Engine Code P0116 | FerrariChat

Engine Code P0116

Discussion in '456/550/575' started by 00 550, Jul 22, 2018.

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  1. 00 550

    00 550 Formula Junior

    Oct 20, 2009
    412
    FL
    Full Name:
    That guy
    I have been getting code p0116 and it is apparently a fault with the cooling system temp sensor. I just ordered the two sensors (number 33 in diagram) from Daniel but I went out to see where they were located and I couldn't find them in the engine bay. Is this a complicated disassemble or straight forward? I have a feeling its going to be a cluster to get to them.. Image Unavailable, Please Login
     
  2. AVIMAX

    AVIMAX Formula Junior

    Aug 5, 2014
    710
    Toronto
    Full Name:
    Ryan
    Need to remove the intake manifold to get to them. There are 3 sensors. Two of item 33 and one item 39. The #33 sensors control the fans. The #39 sensor is the signal for the gauge and I think also a signal for the ECU.
     
    alanF456M likes this.
  3. 00 550

    00 550 Formula Junior

    Oct 20, 2009
    412
    FL
    Full Name:
    That guy
    To follow up...So I had been noticing that my temp gauge was steadily increasing over the last few months after warm up to about 3/4 of the way. Fans would kick in and bring it down, and I know its August, but it has definitely been struggling to stay at 190 degrees so I purchased the two temp sensors as well as the #39 sensor as suggested by AVIMAX. The other day temp gauge got almost to red and as I was pulling into garage and turned off engine steam began to billow out of engine bay. I quickly popped hood and turned my garage fan on to cool things down and noticed that all the steam was coming from under intake manifold where the two suspect hoses reside. Many thanks to Pete (Moorfan) for his excellent thread on "550 sorting" and his personal assistance in helping me remove the air intake. I have replaced all three sensors and am waiting for delivery of the 3 hoses underneath the manifold. The two suspect ones appear fine, but I am planning to replace anyway since they have been there for about 8 years. The long one from expansion tank to back of #37 in the above diagram had burst and was the cause of all the steam At least tit happened as I pulled in garage, avoiding a tow (see pics). I have two questions that hopefully someone can provide insight to. I had previously replaced the two manifold sensors but not the third "sender." Do the temp sensors have a lifespan of only around 8 years or can I assume my problem was the sender not telling the fan to kick in correctly as i was receiving code P0016. Secondly, this is the second time that the hose from the expansion tank to rear of #37 has burst on me. I am wondering why that has happened again...Is it possible the side of the hose makes contact with the manifold and the heat is too much for it to handle? There doesn't seem to be any way to secure that hose from making contact, it just runs through the space in the back of the intake manifold to its destination.

    One other thing, the gaskets for the air intake were different from one side to the other. One side felt like the usual gasket i grew up knowing, thick and almost paper like. The other side felt thin and like plastic with some red sealant material on it and seemed to be lesser quality (you can see the difference in pic). Not sure which is the correct or better, but I have replacements on the way from Daniel at Ricambi.

    I hope I can get it all back together without any leftover parts!
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    Il Tifoso likes this.
  4. moorfan

    moorfan Formula Junior

    May 11, 2009
    809
    Central Virginia
    Full Name:
    Pete
    The hose that you have in the picture looks rather "flimsy", I assume that is from the factory supply chain? Buy a hose kit from Scuderia Rampante and you will never have a hose go bad again.
    Dave Helms made those hoses RIGHT!
     
  5. 00 550

    00 550 Formula Junior

    Oct 20, 2009
    412
    FL
    Full Name:
    That guy
    I agree it felt flimsy, but I thought it was just from being old. It said it was "fuel" on it, but didn't I notice the rating
     
  6. F456M

    F456M F1 Rookie

    Jan 8, 2010
    3,696
    Oslo
    Full Name:
    Erik
    Maybe check your injectors aswell when you have them out already...
     
  7. 00 550

    00 550 Formula Junior

    Oct 20, 2009
    412
    FL
    Full Name:
    That guy
    Ok, so after replacing all the hoses and sensors and buttoning it back up it seems to be at the appropriate temperature (needle straight up at 190 degrees) with no leaks and no "temp out of range" CEL. Only one problem, I am getting the p0310 CEL again that started this whole saga and the exhaust note is awful. Clearly cylinder 10 misfiring. I have replaced the spark plug, the ignition harness, injectors to Mr. Injector and they function well. I have double checked that the injection harness plug is on correctly. I think that leaves the wiring harness to the injectors or something computer related. Am i missing something??? I am going to punch a wall if I have to take the intake back off again! Again the oddest thing is it comes and goes. Engine cold->no problem, after it heats up to running temp thats when it begins to misfire, and even then it is not all the time. Any ideas?
     
  8. 00 550

    00 550 Formula Junior

    Oct 20, 2009
    412
    FL
    Full Name:
    That guy
  9. henryr

    henryr Two Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 10, 2003
    22,362
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    Juan Sánchez Villa-L
    550 right ? i would go thru and check all the connections.

    there is a reason helms makes the gold kit for the 550/456 cars

    does it feel like it is misfiring or just throwing the code ?
     
  10. 00 550

    00 550 Formula Junior

    Oct 20, 2009
    412
    FL
    Full Name:
    That guy
    Its definitely misfiring. I can hear the change in engine sound before CEL comes on. Yeah I emailed Scuderia Rampante this am to ask about injector harness. By gold kit are you referring the harness or the fuse box fix?
     
  11. henryr

    henryr Two Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 10, 2003
    22,362
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    Juan Sánchez Villa-L
    the harness.
     
  12. Cribbj

    Cribbj Formula 3
    BANNED

    Also put an inductive timing light on the HT lead going to #10 spark plug and see if it's flashing.

    There are devices called 'noids that will allow you to do the same check for all injectors - they're cheap and a good investment.
     
  13. 00 550

    00 550 Formula Junior

    Oct 20, 2009
    412
    FL
    Full Name:
    That guy
    Thanks John. I didn’t even know those things existed. Like I said, I replaced the ignition harness and the coils. So I’m thinking it’s on injection side. Sounds like I need a noid. That beats the heck out of taking intake back off and replacing injection harness and hoping that solves the problem...
     
  14. 00 550

    00 550 Formula Junior

    Oct 20, 2009
    412
    FL
    Full Name:
    That guy
    Ok. So I got a noid from autozone. By the way it’s $25 and they say you can bring it back for full refund if you want or just keep it. It’s basically a free rental. Don’t often find cool stuff like that these days. Also most people (I went to advance auto first) looked at me like I was crazy when I asked for a noid and thought I was talking about the dominos pizza ad from the 90s. Lol. Anyway...
    I started it up to make sure it was misfiring and sure enough it was stil warm enough from earlier that it was making the misfire tone. I connected the noid and it flashed on cylinder 10 injector indicating a functional harness. It looked kind of dim so I checked cylinder 12 to see if it was same and flashing was identical with same brightness. So I conclude that harness to injectors is ok. I clipped 10 back on and it seemed to seat nicely. Started up and it sounded like it’s supposed to. I’m so confused.
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  15. henryr

    henryr Two Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 10, 2003
    22,362
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    Juan Sánchez Villa-L
    so now you have no misfire ?
     
  16. henryr

    henryr Two Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 10, 2003
    22,362
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    Juan Sánchez Villa-L
    clear the codes and drive
     
  17. 00 550

    00 550 Formula Junior

    Oct 20, 2009
    412
    FL
    Full Name:
    That guy
    Not sure. Heading out now. I’m sure it will throw a code...
     
  18. 00 550

    00 550 Formula Junior

    Oct 20, 2009
    412
    FL
    Full Name:
    That guy
    No codes. Drove perfect. Even at full temp and high revs. I hope it lasts, I’m doubtful.
     
  19. Cribbj

    Cribbj Formula 3
    BANNED

    Although Dave Helms rarely (if ever) makes a mistake, you "might" have a bad crimp in the injector harness for #10. I'd wiggle the cable around at that connector and see if you can get the symptoms to reappear.
     
  20. Cribbj

    Cribbj Formula 3
    BANNED

    Any updates?
     
  21. 00 550

    00 550 Formula Junior

    Oct 20, 2009
    412
    FL
    Full Name:
    That guy
    So I drove it a few more times and same thing keeps happening. Cold start and first drive it’s fine even up to temp for 30 minutes. Turn it off and let it roast for a bit then it misfires when restarted. I have concluded it’s sometning in the cylinder and beyond my capabilities so it’s currently being evaluated by my mechanic for compression, leak down, smoke, etc... I’ll let you guys know what happens.
     
  22. henryr

    henryr Two Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Nov 10, 2003
    22,362
    Atlanta
    Full Name:
    Juan Sánchez Villa-L
    its actually misfiring (u can feel?) or just throwing a code ? that one cylinder ?
     
  23. 00 550

    00 550 Formula Junior

    Oct 20, 2009
    412
    FL
    Full Name:
    That guy
    It’s definitely misfiring. I can hear change in exhaust tone before the CEL goes on. Sounds awful when it kicks in...
     

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