Does Anyone Run a MSD in Their 250?

Why would you want to do that, Lussos run just fine on their point ignition?

 

I have customers who have sought a more reliable and apparently stronger spark with later 330/365 engines, but never on 250's. If correctly set up, I personally think they are all just fine without. Don't bother. Get an ace mechanic instead.

Mark Shannon

 

I have run multiple discharge spark amplifiers on points cars (Detroit iron) and they greatly improve cold starts and all-around driveability. It is widely accepted that they add about 5 horsepower to 5 liter and up engines. I prefer Crane to MSD for reliability reasons. Too many MSDs have crapped out on me, but Cranes never have.

 

No Mark. It would be like replacing the guts of a vintage Omega with Taiwanese quartz.

john

 

+ 1.

 

My mechanic once opined it was "using a flamethrower to light a teaspoon of gasoline" and that is correct, the MSD function is a "burst" of sparking....on the trailing side of the ignition signal

I have used them on a Ferrari points fired ignition, but the input wiring to the amplifier unit was not done properly and it caused a lot of expensive damage.

I can only assume someone that UNDERSTOOD and actually read the wiring directions could handle it for you. The input wiring is pretty heavy to the amplifier, like #10AWG or something.

Not lamp zip cord!
Or maybe it was speaker wire....whatever!

 

Correct, you can try it and see how it goes.

 

I would try to avoid methanol fuel altogether if possible in that vintage engine.
Did the rebuild include modern 'ethanol rated" fuel lines to all those carbs?

Seriously asking, not trying to bust your chops on anything...

Methanol doesn't effect flammability as much as it does total BTU output......you pay in diminished horsepower for using it.

But you DO help out all those corn farmers, AMERICANS, dammit!

 

As per customer request I've installed a pair of MSD units onto a customer's 250GTE with stock ignition points in distributers. Worked great and car ran just fine. Can't claim it made a major performance improvement over a proper running 250GT. No down side, just a pain to install and wire up to keep looking original so I installed and hid MSD units in trunk. I would recommend having an alternater versus generater for adequate voltage.

 

That's a good point I had not thought about in the older cars......

As you point out, if it ran good before, it still will!!

Did you see any difference in unburned HCs at all, in the exhaust analysis??

 

Another advantage of Crane units: they're smaller than the MSDs, and they're black.

 

If you want an ignition improvement, I would highly recommend switching to fine point (positive and ground) iridium tip plugs. I think Nippon Denso has the better set-up but NGK is pretty good; I have no experience with the Champion version. The fine points in the plug will allow you to run a wider gap with the stock ignition system. The wider gap will give you a larger, more exposed ignition kernel providing a better combustion source.

Regards,

Art S.

PS. I do advanced ignition systems for a living ( www.knite.com )

 

I have been tempted to upgrade my 330GT ignition on numerous occasions, but it runs great on points and every time I research ignition upgrades it seems like those who have upgraded have eventually had problems with the them. It seems like the points-fired systems are less problematic than Pertronix though. Ethanal gas seems to be everywhere, not just CA. I haven't found a non-methanal gas station in NJ, but haven't had any problems running methanal ever.

Art - interesting info. What plug brand/model are you running in your 330GT and how wide do you set the gap?

 

Mark, don't do it. Please take no offense but it is part of that American restoration process. Next thing you will be putting a Chevy V8 in it.

 

Peter,

Mine ran fine on standard NGKs. Right now my car is off the road - engine rebuilt, body will (hopefully) be done soon. Once its back, if it needs an ignition improvement (which I doubt), I will do what I described above.

Regards,

Art S.

PS. I don't remember the gap off hand, but they allow for an increase of around 0.010" - 0.020" over standard plugs.

 

Ah jeez, Mark, do whatever the hell you want...it's your car and the boxes can be removed. I have them (MSD) in my Daytona (granted, the car came with an electronic ignition system of sorts). It is nice to forget about points, but I can't tell if it really runs better because it ran like stinko when I first got it and I did many things to help out. The wires from one unit need to be well separated from those of the other to prevent interference (not an EE, so don't ask me any other questions about that), need correct plug wires (I found some near perfect red wires for the Daytona, and made my own) and big honker plug wires. As noted by Big Tex, 10g sounds right to me. s

 

Thanks for the info. I may try this next time I change the plugs. Sounds like your car is getting the works -- look forward to seeing it when it's done. I've been driving mine quite a bit lately and enjoying every second of it. Hope to go to the C&C in Chatham this Sunday morning (http://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/showthread.php?t=386705).

 

The Crane optically triggered unit is the easiest to install and in my opinion, the best buy.
The last one I did was in a 275 GTB/4 and it worked flawlessly.
No moving parts, and once set, no adjustments. The model XR700 is the ticket.

Another advantage is that you can install both pickups in one distributor.
If you put them in the right distrbutor, set one for the right bank and the other for the left.
The output from the right timed module goes to the right coil and the left timed module goes the the left coil.

Once it's proberly adjusted, it's good for life - NOTHING to adjust.

You can use the stock coils but you do not need ballast resistors.
Better yet, upgrade to Bosch Blue coils and paint them red!
Should you get tired of the optical system (which I seriously doubt), you can always revert back to the stock system.
If you wish to hide the modules, just put them under or in back of the glove box.

And, in total aggreement with Steve, IT'S YOU CAR, do what you want to it and just enjoy the driving.

Bob Z.

 

http://www.summitracing.com/parts/CRN-700-0231/SuggestedParts/?query=Engine+Type%7cV12%7cMake%7cFERRARI%7cModel%7c330+GTC

 

Well, there you have it. If Bob can put it in a 275 GTB/4, have at it. The MSD box is nearly 2X as much, so I wish I'd have done that, too. Looks a bit smaller also, but I didn't measure them. Either way, I don't think you'll be unhappy. I think it was Bob who suggested the Bosch coils and that's what I put in my 330 GTC, tho' it still has points, but no ballast resistor. I too, painted those coils red, as instructed! s

 

How about other ignition mods that may be less invasive?

Has anyone tried the MSD (Blaster 2) coils which put out 45kV instead of Marelli's 30kV? The cans would look identical to the 60's Marelli's if you peeled the decals and painted them the right shade of red.

What about the Denso thin-electrode plugs? Anyone tried these?

Thanks.

john