electrical ground issue | FerrariChat

electrical ground issue

Discussion in '456/550/575' started by stevepaa, Jan 8, 2019.

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  1. stevepaa

    stevepaa Formula Junior
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Apr 5, 2006
    708
    san jose, ca
    Full Name:
    steve
    About two weeks ago, I drove about ten miles to a Jag dealer to look at i-pace. After test drive, I went to start the 575 and no go with F1 tranny icon on.
    Sent it off to the mechanic who had just replaced my F1 clutch sensor. It was a dead battery. Battery would accept a charge but then go dead, and it was 3 years old and has been on a maintainer when not in use, usually with battery ground switch in off position so that battery negative terminal was not connected to car. Bought a new battery and everything was fine.

    Today, I was adding a new electrical item to my car which needed to be grounded. I turned on battery switch to connect battery negative terminal to car structure and I found 24 ohms everywhere I measured grounds. I disconnected positive terminal and get 0.4 ohms.
    Turn battery ground switch to disconnect battery ground from car and get 108 K ohms.

    Any ideas why this happens?
     
  2. stevepaa

    stevepaa Formula Junior
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    A learned guess from a friend suggests a voltage leak/short in a relay or ecu. Will try to isolate cause.
     
  3. stevepaa

    stevepaa Formula Junior
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    Going through all relays and ECU and connectors unitl I find cause. It sure would be nice if there was a real wiring diagram to go by. I am used to having complete diagrams even down to pin-outs on connectors.
     
  4. scowman

    scowman Formula 3

    Mar 25, 2014
    2,498
    Scottsdale AZ
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    Stu Boogie
    I have the same voltage leak issue. Pull fuses until you find which circuit it is on. If that does not work it’s before the fuse board or possibly starter or alternator circuit.

    I found mine had higher than spec fuse. It was on the interior light and cigarette lighter. I still haven’t found the soucr but st least I have isolated from the battery.
     
  5. stevepaa

    stevepaa Formula Junior
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    Apr 5, 2006
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    I have two, ABS circuit and secondary air pump circuit. I will raise front end on ramps to check out the two items tomorrow.
    Meanwhile I need to have someone look at their fuse boxes over by battery and tell me if I have the correct arrangement on mine.
    Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  6. Konadog06

    Konadog06 Formula Junior
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    Aug 22, 2007
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  7. Motob

    Motob Formula 3
    Professional Ferrari Technician

    Nov 11, 2003
    2,238
    Frederick, Maryland
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    Brian Brown
    You cannot check the ground circuit by measuring resistance with the battery connected. It is much better to check for excessive resistance in a circuit using a voltage drop method.
    If you are looking for an excessive draw that is causing the battery to discharge, then you have to measure no-load current draw on the battery using and ammeter connected in series.
     
  8. stevepaa

    stevepaa Formula Junior
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    How would either of those methods isolate the module or connector at fault?
     
  9. scowman

    scowman Formula 3

    Mar 25, 2014
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    Agreed. I think the isolation method is best. Pull fuses until the problem goes away. Then trace that circuit down.
     
  10. stevepaa

    stevepaa Formula Junior
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    #10 stevepaa, Feb 4, 2019
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2019
  11. stevepaa

    stevepaa Formula Junior
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  12. stevepaa

    stevepaa Formula Junior
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  13. stevepaa

    stevepaa Formula Junior
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    I wonder why Ferrari put 80 A fuses on smaller gage wire than the 60A fuses
     
  14. stevepaa

    stevepaa Formula Junior
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  15. stevepaa

    stevepaa Formula Junior
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    #15 stevepaa, Feb 4, 2019
    Last edited: Feb 4, 2019
    just like schematic from WSM

    I will now try to track them down.
     

    Attached Files:

  16. Konadog06

    Konadog06 Formula Junior
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    Aug 22, 2007
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    Steve, thanks for your note on boxes L & M. If I’m able to confirm their positions are reversed any idea how difficult to reverse back. There are no known issues or any known history or reasons for this to have happened. I noticed upon removing the caps to take the picture for you that one 30A fuse appeared to be replacement. And then that the fuse positions didn’t match yours. My next move was to reference the WSM. You beat me to it.
    Will do the test and if it’s easy switch them back if needed. Otherwise will leave as is. Thanks for your thoughts!
     
  17. stevepaa

    stevepaa Formula Junior
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    I think you can leave them alone as long as you label them correctly. It tis easy to reverse poison by using a small screwdriver on two tabs between the two holders and pull up. Then remove screw holding plate to wall and remove other other holder from plate and then reinstall in reverse order. I suspect if you look closely behind the holders you will see that cables are crossed.
     
  18. stevepaa

    stevepaa Formula Junior
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    #18 stevepaa, Feb 6, 2019
    Last edited: Feb 6, 2019
    Bill
    Your arrangement is correct. The pic in the WSM is backwards. L is M, and M is L. After I traced 6 of the wires my setup now looks like yours. Only the two master wires and the F 1 wire come into passenger footwell area. The 2 fan and air pump wires go over to the relay box on driver side of engine bay. I am still trying to trace the ABS and AC lines. I will post new diagrams when I finish.

    So my voltage leak is from the two master circuit wires!
     
  19. scowman

    scowman Formula 3

    Mar 25, 2014
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    Stu Boogie
    Are they pre or post fuse from battery? If pre fuse your leak could be on starter or alternator wires. My 456 alternator wire takes a beating winding its way down there from the battery.
     
  20. stevepaa

    stevepaa Formula Junior
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    Past fuses from battery. I will start pulling fuses inside car.
     
  21. stevepaa

    stevepaa Formula Junior
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  22. Cribbj

    Cribbj Formula 3

    Alternators are infamous for having leaky diodes. I would start there and disconnect the wires going to it.
     
  23. stevepaa

    stevepaa Formula Junior
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    Well, after pulling and reinserting all fuses and relays, the problem is gone. In process it was fuse 30 for door lights which indicated something. When I went to pull connector at door jamb I noticed that the locking mechanism was not fully down on the connector. Removed and reinserted completely and locked down and now no issue. Go figure.

    The door had been taken apart during one of the PO time, and I had to fix the pull as it was not aligned when I bought it. Maybe they had pulled the jamb connector for some reason?

    Now I can get back to driving it. :)
     
  24. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
    Consultant Owner

    Aug 10, 2002
    26,369
    socal
    Isn’t that amazing. It was 1/2 cocked for an electric drain.
     

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