348 - Engine repair thread | Page 5 | FerrariChat

348 Engine repair thread

Discussion in '348/355' started by Ferrarium, Oct 13, 2021.

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  1. Ferrarium

    Ferrarium F1 Veteran
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    Ohh and when I put the crank pully on, the timing mark on the pulley (little drilled hole) is dead nuts 12 o'clock with the mark on the block.
     
  2. m.stojanovic

    m.stojanovic F1 Rookie
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  3. m.stojanovic

    m.stojanovic F1 Rookie
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    The spacer on the belt idler pulley was there, 1.5 mm thick. It is going back in with a new Hill's pulley.
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  4. Ferrarium

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    #104 Ferrarium, Dec 17, 2021
    Last edited: Dec 17, 2021
    Great thanks for the measurement. I need to make one now as they are NLA and no one has them.

    Yep I see it now, the inner key keys to the bearing that rotates with the crank, no wonder it was lined up :). Regardless when calculating true TDC with the wheel and I slip the crank pully on, the crank pully mark lines up with the block mark. Good to know that TDC mark on the crank is actual TDC on mine at least. I'll still precision slip mark the crank to the block for easy reference when the pully is off.
     

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  5. Ferrarium

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    Up next while I wait for the heads is rear shock bushings. They're definitely more collapse than front were probably due to the weight. Will do the top rear control arm bushings as I have those new in a parts bin. The lowered are a different part. Lowers can be done easier with engine in car. Getting the shock back on should be a royal pita even with the springs compressed. Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login

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  6. Ferrarium

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    May as well do control arms while I'm waiting for the heads. They come out in pieces since there's no shoulder to put a sleeve to press them out. You could cut the shoulder off the bushing etc and then try to use the sleeve. But at the end of the day it's faster just to put a slit in it and knock them out.

    There's the bushing out in pieces next to a brand new bushing and the second picture is the outer bushing sleeve out next to one still in the control arm. Image Unavailable, Please Login Image Unavailable, Please Login

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  7. Ferrarium

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    Item of note, I spent time to remove a rubber insert without destroying or melting it. As you can see its in great shape. The bushing rubber is not under pressure, the bushing has a sleeve which is supported with steel washers inside the housing Thus the bushings are riding on the washers. Unless yours are visibly dry rotted there is no need to change them. I want to refinish the control arms as they have a slight bit of corrosion around the bushing flanges.
     

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  8. Ferrarium

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    Second, I got one of those new fangled water pumps. The locating pins did not fit my housing. Its not a tricky alignment thing, I knocked them out and they physically do not fit. Few hundredths too large. So knock them out and swap them, problem solved. The pins from the new pump go into the bin. Water pump want together smooth after that. Always something... Ordered Stainless bolts from McmasterCarr they are M8 1.20 x 50mm and 55 mm. Two of each they come in a pack of 10.

    Still waiting on heads... Running out of nickel and dime things to do. So I will put on new shock springs and shock collars and rubber spacers. Waiting for those too.
     

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  9. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
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    You need to contact the water pump manufacturer / seller and give them negative feedback.
     
  10. Ricambi America

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    He did. It is being addressed in the next batch from the manufacturer.
     
  11. Ferrarium

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    It was SO easy to resolve I just assumed that was the process. Figured someone else down the road may not realize you can just swap those bosses so I figured I'd mention it is all.

    New water pump in, all new hardware new thermostat new gaskets. I use metric fastener torque specs for the m6 and M8 studs. I lightly oiled. Image Unavailable, Please Login


    Lots of TDC marks.

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  12. Ferrarium

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    Check out the gangster new suspension bolts I bought them from Daniel about 2 years ago. Knowing one day this day would come. You know because someone else besides me touched the motor. Only reason that happened actually is because of the time I bought the car we were living in a high-rise and I had no actual garage.

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  13. KevZep

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    Mine was like that too, but not only that, the mating surface was not "true", I had to correct that as well. I found this out when I tightened the pump up, it started binding slightly, not a lot but enough to be concerning, so I got it on my friends milling machine and sorted that out too.
    I reamed the holes to fit the dowels, it was extremely close but would never go together.
    Do yourself a favour and do a dry fit without the gasket to check the surface is true.
     
  14. Ferrarium

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    Dang good call, its together already. :mad: I am guessing when I pressure test it it will reveal if its not true. I would not ream the housing holes, I would turn down the dowels first, or swap them, that housing the pump bolts to is spendy and may need the OEM water pump one day. :eek:
     
  15. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
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    Not a new problem ...
     
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  16. KevZep

    KevZep Formula Junior

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    In hindsight it might have been better to swap the dowels, but reaming was the way I went, I do not see me ever needing to put an OEM pump in it anyway, I'm not sure you can even get them can you? Isn't that part of the reason the Hill's one are made? Apart from the cavitation issue?
    In any case I think the Hills solution is a good one, and so far nearly 18 months after fitting it, no issues at all. Ive done over 5,000miles on my engine out as a reference.
     
  17. KevZep

    KevZep Formula Junior

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    Not surprising, but also, not bagging the product as it is a good solution, I'd also add, that with these after-market products I always expect some sort of issue.
    I didn't see it as a big issue, it was easy enough to sort it.
     
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  18. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

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    Part of the reason for those is they take the shear loads being placed on the pump by the belt. And in your case it is not just the load of a waterpump belt. it is a much greater load in the form of a timing belt. I would never in a million years run it without them. Bolts are not designed to handle shear loads. They are designed to create clamping pressure which is supposed to take that load but there is a paper gasket there. How well do you think a paper gasket will handle the shear load of a timing belt?
     
  19. Ferrarium

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    #119 Ferrarium, Dec 30, 2021
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2021
    Oh no I have the dowel pins in place I just used the dowel pins from the original pump and put them in the aftermarket pump and then assembled it to the housing. Dowl pins are intact but the original ones not the ones that came with the pump. Snug fit they are.

    Excellent point, great explanation.

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  20. johnk...

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    #120 johnk..., Dec 30, 2021
    Last edited: Dec 30, 2021


    Bolts are certainly designed to handle shear.

    There are lots of bolt on this car that are subject primarily to shear loads. For example, the bolt holding the suspension A arm to the chassis and hub are subject primarily to shear.

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  21. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

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    Sorry I misunderstood.
     
  22. Rifledriver

    Rifledriver Three Time F1 World Champ

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    Not according to the people in the fastener industry. There are bolts designed for shear but not your ordinary fastener.
    That bolt has a specified torque spec and is scheduled for frequent retorquing precisely because the clamping load created by that correct torque is what is supposed to take the load. Otherwise we could just leave them loose and let the nylocks prevent them from falling out on the ground.
     
  23. johnk...

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    What ever you say Brian. :rolleyes:
     
  24. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
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    These kinds of things can happen even with OEM parts. QC is never a strong point with most things. To that end 100% of the time I test fit my water pumps with wax or clay on impeller to check clearances. Everyone should do this. I have personally experienced new and rebuilt ferrari pump impellers scrape the pump body. This added friction can be a really bad day especially in a 348 for the obvious reason. Some WSM have a clearance spec for this. Rubbing is never good.
     
  25. fatbillybob

    fatbillybob Two Time F1 World Champ
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    While some bolts handle sheer, those nuts and studs are not designed to handle the shear load! Just like in your clutch pack the studs are taking the shear load with orientation of the waterpump being retained by the clamp load of the studs and nuts. The waterpump slides around within the play between the threaded studs and the larger holes in the waterpump.
     

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