Ferrari, Not for Everyone?

I see so what happens 5-10 years down the road for the owner of a used ferrari, must the car be scarpped, if so how does thta affect reasle of newer cars.

Are we saying Ferraris have become a disposable item. Are all newer ferraris like the 456 so expensive to keep running that at 10 years they are going to be worth close to nothing.

If so think ferrari needs to rethink its entire long term startegy.

The one thing that has kept me from buying aCS is the near certainty in my mind that the tranny will be prohibitive to keep running, and acs is a relatively simple car.

I guess one day there will be speciualists who can keep these things running, hiope so because while the modern ferraris in general have little appeal to an old school guy like myself, the FF is weirdly appealing and if they depreciate liek the otehrs could make agreat daily someday.

 

depreciate like the others ? The lose half their value in less than 2 years. The problem is that the repairs dont depreciate.

 

Thank you for your reply,

I'm not sure where you got that the car would have to be scrapped if there is a DCT failure.
The cost to repair ( today ) is around $15k +/-

An F1 Actuator repair on a F430 is around the same cost ( a little more if you replace the entire F1 Actuator kit vs rebuild kit ) and you don't hear anyone talking about scrapping their F430's ?

And no one has said anything about any Ferrari being disposable... where did that come from?

Owners now have the chance to maintain a factory warranty, which would cover the cost of the above repair up to 10 years now. After that, yes, as with ANY car, it's up to the owner how they chose to maintain / repair / service / scrap ,etc

S

 

Yes.

If Ferrari has a stock of $15K DCT gearboxes on hand after the 10-year spares requirement, then not a big deal.

But how much do you want to bet on that...

Keep your Boxer.

 

I've used Boardwalk for service and the purchase of 5 different cars. I have found them to be exemplary in sales, friendliness and service. I do a lot of tire kicking before I buy also and they never once have shown any impatience or disdain for my presence while I do that.

Just sayin....

 

Thanks for the info. How about when warranty is up.... what will the customer cost be?
How many catastrophic issues with the gearbox are being seen with these relatively new cars? %?

Importantly, how is all this going to pan out when these are 15yr old "used" cars? Will they be too scary to touch? The old hand grenade with the pin pulled?

 

A potential $15,000 repair in a $300,000 is no different than a potential $1,500 repair in a $30,000 car. This has and always will be the problem with the secondary Ferrari market, people buying cars they can't afford to maintain. I have a buddy who used to see this all the time with people buying AMG's second hand thinking they got an amazing bargain, only to find out the car needs $20k in maintenance to be streetable. It's a crime to buy one of these ladies and not take care of her, but it's also the nature of the market. So some early DCT's are suspect. That doesn't bode well for resale on 2009-10 Cali's and 2010 458's. Thereafter I wouldn't worry so much. But you cannot buy a Ferrari out of warranty and expect to not have a repair once in a while.

 

After looking at the instgram.. I now understand... carpe diem my friend. Enjoy every day to the fullest. Push the limits when you reach them.

 

Thank you for your kind words!

That price is customer pay.

I have seen maybe 6 in the past 24 months of 50+ cars a month.

I do not have a national average.

S

 

So what happens after 10 years? Part of the whole ferrari thing is cars lasting decades, especialy for those enthusiasts who are into the driving part. It seesm liek the newer ferraris are an unknown in this regard and are to be treated like other used cars past a certain date and be ready for dismantling.

Apart form my preference for a stick in terms of driver engagement, this unknown gearbox situation would keep me away from buying and keeping one of the newere ferraris. Seems like unintentions planned obsolesccense.

None of which is to say that these are bad cars for the foirst or second owners, more liek a newer ferrari does not appear to be a long term proposition.

 

"You all may live longer than us but I guarantee we will live more than you."

I guess, if that's what you call living.

 

The problem is that Ferrari knows the cars are driven about 2K per year and they sold about every 2 years. The warranty only lasts 3. Most cars that were purchased new are sold or traded with about 6-7K miles on them.

Look for a lot of $20,000 DCT bills coming up for 2nd and 3rd owner generation Cal's and 458's.

Confidence will be at an all time low when after getting the bill for 30 grand after they get through mucking about, Ferrari gives them a 1 year limited warranty on a rebuilt box swap that just failed.

We've seen this before. It's called the 456 GTA.

 

Dealers are under orders NOT to open the boxes and NOT to show them to customers. They are told to just pack them up, send them off, and wait for another rebuilt box to show up on their doorstep.

I would not take whatever rumors about the causes there are about the DCT failure as fact. I view this as a ticking time bomb. Earlier ones worse than later ones but even 2014's appear to have some problems.

 

Here is the problem.

You spend this money and get a one year warranty on the work. What are you going to do?

Sell the car ASAP and tell the next owner it has a one year warranty on the box.

 

You can tell me, what happens after 10 years? They will last decades. You seem to keep wanting to create a reason to dismantle / scrap a car because it may need a repair out of warranty. This makes no sense to me.

It's a $15k repair , not $30k , $15k is a little more than the cost of an engine out belt service, fluid/filter service, waterpump, radiator repair on a TR....

 

I have to LOL.

Have you ever seen a dealer do major surgery on a car and not say "well, as long as we are HERE..."

What I said was 20 grand that will end up being 30 when all is said and done.

Your analogy is complete wrong with the TR. That repair happens every 5 years by the clock. In the case of DCT failures, it could be anytime. That's the risk owners are taking when they pick it up with a rebuilt box behind them.

 

Really?

" Ordered" , um no.... and what exactly do you mean " rumor " I am 100% speaking from first hand experience..

With all due respect, you may want to check my sig line below,

S

 

Um, yes, yes I have actually.

But to your point, you seem to be saying that you would prefer the repair at hand be performed and NOT be told that it would be less expensive to replace the leaking rear main seal while the engine is already out....

You would rather, find out a week after you pick up your car, THEN post about how the Dealership "missed" the major oil leak and didn't give you the option.

S

 

OK, I do respect that. I'm speaking from my first hand experience.

However, even YOU must admit a complete lack of transparency on what causes DCT failures, how many there have been, how many are still at risk, and what solutions -- if any -- have come over time.

Surely we can agree upon that.

And it's not the first time the company has pulled these shenanigans. Can we agree on that also?

 

The same has been said of every period of technical automotive advancement. It has been said for the last ten years about 360,430 et al. The service business evolves with the cars. I see a narrowing of the shops and people who can do it and I believe that will continue and it will get more expensive and it will be an even bigger shock to the secondary market but it will be available. My market area is a very large one with a large number of shops working on them yet only a small fraction are equipped and capable to do the late cars. That will continue to get worse but based on my interaction with people in other industries it is really no different in any of the other highly skilled trades. We are not replacing people like me, our society as a whole has little use for us. Few products being built require us or are worth the expense.

 

BS. I own cars of this nature and can afford the maintenance, etc., and let me tell you first hand a $15,000 repair bill rubs me wrong...just kinda pisses me off. I'll take the $1,500 repair bill any day by comparison. I didn't get to where I am today by nonchalantly pissing my $ away.

I think the secondary market will for the 458 will be questionable as they age. Again look at the BMW sealed gearbox issues and BMW abandoning that whole idea (and I'm guessing that BMW as a company is a whole lot easier to deal with than Ferrari who seems to have a reputation of giving the proverbial middle finger...i.e. Ferrari doesn't care about you. Ferrari doesn't care about me. Enzo may be turning over in his grave but only to give the a double barrel middle finger salute). This will be like trying to unload a Porsche manufactured during the IMS failure years (just look at the prices for those and the leap of faith it takes to buy one).

Only time will tell, but I agree with others in thinking that these cars in 15+ years are grenade status and the you don't know when it will blow up. Just my opinion.

 

Guys, its supply and demand.

The reason Ferrari doesn't build cars with 3 pedals anymore is simply that nobody buys them with 3 pedals.

You think these DCT trannys are some magical unsolvable rubics cube? Its going to be like 430 shift actuators. When it costs $15,000 to get a new one.. some enterprising mind will find a rebuild for a couple grand. Same thing with the Transmissions or any issues that come up once these cars are out of warranty period. There will be new modules, and valve fixes, etc. All that's needed is a demand. Look at the GTR. Already has tons of aftermarket mods. Demand = Supply. it will happen same as IMS and engine rebuilds happened.

 

No I agree with you.

That's my point exactly.

In the real world the owner is going to get a bill much larger than just the swapped box. You and I both know it.

After he gets this bill and the one year limited warranty, his first thought will be "geez I only drove this car 1000 miles and it costed me 20 grand! Ebay here I come."

 

I don't see that happening. All the broken boxes are sent back to the factory. I can't see some independent guy taking a broken box, opening it up, figuring out why it broke, replacing parts or upgrading it, and giving it a warranty.

Most will just do the dealer thing and eat it.