Ferrari Dealer Tell-All | Page 3 | FerrariChat

Ferrari Dealer Tell-All

Discussion in 'Ferrari Discussion (not model specific)' started by msark, Jan 30, 2018.

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  1. donv

    donv Two Time F1 World Champ
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Jan 5, 2002
    24,071
    Portland, Oregon
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    Don
    A little harsh, don't you think? One guy was unhappy about his deal, while others have posted that they have had good experiences there. I just had an excellent experience with the service department a few weeks ago on my 612.

    All dealerships have these sort of things happen, and there are usually two sides to the story.
     
  2. 308 milano

    308 milano F1 Veteran

    Jan 15, 2007
    5,257
    Montana
    Full Name:
    Kim
    All dealerships have this sort of thing happen? Jerk the potential buyer around and sell to a higher bidder after having contract in place ? People who conduct business in this manner make my blood boil. Wouldn’t give them the time of day when shopping for an exotic.
     
    msark likes this.
  3. Texas Forever

    Texas Forever Seven Time F1 World Champ
    Rossa Subscribed

    Apr 28, 2003
    75,990
    Texas!
    I thought there were three sides...


    Sent from my iPhone using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
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  4. amenasce

    amenasce Three Time F1 World Champ
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    Oct 17, 2001
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    Joe Mansion
    Very shady and poor business. I had never heard bad things about RTGT so I guess the $4k difference was the price of that reputation.
     
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  5. msark

    msark Formula Junior

    Feb 18, 2017
    279
    Southern California
    I wanted to follow up with the people who have read / commented on the post. First, Ferrari North America had a sympathetic ear but that was all. The fellow I was dealing with I believe is the National Sales Manager. Very nice to speak with but didn’t call me back with any idea as promised.

    To Jdubbya…. I certainly believe that you haven’t heard any before about RTGT. It only takes a small crack to start the wall falling down. I have heard that Arun Sharma the new GM is changing the business plan and that Steve Wintermantel the Ferrari Sales Manager is suffering (per Arun) “some issues” that are detracting from his focus. I can appreciate the comment but truthfulness and integrity aren’t affected by issues. Also, Arun called me from Bologna (Ferrari Event) rattling the “other buyer” and making sure my deposit was placed immediately or the car would be sold to the “other buyer at full ask”.

    To Acemaster… I’m glad your deal closed and you enjoyed your trip and the Trailblazers game. In your post you mention that “they came up short on some issues we had agreed on” but you went through with the deal and could “Live with that”. I’m glad the deal worked out for you but even in your case they showed they didn’t value the agreements they made.

    To Challenge… It does suck you had a similar incident. I had already sent the deposit they requested and signed the agreement.

    To Obbob… Reminds me of a saying “BBD” or Bigger Better Deal ….. Integrity or any form of cheating is a pattern of behavior. A child doesn’t accidentally copy from another’s test paper nor does a business fail to operate in an upright manner “just once, by accident”. Read Acemasters comments that even when closing the deal they couldn’t keep their word.

    To LorenzoOO… Give them a call and ask to hear their side of the story. 855 389 9707. I won’t post anyone’s cell phone from the dealership.

    To Tifoso2728… The signed agreement included the Ferrari Factory CPO plan for 1 year. I absolutely know what you are referring to as “CPO Eligible” as an option. This was included as part of the sales contract.

    Here is a link showing the deposit and refund. There should be no doubt in anyone’s mind that this was a “deal” as agreements were signed and money exchanged hands. It wasn’t a discussion or negotiation.

    https://drive.google.com/drive/folders/1H8SlXelVNIznU629lLRXyxqQElFBrfTi?usp=sharing

    Thanks for all your comments. I’m continuing my search…. I would mention that in discussing other currently available cars with dealers I found them to be more professional and very forthright in their discussions. I found one particular representative to be extraordinary but sadly that dealership wants to own the car more than I do....
     
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  6. paulchua

    paulchua Cat Herder
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jul 1, 2013
    16,084
    Menlo Park, CA
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    Paul Chua
    The proper course of action from the start was to tell the other buyer "Sorry, car is sold, but may we help you find another?"
    Pretty much as simple as that. (assuming all the facts have been presented)
     
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  7. AceMaster

    AceMaster Three Time F1 World Champ

    Feb 6, 2009
    34,560
    Ontario, Canada
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    Mike
    The issues that they came up short on were not worth cancelling the deal over.

    The good far outweighed the not so good.

    It was my first Ferrari purchase, perhaps I was too much into the moment to notice or to put up stronger resistance.

    That was almost 10 years ago, and even in hindsight I have zero regrets over it.
     
  8. AceMaster

    AceMaster Three Time F1 World Champ

    Feb 6, 2009
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    Mike
    Agree....in a perfect world.
     
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  9. norcal2

    norcal2 F1 Veteran

    I bought my Lamborghini through them years ago and had a good experience, even going through a third party, flew up, drove it 800 miles back no problems...just my own experience...
     
  10. LARRYH

    LARRYH F1 Veteran
    Owner Rossa Subscribed

    Jun 3, 2011
    9,166
    virginia usa
    I agree anything as long as it is clearly posted .......
     
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  11. tifoso2728

    tifoso2728 F1 Veteran
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    Apr 30, 2014
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    Right. Extended warranties are like insurance anyway. Hopefully, they'll never be used, but they are a good idea. Of course, they cost money!
     
  12. arizonaitalian

    arizonaitalian F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Oct 29, 2010
    19,953
    Wyoming
    I’ve seen cars advertised three ways:

    1. No mention of CPO (but you could ask them to make it CPO if the car is within the year guidelines - this will require 3 types of costs; inspection, required work to address any issues found, warranty)

    2. CPO eligible (usually means they did the inspection and no work was needed or whatever was found was addressed. 1 additional cost remains - the warranty)

    3. CPO (inspection done and issues addressed and being sold with warranty included in the asking price)

    I can’t tell if option 1 or 2 was the case here, OP?
     
  13. msark

    msark Formula Junior

    Feb 18, 2017
    279
    Southern California
    The car was offered to me at $81,000.00 as it sat on the showroom floor or $85,200 with the Ferrari CPO and the dealer was taking responsibility for any and all items required by Ferrari's protocol.
     
  14. arizonaitalian

    arizonaitalian F1 World Champ
    Owner Silver Subscribed

    Oct 29, 2010
    19,953
    Wyoming
    #64 arizonaitalian, Feb 22, 2018
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2018
    Got it, thanks.

    All I can add is that hopefully this thread can provide some learning here for any future buyers to fully vet out which of those 3 we are getting when we talk to the dealer. Sounds like we need to ask specific questions such as:

    - Does the deal include your dealership performing - at its own cost - the inspections?
    - Does the deal include your dealership performing - at its own cost - any indicated/needed repairs and maintenance resulting from the inspection?
    - Which extended warranty does it come with (there are more than one and they vary by year after manufacture year typically) and is that included in the deal?

    Starting with a car that is not offered as CPO and asking for an extended warranty during the sales process means all three of those things are likely to be costs (to someone); inspection, repairs, warranty. I'd bet that you are not the first person to run into this issue nor is it something that has only occurred at that dealer. I'm confident that some cars don't pass the inspection when its done and the dealer says "sorry, can't sell it CPO". Or "yes we can sell it CPO, but its going to cost X additional" (with the X additional having nothing to do with the cost of the warranty).

    Shouldn't need to vet that out, but sadly it seems that sometimes a buyer does have to...

    Edit: have to add that I thought the OP did a more than fair job of stating facts and not just taking shots (as we often see in these types of situations). Good luck with your search. I will - I guess - add one other thing. $2000 in repair/maint on a 612 is peanuts (its actually more like the shell of the peanuts). That much or a many multiple of that can disappear in a very short timeframe with these cars. I would not walk over that much money (the feeling of being cheated or lied to or lost trust of course is another matter). Just making sure you have that perspective on repair/maint costs on these cars...they didn't even offer extended warranties after year 10 until recently (now they go to what, 12 years?)
     
  15. msark

    msark Formula Junior

    Feb 18, 2017
    279
    Southern California
    I appreciate all of the comments made by Arizonaitalian..... You are right .... It's easy to have a $2000.00 repair or more expensive on any exotic and sadly it's happened to me. ... It's happened when I have left a perfectly good car parked to come out the next time to find it broken.... Life happens but I've been pretty lucky with my cars.... This dealership didn't live up to their agreement... I wasn't holding a lug wrench to their heads from 900 miles away for them to make the deal.

    It's not the amount of money but truly the principal .... And Ron Tonkin Ferrari has shown they didn't act in a professional manner.

    Early on in my professional life I ran into a speed bump... Raring to litigate since I was in the right. I was referred to a senior partner at a well known Los Angles law firm who remained a "guide" for many years ... He said You'l likely prevail but at what cost?" He told me that "Integrity is an expensive lesson to teach others" .. He also taught me to never split a pair of 9's in blackjack!

    And perhaps for the clearly troubled and less than forthright folks at Ron Tonkin Ferrari that "You Can NEVER Wash The Stink Off" once it's on you.
     
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  16. surfwolf

    surfwolf Formula 3
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    Oct 14, 2012
    1,609
    Bethany, OR
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    Michael Wolfe
    I had a less than pleasant interaction when I went to Ron Tonkin Gran Turisimo. I went to look at a 2012 Audi GT - Samoa Orange, arriving at the dealership in my 1995 Ferrari 348 Spider. I got out of my car & looked around, then went into the showroom. I was inside the showroom for over 15 minutes without any contact from sales people, finally decided that they did NOT want my business. Who knows why this happened, but the manager of the dealership should be terminated for allowing it to happen at his place of business. Was I treated this way due to the current cost level of Ferrari I was driving? Lots of pompous poser's who sell Ferrari's..........
     
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  17. AceMaster

    AceMaster Three Time F1 World Champ

    Feb 6, 2009
    34,560
    Ontario, Canada
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    Mike
    I agree with this - it doesn't matter if it's $1 or $1,000,000....simply put, you cannot put a $$ value on integrity.
     
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  18. tifoso2728

    tifoso2728 F1 Veteran
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    Apr 30, 2014
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    Just curious . . . Did you mention this, by letter or email, to the ownership? If you did, I'm quite sure the manager on duty as well as the sales staff on duty endured some talking to, if you know what I'm saying!
     
  19. Enzojr

    Enzojr F1 World Champ

    Dec 12, 2013
    14,001
    West of PDX
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    Tomy
    There is only one standard to value a man .......
    His word, if he isn't good for his word ALL value of being a man is gone.
    When you remove the fancy clothes, the money and the position all you have left is "his word".
    The sign out front may designate status, but if the man inside acts like a used car salesman......
    That's what he is, just another used car salesman ;)
     
  20. AceMaster

    AceMaster Three Time F1 World Champ

    Feb 6, 2009
    34,560
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    Mike
    This is an excellent post.
     
  21. Nospinzone

    Nospinzone F1 Veteran

    Jul 1, 2013
    7,373
    Weston, MA
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    Paul
    Ditto, and

    Ditto!

    My father was in business and I was in business. A deal was always a deal, and it didn't even have to be in writing. Every once in a while we'd make a deal that wasn't as great as we thought. The idea of reneging was unthinkable. If we took a loss, we ate it, learned a lesson and moved on. There is no way we would compromise our integrity over any amount of money (and I can tell you I've taken some losses).

    The idea this dealership trashed their integrity over a lousy $2000 is just unbelievable to me.

    Of course I'm sure if this dealership absurdly marked up a vehicle and an unsophisticated buyer agreed to the price, they would refund the excess. ;)

    And BTW, I know there are two sides to every story, but I have to believe the dealership knows about this thread. There's is no legal jeopardy here, but all we get are ............ crickets.
     
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  22. NTRLOPER

    NTRLOPER Karting

    Mar 3, 2015
    64
    San Diego, CA
    Full Name:
    Kerry
    Real question is -- did anyone from around here wind up as the local buyer?
     
  23. azlin75

    azlin75 Formula Junior

    Jul 16, 2017
    785
    Kansas
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    Shawn Hicks
    Other then a nice addition to the story you can't place any blame on the buyer, since he just wanted to buy a car.
     
  24. NTRLOPER

    NTRLOPER Karting

    Mar 3, 2015
    64
    San Diego, CA
    Full Name:
    Kerry
    Of course, none at all. Just curious, but guessing after hearing all this they might be stayimg mum to avoid rubbing salt in the wound.

    Sent from my SM-G950U using FerrariChat.com mobile app
     
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  25. msark

    msark Formula Junior

    Feb 18, 2017
    279
    Southern California
    Perhaps they might also feel a bit foolish knowing they paid $4,000.00 more !
     

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