ECU 4131 - Get out the Flatbed | FerrariChat

ECU 4131 - Get out the Flatbed

Discussion in '348/355' started by roverelf, Nov 10, 2007.

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  1. roverelf

    roverelf Rookie

    Aug 26, 2005
    46
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Full Name:
    John Ellefson
    Well, thanks for all the guidance everybody, but I think it is flatbed time. I swapped the MAFs, which didn't help. I can no longer even get the car to start. Turns over just fine, but that's it. Any suggestions for a good mechanic in Pittsburgh area?

    John
     
  2. No Doubt

    No Doubt Seven Time F1 World Champ

    May 21, 2005
    72,740
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    Mr. Sideways
    Before you go flatbeading your car anywhere, I'd suggest buying a $2 spray can of starter fluid. Spray liberally into your air intake and then see if she starts right up.

    if she starts up and then dies, you have a fuel flow problem. If she doesn't start, then you have a spark problem.

    For $2, narrowing down your problem is a worthwhile investment...and anyone can spray a can of starter fluid.
     
  3. PAP 348

    PAP 348 Ten Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Dec 10, 2005
    100,234
    Mount Isa, Australia
    Full Name:
    Pap


    Thats what I would do. ;);)

    That will put you on the right path to solve this issue. Even if you do not attempt to fix this problem yourself, you can pass on the info onto the mechanic. That will save him time and you money as he will not have to look into the spark side of things, if it is indeed a fuel problem. And vice versa if its spark related. :):)
     
  4. roverelf

    roverelf Rookie

    Aug 26, 2005
    46
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Full Name:
    John Ellefson
    I'll try that. I haven't gotten a plug out yet. Honestly, I can't even see where they are. Any advice? On my way to Pep Boys for starting fluid.........

    Thanks,
    John
     
  5. Ricambi America

    Ricambi America F1 World Champ
    Sponsor Owner

    The coverplate that says "Ferrari" must be removed to see the plugs.. There are about 10 nuts that hold each plate, and a paper gasket underneath.
     
  6. roverelf

    roverelf Rookie

    Aug 26, 2005
    46
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Full Name:
    John Ellefson
    I thought that's where they were, but didn't want to take things off without being certain. Thanks.

    I shot some starting fluid in, but no luck. I will try taking a plug out tomorrow.

    John
     
  7. No Doubt

    No Doubt Seven Time F1 World Champ

    May 21, 2005
    72,740
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    Mr. Sideways
    No need to take out a spark...if she doesn't start with starter fluid, then you have no spark.

    I'd suggest swapping the MAFs back to see if she'll start with half your engine as before.
     
  8. roverelf

    roverelf Rookie

    Aug 26, 2005
    46
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Full Name:
    John Ellefson
    Thanks. I did swap them back earlier, and no luck. It was running on one bank, now none :(
     
  9. jetfixr

    jetfixr Formula 3

    Jun 14, 2007
    1,016
    northeast
    Full Name:
    Gone
    I'd take it to a good mechanic/shop.......Sometimes owners screw up more things than they claim to *save* in labor, (not all, but many).....Trust me......

    O2 sensor 150, MAF sensor 450 dollars, can of starter fluid down the throat 2 dollars, having an expert fix it in about an hour PRICELESS.

    Not saying you can't fix it, but lets face it, there are times when you should seek other avenues to come to a resolution, in this case a mechanic/shop.....Doctors even do it, they call it referring you to a specialist.

    I'd say you gave it an honest effort :) Good job!
     
  10. roverelf

    roverelf Rookie

    Aug 26, 2005
    46
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Full Name:
    John Ellefson
    Yep, I'm in agreement. I think I've exhausted my mechanical ability at this point. If anybody else has thoughts/ideas, I'm all ears.

    I truly appreciate al the tips, guidance, etc. I hadn't hope to spend this much time on the board in my first month of ownership, but I'm sure glad it's here. Hopefully I can be one of the voices of reason here someday........

    John
     
  11. Ricambi America

    Ricambi America F1 World Champ
    Sponsor Owner

    I'm not an expert in this field... (but I did stay at a Holiday Inn last night)

    You swapped the two Motronic ECU's in a 1995 355, right? I was under the impression that in 1995 cars, the immobilizer was progammed/keyed to just one of the ECU's, and not the other. I thought -- and I'll be the first to admit I'm wrong -- that 1995 cars when fitted with new alarms needed the ECU's swapped because the previously programmed one couldn't be reprogrammed. By taking the swapping the two units, you could pair the 'naked' ECU with the new alarm and be ready to roll. Did you return them to their original positions and try starting the car again?
     
  12. Dr_ferrari

    Dr_ferrari Formula 3
    Consultant Professional Ferrari Technician

    Nov 2, 2003
    1,073
    Pocono Sportscar
    Full Name:
    Jim McGee
    I am assuming this is a 1995 355. If it is, the 95 does not have an alarm system to worry about. most likely the spark plugs are just fouled out. I would suggest removal of the plugs, if they are fouled replace them and set the gap to .55mm. the 1995 355 was prone to this problem.

    The 95 also has two independant fuel pumps and ignition/injection systems. so if one did fail, the other side should still run.

    if that is not the issue, let me know and maybe I can help.

    best regards, Jim
     
  13. roverelf

    roverelf Rookie

    Aug 26, 2005
    46
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Full Name:
    John Ellefson
    Thanks guys. Just to clarify, it is a 95. It has an aftermarket (Alpine) alarms sytem. I did switch the MAFs back to their original position.........

    John
     
  14. roverelf

    roverelf Rookie

    Aug 26, 2005
    46
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Full Name:
    John Ellefson
    OK, I pulled all the plugs out tonight, and the LEFT bank were quite fouled. So I cleaned and re-gapped all eight. I re-installed them, and am back to where I started. Left bank is running again, and 1-4 bank is still dead.

    So I was finally able to check spark on the 1-4 bank, which was fine. I then got out the ol' starting fluid again, and filled up the intake forward of the MAF sensor. Low and behold, it seemed to fire on all cylinders for a brief second or two.

    So, correct me if I am wrong, but it appears as though I have a fuel problem on banks 1-4. I've tried swapping the fuse and the relays, but same problem. Am I right in thinking it may be a fuel pump?

    Again, thanks for all the help. It would have been on the flatbed last week without all the great feedback. I spent the better part of my weekend "learning," but that is never a bad thing.......

    John
     
  15. roverelf

    roverelf Rookie

    Aug 26, 2005
    46
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Full Name:
    John Ellefson
    Please see my above comments. For some reason, FChat didn't flag the last update.

    John
     
  16. Dr_ferrari

    Dr_ferrari Formula 3
    Consultant Professional Ferrari Technician

    Nov 2, 2003
    1,073
    Pocono Sportscar
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    Jim McGee

    John,

    I suggest that you change the plugs. once a plug is fouled, you cannot really totally clean it. do Both banks at the same time. set the gap at .55mm and you should be just fine.

    If you remove the plugs on the 1/4 bank and they are fouled then I would believe you do not have a fuel supply problem in that bank.

    If the plugs are dry, check the fuse and relay for the right bank fuel pump.

    best regards, Jim
     
  17. roverelf

    roverelf Rookie

    Aug 26, 2005
    46
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Full Name:
    John Ellefson
    Thanks Jim. I plan on getting new plugs, but had no luck finding any today, so I thought I would clean them up to see where I was. Actually, the plugs on the 1-4 bank were MUCH cleaner than those on the "good" 5-8 bank. I've tried both the fuse and the relay, with no luck. I'm gonna keep tinkering, but I'm beginning to think the right side pump may be bad......

    John
     
  18. No Doubt

    No Doubt Seven Time F1 World Champ

    May 21, 2005
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    Mr. Sideways
    #18 No Doubt, Nov 11, 2007
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    Well, you'd think that the pump on that side...or that the signal to that pump...would be bad.

    So you jump the relay to that pump. That tells you if the fuel pump on that side is working...or if the problem is the signal to the relay.

    Here's a picture of Miltonian jumping a Bosch relay (applies to most of them). Insert your jumper wire into the same terminals, but for the 1-4 right side fuel pump relay to see if the fuel pump works at all.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  19. roverelf

    roverelf Rookie

    Aug 26, 2005
    46
    Pittsburgh, PA
    Full Name:
    John Ellefson
    Thanks, particularly for the photo! That will be my quest after work tomorrow. I seek the holy grail.....

    John
     
  20. f355spider

    f355spider F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    May 29, 2001
    18,055
    USA
    Careful, that pic above is a 348 fuse panel, not a 95 355, in case you didn't notice. Good luck, you are getting closer! If the pump is working it might be the fuel filter is plugged.
     
  21. ernie

    ernie Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Nov 19, 2001
    22,620
    The Brickyard
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    The Bad Guy
    Or you have a bad fuel pressure regulator.

    But before anything, do as the good Doctor suggested and put in some new plugs.
     
  22. jetfixr

    jetfixr Formula 3

    Jun 14, 2007
    1,016
    northeast
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    Gone

    Daniel,

    Now the Holiday thing made me S**t myself laughing!!!!!

    Pretty good!!!

    'your buddy Ian
     

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