Bart Formula 3

    Nov 1, 2003
    Orange County, Calif
    Full Name:
    Heck, I hope Ferrari makes fewer cars. I am very afraid that Fiat will make Ferrari just another sports car; i.e. Porsche.
  17. MS250

    MS250 Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Dec 10, 2003
    Full Name:

    Agreed....they seem to forget the true Fguy probably does most of the work because they are a rip off. They wouldn't be closing locations if they were fair in there treatment of long term owners. Not these guys just walking in to buy 355 and 360 and then doing the first service and run to the nearest porche shop. No offence to my fellow true 355 and 360 owners. Ihave had my TR for 12yrs. The dealers don't care because I dont trade the car, and spend $10,000 for a belt change. I could care less how many they open. I hope they open a thousand of them and train mechanics that they end up laying off so we can then use them at half the rate.Well said ernie !!
  18. acw

    acw Karting

    Nov 3, 2003
    I don't think we need new dealers, however, we clearly need new Ferrari certified service centers. It is really annoying to use a service shop which is far away simply because this is the only option to have warranty work done. I suspect some people choose not to buy a Ferrari or a Maserati for that reason.

  19. henryk

    henryk Formula Junior

    Dec 9, 2003
    Door County, WI
    As dealer service prices will ONLY go up, I sense more people will be doing the work themselves. Working on my Ferraris (I had 8), is a hobby for me. If I was not mechanically inclined, I would not own a Ferrari. The new ones take too big of a hit in depreciation for me.

    I am currently doing a mjor service on my TR. The dealer quoted about $8500............that is just NUTS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! The parts only cost about $500.
  20. ghost

    ghost F1 Veteran
    Lifetime Rossa

    Dec 10, 2003
    Wow. I didn't know the rip-off factor was that high!! 17.0x

  21. shelbee

    shelbee Guest

    Well you can go south across the border .......... to Ron Tonkin in Portland :)
  22. henryk

    henryk Formula Junior

    Dec 9, 2003
    Door County, WI
    I feel sorry for those that can only afford a 3X8 for $25K-$35K, and then get hit with a $5K major service. I had 3 3X8s (my first ones)........I would NOT get another one, since I don't believe they were serviced properly.........regardless what the owner states. While there are exceptions, those are becoming more and more rare!

    Having more dealers will not help them.

    Most of those that do buy new are afraid to drive them!!!!!!!!!!!!! Look at all the 360's for sale with VERY low miles..........most all of them.
  23. labcars

    labcars Formula 3
    Rossa Subscribed

    Jan 22, 2003
    Phila. + Scottsdale
    Gus, you read it right! Store is expected to open by October. I doing great, in spite of the crappy winter. My 246 is in desperate search of a right elring gasket, then we're done!!! Expect to have it back from Tim Stanford's by mid-end March. Then we cruise, Dude!!!! Spring is just around the corner!!!
  24. norm

    norm Karting

    May 30, 2003
    Rochester, NY
    If Ferrari has added dealers, the number has been insignificant. It would appear to me that it is just the periodic re-shuffling of the deck. Given that production volumes are relatively stagnant in recent years, it does not appear to me that the brand is being diluted by too many dealers. Especially, with the customers waiting for extended periods to get cars. You don't hear Ferrari dealers complaing about having to floor plan inventory due to it not moving. I don't see them discounting the cars to move them as well.

    As far as the poor-me attitude of the dealer, too bad. If additional dealers would change the attitude and pricing of existing dealers, I am in favor of it. Just call a dealer for a replacement part, or get a quote on service work, and listen to their take-it, ot leave-it, this is the price attitude.

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