Ferrari LaFerrari vs Mclaren P1 vs Porsche 918

Behind the scenes with the McLaren P1 and Chris Goodwin | crankandpiston.com Car Culture Lifestyle

"BEHIND THE SCENES WITH THE McLAREN P1 AND CHRIS GOODWIN

crankandpiston.com grabs a quick word with McLaren chief test driver Chris Goodwin to discuss the new McLaren P1, how it handles on-track, why Nürburgring times aren’t that important, and how Woking’s new hypercar could match a Porsche GT3 Cup Car for pace around the Yas Marina Circuit.

Am I in the right place? There’s a McLaren outside the support pit garage at Yas Marina, but for a team about to thrash a cutting-edge hypercar around a circuit on road tyres, there’s not a lot of frenzied activity going on.

I’ve pitched up in Abu Dhabi to see a rare sight – the new 903bhp McLaren P1 being pushed to its absolute limits by the man that helped create it. Chris Goodwin, McLaren’s chief test driver, is on hand to help the British Formula 1 team-turned-carmaker show off its latest, proudest creation to some super VIPs that have put money down for their own P1s. And while they were there, McLaren figured that it couldn’t hurt to see how fast the most talked about hybrid hypercar of the moment could complete a lap of the full grand prix circuit.

With all this going on, I’d envisaged a small army of mechanics working frantically on the two P1s housed in the garage to ensure they were in tip-top shape. But no. There are two McLaren-shirted mechanics sitting casually at a table next to the first car, a black, purple tinged pre-production car with the onomatopoeic British license plate that reads PI OOV. One is tapping through a laptop and the other munching on an apple. Over on a sofa, Chris Goodwin is flicking through some paperwork. No one is working on either the black car or the second P1, a development car named XP7. Where’s the hive of panic?

As Chris explains, there’s no need for a panic. The whole point of today is that it gives the flavour of the P1 to people that have shelled out $1.4 million on a car they’ve yet to drive. Even for all that money, they won’t get a permanent team of factory experts to keep the car shipshape. It needs to be ready to go at all times. And the team from McLaren is confident that that’s the case already. All that’s needed for the day’s activity is a pile of spare tyres (already mounted on rims and shipped in from a previous, similar activity at Bahrain International Circuit a couple of weeks previously). They’re all road tyres – no slicks here – exactly as you’d find if you were one of the well-heeled 375 customers that had snapped up a P1 before they sold out.

The customers will arrive later. For now, McLaren is using the opportunity to gather information on how well the P1 performs around the track. They do this at every track they visit – not to boast about lap times, but to benchmark the car against its predecessor, the 12C, of which a couple of examples also lurk in a garage nearby. You may have seen recent indignation at McLaren’s decision not to publicise the lap time that the P1 managed around the Nordschleife, even though insiders say it comprehensively beat the 6min 57sec set by the Porsche 918 Spyder. But that, apparently, is McLaren’s way.

“While we’re around the place we like to measure where we are,” Chris explains. “More than the ultimate lap time that this car can do on the track, what’s nice is to benchmark where we are relative to our known quantity, which is the 12C. It’s all adding to our knowledge and database. We’re not selling the car based on lap times, we don’t advertise those times. It’s more for our own information and understanding that we go to places and push the car to the limit, to experience what it does while it’s reaching that peak of performance. We’re tuning the car and the lap time is just a by-product of that.”

The mechanics have washed the car that Chris will be using during the day, and his first task is to learn the track. Although he’s driven Yas Marina before, it was several years previously, and in a very different car to the mighty P1. He tells me he’ll basically break it down to basics, memorising braking points, corner directions and then fine tuning the lap, feeling for different surfaces, different kerbs he can attack and work out how to get the best out of the P1. I ask him how many laps he’ll need to do that.

“Three?” he suggests with a faint, confident grin. A lean man, he’s dressed in a McLaren shirt and trainers, and when he jumps in the car the only change he makes is to put on his orange helmet, to comply with the circuit rules. As soon as the officials give permission he’s off.

Around two minutes later, the dark P1 emerges from beneath the famous blue footbridge and whips past the pits at full pelt. The sound isn’t the ear-splitting roar that some might expect, but a more complex, mature sound. It’s loud, but not deafening, a layered texture of noise that incorporates the electric whirr underneath the blown V8. As Chris slams on the brakes at the end of the straight, there’s a distant psssshh as the turbo dumps its air.

Chris comes back in, not even slightly ruffled after slamming the P1 around an unfamiliar track. He now has to trundle around a few more times for the gathered video cameras posted at different corners, but then it’s time to really see what the P1 can do.

“It was cool,” he says. “I’m pretty happy to go for a qualy lap. We’ll finish the filming, put some new tyres on and go for it.

“Yas Marina is a great circuit for a car like this, you’ve got a bit of everything. I really like the marina section that we’re using for the customers to drive on. It’s very like a street circuit. It’s very appropriate to drive a streetcar on street tyres around an endless series of corners. On the full grand prix circuit you can really stretch the car’s legs. The P1 just rockets out into that stadium section, you’ve got some very high-speed corners and that long straight where you can use the DRS and the KERS and have 900bhp behind you. The grandstand comes up at the end and you really have to be aware. I was braking at about 200 metres, which is pretty late.”

After the filming duties are over, Chris heads out again and takes only a couple of laps to register the best time of the day. At McLaren’s request, we won’t divulge the actual time, but suffice to say, it’s very close to that achieved by Porsche GT3 race cars on slicks, which is an incredible comparison considering the McLaren road car is on regular tyres. When Chris goes for a blast in a 12C Coupe, he’s a full seven seconds per lap slower.

“The whole point of this car is that it’s fast, but does what you want it to do,” he says of the P1 afterward. “As long as I behave myself it’ll be fine. We’ve spent four years making it a car that doesn’t have a quirk that will bite you in the backside. Chassis stiffness, suspension geometry, weight distribution, the way the aero behaves – everything’s all joined up. I wouldn’t say it’s easy, but it’s pretty straightforward when you’re used to it.

“The best comparison is with a Formula 1 car in that it’s been designed with the same aims, objectives and attention to detail. As with our racecars you end up with something you’re connected to, that responds very accurately to your inputs. There’s no big delay in sub-suspension or chassis twisting, no weird change to the toe or cambers of the car, no strange levels of downforce in a straight line with different balance during braking. That’s pretty unusual for a supercar company to pay attention to many or any of those things.”

And with that, Chris strolls off to meet the customers that are beginning to roll up to the circuit for their first experience of the car they’ve shelled out for. You’d think, as the man that’s been responsible for tuning said machine, he’d be worried. But no, he’s as cool as a cucumber – having offered rides since November, every one of the customers has been more than impressed. Small wonder then that the McLaren garage remains as calm and quiet as when I arrived.
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Impressive!

 

Are we really to believe that McLaren are so self absorbed as to benchmark their own car against themselves? What company produces what product in an isolated market?

Case in point.

McLaren's PR department remains infuriatingly snobbish. Saying that you've built a car only for organizational development is a slap in the face to every existing extension of automotive subculture, and that's because automotive development is always more fueled by competition--which has its own normalized set of benchmarks for a reason--than isolated progress.

McLaren's participation in the highest level of motorsport only reinforces this snobbery.

 

What benchmark do you use when there isn't another benchmark to use?

 

Complaining about manufacturer snobbery on a ferrari forum?

 

Yeah the only "known quantity" that they have is the 12C unless they're going to benchmark the 20 year old F1.

 

still spouting the BS company line. They went to the Ring with full intent on being kings. All the effort into the track and filming to make a huge splash. Then they do an about face. wont reveal time. "that's the McLaren way" WTFE.

No doubt the car is super fast on grand prix circuits. It can exploit race car level of ground clearance and aero. and with 900hp, it should be.

 

Can't win with some people. Car does a lap with corsas as quick as a gt3 race car with slicks and beats a 12c by a massive 7 seconds, yet not good enough for people.

The 12c in pre-update form did 7:28 and probably a few seconds quicker with the 2013 updates.

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The benchmark is the performance envelope set by the hypercar sector. All automotive sectors have a basic history of development out of, and projection into, a given performance envelope.

McLaren didn't produce the P1 without speculating on the capabilities of the LaF and the 918. Otherwise they wouldn't bother with claiming to be the fastest of the three.

 

Ferrari didn't claim to be the king of everything prior the LaF launch.

That makes them no less snobbish than they already are, but it does make them pretty benign in all the current benchracing drama.

 

Please explain how Ferrari is any different. I mean, all they do is compare their cars on their test track. How many times have we seen them mention other cars or times?

All they say is this new model is x seconds quicker around Fiorano than some old model, do they not?

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Come again...?

I sometimes wonder who here is actually paying attention.

>8^)
ER

 

And as we know, HVS's lap times on the 'Ring have usually been improved by 5 to 10 seconds when a factory driver goes behind the wheel.

 

I think you mean when the factory supplies their own car.

>8^)
ER

 

I don't really care about how different Ferrari are from McLaren. I care that McLaren bated the automotive world with massive performance claims--including claims for hot lap times--and then did a total about-face after very public testing.

 

Erik, you're well aware that this kind of language is pretty typical hype for any hypercar launch. It also illustrates the competition that drives this industry--competition which McLaren still avoid. I'll concede that Ferrari aren't exactly being truthful here, but no manufacturer is ever totally truthful when generally hyping its own product.

Dennis went way beyond this kind of general hype when he spoke of the P1's performance a year ago. His company have still done nothing to prove his hype outright.

 

I'm not even sure Ferrari have allowed a journalist to sit in a LaFerrari with the engine off and the key in someone else's pocket so when you want to talk about avoiding exposure or not proving any hype I think you need to take a much closer look at the playing field right now.

Porsche has given 918s out even before they have decided they are done with development to both future owners and journalists. McLaren have put customers behind the wheel in controlled circumstances and given a number of journalists time on the street and on the track in the P1. Reports from all so far are fairly glowing for each car even if they haven't produced any solid independent numbers. Someday we can all hope that the three line up side by side for something that could be called a comparison.

Yeah - McLaren changed their marketing approach with the P1 for their own reasons and are fairly unapologetic about it. Those who feel slighted because they can't benchrace the numbers now are just going to have to suck it up and quit whining. It is funny how the 'quiet confidence' approach is only applauded and acceptable here when it comes from the Italians. If I hear "Ferrari have nothing to prove" one more time...

>8^)
ER

 

Show me the official lap videos, 0-60 times, and 0-300 times for the LF, F12, 458, etc at Fiorano with timing equipment.

McLaren said it will do under 7 minutes. Ferrari says the LF will do 1:20 at Fiorano and that they F12 will do 1:23, and that the Speciale will do 0-60 under 3 and 0-200 in 9.1.

Is Ferrari bating you because they don't give you videos with official timing of each metric?

They'll sell you a car and you're free to do what you want with it. They say it will do X, but it's up to you or some reviewer to prove it.

If you feel so bated, just go buy a P1 and do a lap to find out for yourself whether the claims are true.

 

You're very right on all accounts as usual.

You're also still waxing eloquent about a company that doesn't prove incredibly specific claims in very basic ways.

I'm ready to celebrate the achievements of the P1, but I don't get emails from company employees or extended driving loans for the 12C. I read headlines and watch YouTube. And I'm totally thrilled with the car from what I've seen via those outlets--really, I am. But I remain very frustrated with McLaren's PR scizophrenia. As a fan of competition, it's insulting.

Prove the claim already. A time stamp and a following headline. Simple.


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While all our banter is interesting, I want to see the three cars pitted against each other by a respected, independent motoring mag. Then we can tease/insult each other with real data. For now we know that the 918 is the best all rounder and the P1 is as close as they come to F1.

 

I wasn't entirely keen on the Chrome Blue of #001 until now. Just Wow!

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>8^)
ER

 

So is it confirmed the p1 has only 737 hp when not in race mode and unless the IPAS button is pressed?

 

No. In all modes it has full power, unless you press the boost button on the centre console. This stops the electric motor from automatically torque filling and means you can now use the IPAS button to manually engage the electric motor. It is a bit pointless and gimmicky but dare I say it is only there for fun

 

I'd imagine the boost button could be there to make the battery recharge quicker then

 

Nope. There is another button for that on the centre console labelled "charge" which if i understand it correctly over revs the engine whilst driving to divert those extra revs to topping up the battery