F355 Market | Page 108 | FerrariChat

F355 Market

Discussion in '348/355' started by Robb, May 19, 2015.

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  1. steved033

    steved033 F1 Veteran
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    Apr 12, 2017
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    Atlanta, GA
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    Steve D.
  2. Fundlawyer

    Fundlawyer Karting

    Jul 30, 2009
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    Old Westbruy, NY
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    Douglas Hirsch
    You really need to personally inspect the car. There are not enough pictures or information. If the car needs valve guides 9k, if the car needs all stickies done, 2k, if the car needs a major, 6k, if the car needs the dampers rebuilt, 3k, if the car needs the top comverted to manual, 2k, if the car needs new brakes, tires, etc. This car could easily need 20k.
     
  3. flat_plane_eddie

    flat_plane_eddie F1 Rookie
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    Mar 30, 2013
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    Eddie
    If the car needs the major and valve guides done, it's not going to cost 15k, more like 10k. Fixing stickies and converting the top to manual can be done for less than $1,500 if you put in some elbow grease. Even if you take it to a decent independent mechanic, I doubt they'd charge 2k to convert it to manual.
     
  4. Dave rocks

    Dave rocks F1 World Champ
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    The cost of work will vary greatly based on quality. 15K is very reasonable for a major and guides - I'd be concerned about this for $10K as removing he heads is a ton of work (I've done it). A car in need of value guides will likely need valves too so the part cost will be considerable.

    $1500.00 for properly refinishing sticky parts is very optimistic too
     
  5. drbob101

    drbob101 F1 Rookie
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    Nov 26, 2012
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    Bob Ferraris
  6. jgriff

    jgriff Formula 3

    Jun 16, 2008
    1,125
    Houston, TX
  7. Giallo Modena

    Giallo Modena Rookie

    Apr 7, 2015
    44
    Minnesota
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    K
    Hey guys,

    Thought I would join the discussion.

    Looking to buy a F355 or actually hoping to trade in a FJ40 classic truck on a F355. I have researched the model but am struggling with what a decent F355 is. The one on BAT which was previously mentioned looked pretty good to me. Records, service, respray etc. look pretty authentic to me but I am sure the devil is in the details. Seems like a low mileage original car brings more but a little more scary because the maintenance between 20,000 and 30,000 miles can be astronomical. Is this true? Are the later cars a better bet in this regard?

    Most of the cars that I am intrigued with are cars in the 30,000 to 40,000 mile range. I think they are more reasonably priced and there are quite a few for sale. My rookie notions are to find a F355 with original owners manuals, records, no accidents, valve guides and manifold replacement. Basically a good documented history and straight car. Maybe a car that is less expensive and needs a major engine out so I can go through it in detail?

    Can anyone fill me in on what I am missing?
     
  8. yelcab

    yelcab F1 World Champ
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    Nov 29, 2001
    12,661
    San Carlos, CA
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    Mitchell Le
    A well sorted 355, with 30-40K miles, with all major problems taken care of, with good paint job and no accident reported, with 2 keys and with fobs, no sitckies, and a clean or redone interior with a decently fresh engine out major.... , and a folder full of documentation?

    That car? Well, $75K.

    For your first Ferrari, and a 355, you do want to go for a fully serviced, well sorted 355. Yes, that is a $75K car. Spend money now, or spend money trying to get it to spec later. Better spent up front.
     
  9. schnazzy

    schnazzy Formula Junior

    Mar 31, 2008
    494
    Seattle
    Giallo, there are tons of threads with information on what to look for and what is valuable and not. Just use the search. I'll give you a few pointers in my opinion but if you more, i'd highly suggest posting a new in the 355 section or doing some research. It's all here on the site.

    1995-1999 - IMHO 98 is the best year for the car. I wanted 1995 since it is not ODB2. All years are great with good maintenance.

    It isn't the cost of the car it's the maintenance. If you find a car for 55k, it's probably going to need 15k+ to bring it correctly with maintenance, broken items, missing items, and sticky pieces. An $80k 1997 Berlinetta should be good with few issues. A 100k car is probably prestine, under 30k miles and looks almost new.

    Physically look at the car and drive it. Get a PPI from a reputable mechanic that knows Ferrari's. Get a compression/leak down test and make sure the cylinders are fairly matched with good compression (search this site for example numbers). Don't cheap out and not do 1 or all of them.

    Convertibles seem to go for the 50's and 60's for off color, well worn, or higher mileage (40k+) cars.

    Convertibles and F1 cars have slight more amount of parts and thus some small potential for more costs.

    Valve guides (is compression good?), manifolds (could fail), records, manuals, covers, modifications (beyond headers, tires, etc.), miles, body style, color, maintenance! and general shape are all factors.
     
  10. Robbe

    Robbe Formula Junior

    Aug 22, 2013
    609
    The Netherlands
    Please explain? What I have read sofar, it is a nice , well cared for specimen.

    "accident-free Carfax shows four reported owners and consistent mileage recordings throughout the years. Many service records are included "
    "The seller performed an engine-out service in February 2017 that included replacing the timing, air conditioning, alternator, and power steering belts. The timing belt tensioners and idler rollers were also replaced along with filters, seals, gaskets, spark plugs, the coolant, and other fluids."
    "A repaint in the original Rosso Corsa was performed in 2010 at a cost of over $10k. The process involved removing most of the body panels according to the seller, and documentation of the work is provided by the seller in the gallery below"
     
  11. Giallo Modena

    Giallo Modena Rookie

    Apr 7, 2015
    44
    Minnesota
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    K
    Better spent up front.

    Yes, that is what everyone says and seems to be the best advise.

    I think part of the confusion to me is that in the past when I have looked for a car to buy, I would be looking for originality and rust free. But most of the Ferraris that I have seen are original and rust free with low mileage. For the most part they have been taken care of with no winter driving and with an engine out service with is more than most cars ever get. So, I know they are temperamental but how can you tell whether a $75,000 F355 is the right one?

    Here is one that I am looking at.

    https://www.legendcarcompany.com/1998-ferrari-f355-spider-c-41.htm?sold=Available&

    Looks good to me. 2 Owner car with the last owner barely driving it. Is this a candidate? Are there better cars out there for $75,000? Seems like there are quite a few.

    Appreciate your help.
     
  12. flat_plane_eddie

    flat_plane_eddie F1 Rookie
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    Mar 30, 2013
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    I'm going to disagree with Mitchell, that BAT car is not worth 75k. For 75k you should be getting a Berlinetta with less than 25k miles and in great shape.

    Are you looking for an open top experience or do you prefer the coupe/Berlinetta?
     
  13. flat_plane_eddie

    flat_plane_eddie F1 Rookie
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    Mar 30, 2013
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    I paid 10k for an engine out and valve guides at Fast Cars, one of the best shops in the world. I can see the bill being slightly higher but $3,500 for a glorified valve job should be more or less enough.
     
  14. Dave rocks

    Dave rocks F1 World Champ
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    Well, it's not the norm. I believe Fastcars does their own machine work so that's great. Most shops need to send it out. And, the cost depends highly on the parts needed.

    How many threads are on this site about "Majors" and what they include?

    Have you ever taken the time to add up the cost of parts on a valve job? The cost will vary based on guides, valves, seats, etc.

    Some loose prices:

    Guides: $19.00 x 40 = $760
    Valves: $37.00 x 40 $1480
    Valve seals: $1.64 x 40 = $65.60

    So, total of parts $2305.60 assuming no seats / lifters / springs. Obviously prices will vary - I used Superformance prices for this estimate.

    Heads rebuilt on one of my 355 cost $5K and that did not include the labor to remove / install the heads and the other associated parts such as exhaust manifold gaskets, head gaskets, etc.
     
  15. kenneyd

    kenneyd Formula 3
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    Sep 30, 2014
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    "Rough" would not be my choice of words at all.

    It has 38k miles, it has some minor wear on the interior, it needs leather on the dash, its missing the engine covers, and someone hasn't soaked the engine bay in armor-all. But other than that, its not a bad looking car at all.

    Considering miles, and the assuming the 2017 major service shown wasn't fabricated (highly doubt it), i think is a great spider.

    Now there are some truly beat cars out there no doubt, but Sometimes i think this forum sounds likes my 7 yr old criticizing my 4 yr old over his drawing (when its actually quite good) to make her self feel better.




    Its common to see this formula regurgitated over and over here; "a $55k 355 will always need $15k , so buy a $75k 355". And while Im sure someone has experienced this, its not always the case. They're many cars that just need a few things addressed. The other issue i have with this statement, Buying that prime $80k 355 does not exempt you from having issues with your car either.
    I encourage the buyer to get the best car they can afford, with the understanding that the cheaper ones can carry a higher risk of repairs/tlc/hidden issues
     
  16. flat_plane_eddie

    flat_plane_eddie F1 Rookie
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    Mine didn't have the valves replaced and I'm not sure they'd need to be replaced. It goes a bit beyond my technical knowledge so can't comment there. But yeah in case they have to be replaced add another $1,500 to the quote.
     
  17. Dave rocks

    Dave rocks F1 World Champ
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    Typically when valve guides fail, at least the exhaust valves will get destroyed or be in a condition that rework is not an option.

    So, my point was not to pick apart your experience, but to to really clarify that the costs are typically higher. ;)
     
  18. drbob101

    drbob101 F1 Rookie
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    Nov 26, 2012
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  19. jgriff

    jgriff Formula 3

    Jun 16, 2008
    1,125
    Houston, TX
    I stand by my assessment that this is a "rough" car.

    Interior: The center console needs a lot of work, bad shrinkage on the dash, shift knob is terribly beat up, seats have a lot of wear, dash vents and other interior pieces look extremely sticky. Non-stock carpets.

    Engine Bay: The oil reservoir paint is peeling, no shields in the engine bay. Why wasn't the peeling paint addressed during the engine out service in 2/17. That's really odd.

    Exterior: The windshield trim is the wrong color. Weird paint scheme on the brake calipers. Broken top mechanism.

    If I can see all this just in pictures there is going to be a lot more to discover in person. To me these issues are evidence that this car was not loved by a previous owner. That's scary.

    Looks like it went for $53,750. That sounds about right for this condition.
     
  20. flat_plane_eddie

    flat_plane_eddie F1 Rookie
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    Got it. In my case the car didn't have any issues, I just wanted to take care of it before/if it becomes one. So from that perspective I guess IF you're doing the valve guides just to be proactive, the valves themselves probably don't need to be replaced. Of course, an inspection with the heads off will determine this on a case by case basis.
     
  21. Giallo Modena

    Giallo Modena Rookie

    Apr 7, 2015
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    That is what is truly baffling to me.

    A low mileage $75,000 car with leak tests and everything checked out can still have major expenses according to the guy who wrote "One Year with a Ferrari"

    One Year With A Ferrari


    I have always loved the open top experience and convertibles but I do appreciate the Berlinetta.
     
  22. Dave rocks

    Dave rocks F1 World Champ
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    Well, true and not true ;)

    Here is a video I made of the car I'm restoring. Guides are fine (will be replaced) but it needs valves for sure :)

    [ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oY0jqb8Ld-4&t=11s[/ame]
     
  23. Giallo Modena

    Giallo Modena Rookie

    Apr 7, 2015
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    Minnesota
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    One other question.

    I think I can visually inspect and PPI no problem.

    What does one look for when you test drive a F355?
     
  24. schnazzy

    schnazzy Formula Junior

    Mar 31, 2008
    494
    Seattle
    Look at the car like you would any other car.
    Start in second and see if the clutch slips
    weird noices, clicking, ticking, rattling
    Steering, brakes, brake on a flat road to see if alignment is generally in the ballpark
    nicks, scratches, chips, non-factory parts like glass etc.

    It's PPI and a compression/leak down test, not just PPI. The PPI will be an event where they check the safety equipment (lights), brakes, check fluids, put it on a lift, and visually inspect (tires/brakes) and maybe even the clutch. The compression test will tell you if the engine is healthy. It probably is, but if it isn't it isn't like rebuilding a honda motor for $1500.

    For a prestine car it should come with manuals, covers, and tools. All sticky parts should be fixed.

    The car in the picture looks nice but has the passenger airbag cover been replaced? Could just be the angle but the color looks off.

    This is a silver exterior and blue interior car. Impossible to match the interior except with used parts.

    The car is missing the right engine cover which is unobtanium with the correct decals and plates. It's also missing a minor rubbor stopper on the driver side for the hood.

    It looks like some sticky items have been swapped and the driver foot shield might need to be replaced.

    Make sure the top works.

    Make sure to buy the body style, transmission, and color you want. Don't just buy one because it is cheap or close or whatever. This shouldn't be an on-the-spot decision.
     
  25. Giallo Modena

    Giallo Modena Rookie

    Apr 7, 2015
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    Minnesota
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    K

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