Ferrari owner/racer Paul Frame off to jail...

Ah, jealously. Thy color is green.

I don't know Mr. Frame. I don't know anything about his company other than what I read in the papers.

However, I do know human nature. Back in the 90s, it was money for nuthin, and the chicks for free. If you had a bidness plan that had www in it somewhere, this was good for at least 10 to 20 million.

Remember, this was the era of the billion dollar CEOs. Hell, companies that had never had a dollar in revenue had market capializations that exceeded Exxon.

My guess, and this is only a guess, is that the $750,000 that Mr. Frame had paid to his ex-wife or whatever was a throw-a-way move. He was probably a touch light and needed to get the deal done. Yeah, $750,000 is a lot of money. But this and a cup of coffee still will not buy you an Enzo.

I'm not condoning what he did. You play with the Public's money, you better toe the line. But to get on a soap box and say, "This proves that all rich people are crooks" is a bit much don't you think?

Dr "And, no. I ain't rich" Who

 

I met Paul at several Ferrari events back in Texas. He was always active with the Ferrari Texas crowd. I remember when he got the yellow F50, I have pics of me with that car. He was a great Ferrari guy, but I guess not such a great business man. Wow, I'm stunned.

 

So where's the famous F50 now?

 

Well I don't know about his character but it must suck to go from a millionaire to broke and to lose an F50!
I kind of feel sorry for him

 

I will go to my grave believing they should go to jail. I am sick of the CEO crime thing. I live in Birmingham AL and I get to watch the HealthSouth trial everyday and King Richard cry that he didn't know anything and in the meantime innocent employees are losing jobs and retirement funds because too much is not enough for him and others like him. (I know MANY of the people involved personally with the HS case including one of the federal investigators and several former Board members so please save any posts telling me that he really did not know what was going on)

A fine will not deter a multi-millionaire; a fine is what he HOPES he gets. The LAST thing they want is jailtime. Lets say you have 20 million in the bank and have the choice of a $15 million fine or 15 years in jail. Which would YOU pick? 10 years in the joint or walk away with 5 million and thank God everyday for how lucky you just got? Fines are not the answer. Once a few of these crooks go do some hard time, others will think first, believe me.

The other thing to keep in mind is very simply this; if you do not want to go to jail, don't steal from your company, employees and investors. It's easy enough. What is so hard about that? Real simple.

 

You shouldn't. He did it to himself. He was a grown-up and knew better.

 

I never said ALL rich people are crooks..I said MANY. There are some really upstanding wealthy people out there..I know a few of them. People that would never guess were worth the amount of money they are. I'm definatly not jelous of them..yes sometimes i think it would be nice to have "that kind of money" but the I also look at the other side of the coin..which many times is not so shiny.

Wealthy people who have earned their money honestly get nothing but the utmost respect from me. They are the people I go to for advice, and they are VERY willing to give it. These people are some of the nicest people I have ever met. But the ones who are "under the table" I can sniff out most times and refuse to have any dealings with them.

Tom..."most definatly not rich".. Bakowsky

 

FoH had it for sale in 2003, I recall, when the legal activities really went into high gear. Frame was fired from Seitel a while ago.


I don't know if it ever sold

http://www.fca-houston.org/tws97.htm

 

As someone who has seen firsthand the effects of white collar crime on innocent employees, shareholders and creditors, I have zero sympathy for perpetrators. I hope he does every day of the maximum sentence.

Jack

 

Well I knew Paul Frame, not well, but enough we always said hello to each other...

He was always gracious and he did not care if you drove a 308 or a 250 GTO.

I love the comments from all of the people on here that live in "glass" houses, yes it appears he made some stupid decisions, but I will always think of him as a gentleman.

I hope he can recover, in some way, and not have to live the rest of his life looking backward at what he had....

The ultimate act would be his ability to pay this back, regain some dignity and move on....

Can you imagine having all of this and losing everything?

 

The problem was he wasn't feeling that bad when he was taking the money. Funny how bad they feel AFTER they get caught, isn't it? That bad feeling is supposed to be there BEFORE you steal tons and tons of cash. It is supposed to keep you from doing it (among many other reasons).

 

Wow, a lot to comment on here.

Martha

She was charged with insider trading however those charges were dismissed by the judge. She was convicted of obstruction of justice for lying to investigators about the incident. The prosecutors brought the dumbest securites charge I ever heard of. They charged that she was trying to manipulate her own companies stock by proclaiming her false innocence in the Imclone matter. That was thrown out. Instead of that they should have just charged her with straight insider trading on the Imclone deal.

I used to be an options trader on the floor of an exchange, and we were the ones who were always run over by the insider traders. They would come to our market to buy puts or calls and we were the other side of the trade. They rarely got caught and I have zero sympathy for them.

Federal Sentencing Guidelines,

They are no longer mandatory, only advisory. See the recent Supreme Court case US vs. Booker. However, there still exists certain mandatory minimums for many drug crimes. These need to go, there are too many people doing 10 years for 50 grams of crack with no violence or anything else, not to mention people who got 10 years for giving someone a ride.

Prison overcrowding

Release all of the non-violent drug offenders and you will solve that problem. However you will also close one of the biggest welfare programs in the world, the one that keeps law enforcement in business. Many of these people would have nothing else to do.

White collar

I am all for enforcing the law against people who actually steal, or defraud. Sounds like this was a starange case, I never heard of it. But if you steal with or without a gun, you should be punished. I would sometimes tell people a year for every $100,000, that's generous. It's much more than the average American salary.

Money Laundering

Most money laundering charges are BS, pile on charges, used to enhance the sentence. The US has a very broad definition for money laundering. Any money that you spend that they claim from illegal means can bring a new stiff charge of money laundering.

The biggest crooks of all, The Auditors

The auditors, the Arthur Andersons of the world always get a pass. Sure they indicted Arthur Anderson the company but nobody was criminally held personally accountable. These accounting firms are giant criminal enterprises. They only came to power because audits were mandated by law. These firms can't see anything, they just rubber stamp whatever is in front of them. I had friends who were hired as auditors by them right out of college. They had no idea what they were doing yet the firms were charging the clients big money to be audited by these fresh grads who couldn't find their own behind with both hands.

Where were the auditors when all of these transactions were going down. Personally I would love to see them held criminally responsible from the CEO down to the lowest clerk because they are all part of the "criminal conspiracy." That's what the government would call it if they were going after you, but the big accounting firms get a pass.

 

Nuff said:

Mel Spillman, nice guy extrordinare:

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&ie=ISO-8859-1&q=Mel+Spillman&btnG=Google+Search

 

>>I remember when he got the yellow F50, I have pics of me with that car.<<

If I was STEALING in the Multi-Millions I could be in that picture!!!!

 

Damn right! My roomate is about to graduate with an accounting degree and wants to work for a big firm. I can honestly see him getting caught in the middle of **** like this b/c he doesn't use his head(in common sense terms) and as you mentioned be very naive being a college grad. Yes he studies his ass off and knows his **** pretty damn good from my observation. But that's the problem he thinks he knows it all when in actuality there is far more that goes on besides what he learns in school.

 

***Ah, jealously. Thy color is green.**

you seem to have a big mouth here, and something to say about everything!!...the desperate need to be important isn't really a good thing you know??

Have you ever considered therapy or simply being somebody in your own right???

you sound envious that you didn't get to suck on the free stolen money tit while the grabbing & sucking was good!!!

 

Interesting, never thought that I'd ever defend auditors...

Arthur Andersen paid the ulitmate price, the firm is dead.

But I wonder? What happened to Enron's outside law firm? The answer, of course, is nothing. Indeed, quick test -- Which law firm handled the Raptors? What consequences did this firm suffer from consulting and drafting the legal documents behind the looting of Enron?

Dr "Inquiring minds want to know" Who

 

One of the keys to being on F-Chat is remembering the key mantra -- The ignore button. It is your friend.

Bye Bye

 

HAHA!!

Da Nile is not just a river in Africa you know...

I can spot em buddy!!

 

Yes, dead as a firm, but were the people at the top held criminally liable?No. Were the endless teams of auditors who went over the books many times held criminally liablle? I don't think so.

It was systemic.

I am pretty sure they were not only the accountants and consultants for Enron but weren't they also the auditors for World Com who missed the $750 million misplaced accounting entry five quarters in a row?

 

The guy is obviously a con artist looking for approval and victims...I mean friends...wherever he can find them...

Let thy Tonque be Thy Flypaper...!!! The sent that slowly draws the moths to the flame!!

 

Who are you calling a con artist and what the hell are you talking about?

 

Mel stole Millions an got 10 years. I hear he will be out anyday too.
Makes you wonder....

 

Not you!!! Unless the shoe fits?!?!?! Didn't think it did??? You're call!?!?

I'm calling on Mr. Got Mouth & Ignore Tax, Bat someting or another, Da Nile"....
!!!

 

What I can't imagine is why would someone risk all of that (millions of dollars in cash and assets) for $750,000. If the man was making $200,000 per month at one point, why would he put his entire life at risk for less than 6 months' pay? Or is it that's all the feds were able to indict him for?

It doesn't add up.. if the man has such poor judgement then how did he become so successful in the irst place?