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348 Door Electrical Harness Woes

Discussion in '348/355' started by 348Jeff, Sep 19, 2023.

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  1. 348Jeff

    348Jeff Formula 3

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    #1 348Jeff, Sep 19, 2023
    Whilst recently replacing the RHS wing on my RHD UK car I had to disconnect the multi-pin wiring connector that runs from the door and through the wing. Unfortunately once back together my LHS door window no longer operates and neither does the up/down adjustment of the mirror.

    I've split the connector apart and removed the door strake panel and pulled the connector through for access. Upon closer inspection, you can see that a yellow/black wire has broken away from the connector, there's another one that is hanging on by a few strands of copper and a couple of the socket parts look to be pushed in.

    To add to my woes the window is in the down position and after a couple of weeks of glorious sunshine the weather has turned dreadful so I can't drive the car anywhere to an auto electrician.

    I thought I could do it myself by just extracting the pin and replacing it once reattached to the wire but I cant even get the pin out using the key like tool I bought off ebay. Any suggestions and in particular a source in teh UK for buying the connectors? I believe these in the link below may be the right ones but I'm not 100% sure

    https://uk.farnell.com/amp-te-connectivity/1-66100-9/contact-socket-awg18-16/dp/1772747?st=1-66100-9

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  2. Qavion

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    #2 Qavion, Sep 19, 2023
    Can you solder a piece of wire onto the pin (at the rear of the plug) to help you remove the pin? Usually you need to pull/jiggle on the pin as you are using the tool.

    There's a full tutorial on how to repin the connector (in French), but there is no mention of replacing the plug. Usually that's ok.
     

    Attached Files:

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  3. 348Jeff

    348Jeff Formula 3

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    #3 348Jeff, Sep 19, 2023
    Thanks for that Ian - what a shame it's in French! :-(

    I reckon I could drop a blob of solder on there but if I'm going to solder a wire on it I might as well solder the original back on. Ideally I would like to repin it properly if possible
     
  4. Qavion

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    #4 Qavion, Sep 19, 2023
    What number do you have written on your connector?

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    I think that's 927381, but Google is not giving me any hits. It's an Amphenol/TE Connectivity connector.
     
  5. Qavion

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    #5 Qavion, Sep 19, 2023
    If you have a smartphone with Google Translate or something similar on it, usually you can use the camera function of that app. and it will translate live.
     
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  6. m.stojanovic

    m.stojanovic F1 Rookie
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    #6 m.stojanovic, Sep 19, 2023
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  7. Qavion

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    #7 Qavion, Sep 20, 2023
  8. 348Jeff

    348Jeff Formula 3

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    #8 348Jeff, Sep 20, 2023
    I don't know Ian - it was just like that once I disconnected it so impossible to say whether it was already like that when I undid it or whether the disconnecting damaged it.

    Milo, all my pins look the same size (all in tact BTW) - are the connectors you've shown above the same size pin as the original but a bigger diameter at the back to take different gauges of wire? Reason I ask is all the pin side of teh socket are just fine - its just the female connects that are damaged
     
  9. 348Jeff

    348Jeff Formula 3

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    #9 348Jeff, Sep 20, 2023
    Just for future reference (particularly anyone in UK) I've just had a live chat with Farnell and the products are:


    Pin AMP 66099 16-18 AWG - https://uk.farnell.com/amp-te-connectivity/66099-2/contact-pin-crimp/dp/1653844

    Pin AMP 66400 20-24 AWG - https://uk.farnell.com/amp-te-connectivity/1-66400-0/contact-pin-crimp-d-sub/dp/1653826

    Socket AMP 66101 16-18 AWG https://uk.farnell.com/amp-te-connectivity/66101-1/contact-socket-18-16awg-crimp/dp/3404522

    Socket AMP 66399 20-24 AWG https://uk.farnell.com/amp-te-connectivity/66399-2/contact-socket-24-20awg-crimp/dp/1394332


    Extraction Tool - https://uk.farnell.com/te-connectivity/305183/extraction-tool-series-1/dp/1680528

    Crimp Tool - https://uk.farnell.com/amp-te-connectivity/58495-1/crimp-tool-tyco-amp-type-i/dp/1653505

    Insertion Tool - https://uk.farnell.com/amp-te-connectivity/200893-2/insertion-tool-series-1/dp/9629661

    Thank you once again to Milo for the original list of part nos
     
  10. m.stojanovic

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    #10 m.stojanovic, Sep 20, 2023
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2023
    The difference is only in the size of the crimping portion - blue dot bigger, yellow dot smaller, for thicker and thinner wires (AWG).

    That insertion tool is £75 !? I don't think you need it as you can insert the pin by just pushing on the wire, until it "clicks".
     
  11. 348Jeff

    348Jeff Formula 3

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    #11 348Jeff, Sep 20, 2023
    I thought that too! The crimping tool is extremely expensive as well.

    I'm still a little confused though as to how I extract the female side connector out of the housing as the video showing the tool in the above link only seems to be for the pin side - or is it both? Cant seem to find a youtube video showing how to do it.

    I can get AMP 66101 16-18 AWG delivered for tomorrow but AMP 66399 20-24 AWG is only available from the states at the moment with the resultant delay in delivering to UK. Are you saying I can use AMP 66101 16-18 AWG for any of the connectors (the wire that is broken appears to be one of the thicker gauges)?

    I've tried using one of those key-type tools from both the front and back and although I can rotate the broken connector round and around it won't come out.


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  12. Qavion

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    #12 Qavion, Sep 20, 2023
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2023
    How hard are you pushing? Sometimes these connectors need a surprising amount of force. This type of tool should only be used on the front (mating) side of the connector (as in your second photo) The tool is not to be used as an insertion/removal tool from the rear. Insertion tools are semi-circular.

    If you can't solder a wire on the other side, can you get some needle-nosed pliers on the socket to help pull it out (when using the tool)?
     
  13. 348Jeff

    348Jeff Formula 3

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    #13 348Jeff, Sep 20, 2023
    Ok I've just given it another try and was a bit more brutal...success - I've managed to remove the 2 broken pins - yay! Just got to find the connectors now

    The way I did it (rightly or wrongly) is to insert the key tool from the mating side then from the other side I forced it out with a jewellers screwdriver.

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    The 2 broken wires are of different gauges but the connectors do look the same

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  14. m.stojanovic

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    #14 m.stojanovic, Sep 20, 2023
    The removal tool is inserted from the front and you then either push the pin (male or female) with the plunger of the special tool (like Eclipse I showed above) or pull on the wire. If the wire has broken-off, and if you cannot catch the back of the pin with small long nose pliers, then the only way is to get the special tool with plunger with which you push the pin out from the front. This sketch shows how the special tool works:

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  15. m.stojanovic

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    #15 m.stojanovic, Sep 20, 2023
    Both pins, 16-18 AWG or 20-24 AWG, fit the connector. The only difference between them is, as I said earlier, the size of their portion for crimping which is slightly bigger on the 16-18 AWG then on the 20-24 AWG. Since your broken wires are thicker, just use the 16-18 AWG pins. And you can even use 16-18 AWG pins for any thinner wires in which case you either fold once the wire so that it "fills" the crimping receptacle better or solder the wire to the pin in addition to crimping (which I do most of the time anyway, for more reliable contact).
     
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  16. 348Jeff

    348Jeff Formula 3

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    #16 348Jeff, Sep 20, 2023
    Well some more progress has been made :)

    After getting the 2 broken pins out and whilst looking for an auto electrician I stumbled across an electronics repair business who when I showed him the 2 wires and connectors he offered to solder some new wires onto my connectors for the princely sum of £5 :)

    I've reinserted the pinned wires back into the connector and reconnected them back to the loom wires. I've done a quick test and although my passenger window still doesn't go up and down my passenger wing mirror now operates through the vertical adjustment that it didn't before. I'm going to check the fuses tomorrow first and if theyre ok I'll disconnect the connectot and look more closely to see if any other leads are broken. At least I know how/where I can get them replaced very cheaply :)


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  17. Qavion

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    #17 Qavion, Sep 20, 2023
    That yellow/black wire that was repaired should be related to the passenger door window (pin 22 on the connector). The black wire on pin 13, affects a number of things, including the control for both windows, the doorlock and mirrors.

    Are you sure there are no more broken wires? Specifically the white/red wire on pin 15:

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  18. Qavion

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    #18 Qavion, Sep 20, 2023
    Disregard... I got my wires crossed. That's the driver's window power.

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  19. Qavion

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    #19 Qavion, Sep 20, 2023
    Back to basics....

    Is fuse 23 ok? (Passenger Window)

    Does the passenger window work from the window switch on the passenger door?

    Who did the repair on the yellow/red wire? Is this recent?

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    This is also related to the passenger window.
     
  20. 348Jeff

    348Jeff Formula 3

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    #20 348Jeff, Sep 20, 2023
    Any previous repairs were done by previous owners - this is the first time I've had a problem.

    Ill check about the other switch but I have noticed the passenger side switches are not illuminated.

    Dont firget its a UK RHD car so when you say passenger are you talking about my driver side and vice versa

    Ill look tomorrow for any suspect wires and check teh fuse too
     
  21. Qavion

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    #21 Qavion, Sep 20, 2023
    Last edited: Sep 20, 2023
    Actually, I've been trying to get the terminology correct for you. My 348 diagrams are Euro/USA biased, but I understand that the door with the two window switches is on the right hand side on your car. Having worked on my own RHD car and using Euro or USA diagrams, I understand the confusion.
     
  22. Qavion

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    #22 Qavion, Sep 20, 2023
    Illumination usually comes from the power wire (i.e. power from the passenger window fuse). Make sure that the passenger window switch is actually plugged in, as this can affect the operation of both passenger window switches.
     
  23. Steve Magnusson

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    #23 Steve Magnusson, Sep 20, 2023
    That's exactly what you should do. You can't just shove the tool over the "wings" from the mating side as the ends of the wings will drag and hang up on the plastic. When the wire is still connected to the terminal:

    1. Place the tool over the terminal from the mating side,
    2. push the wire further into the connector from the backside to force the terminal into the tool (or use a jewelers screw driver like you did to push on the back end of the terminal) so the wings get fully compressed inside the tool,
    3. then push the tool back into the connector from the mating side until the end of the tool bottoms on the plastic connector,
    4. then pull the wire and terminal out from the backside.

    The trick is to get the terminal and the wings fully into the tool before puling it out backwards.
     
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  24. Qavion

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    #24 Qavion, Sep 20, 2023
    I assume your passenger footwell relay/fuse panel is also upside down like mine, so fuse 23 will be on the top row of fuses.

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    Maybe with all these loose wires floating around, a power wire shorted to ground?

    I've just modified most of the labels on my 348 Window diagram so that "driver" or "passenger" is shown, not "left" or "right".

    https://www.dropbox.com/t/c9CsaTPuAfcIDKhy
     
  25. 348Jeff

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    #25 348Jeff, Sep 21, 2023
    Good news - looks like my wiring job was OK and it was a blown fuse that I assume happened when the wires became disconnected. Just to persuade the connector/bellows etc to all go back in place neatly then retest everything plus test all the fuses whilst I'm on there. Really appreciate all the help you've all been giving me.

    Here are some pics of the UK RHD fuse board and the "explanatory panel" on the fold-down cover - not the easiest thing to read as the writing is upside down to be a matching orientation for a RHD car. Someone could do with making a sticker to overlay it the right way round.


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