Ferrari “Puro” SUV announced | Page 6 | FerrariChat

Ferrari “Puro” SUV announced

Discussion in 'Ferrari Discussion (not model specific)' started by dustman, Sep 18, 2018.

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  1. thorn

    thorn F1 Rookie
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    So ... don't sell your vehicles in China. Ferrari already has more potential customers than cars available, everywhere else in the world.
     
  2. TheMayor

    TheMayor Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    Let me ask you a question

    What the hell difference is to you if Ferrari sells an SUV in China? Does it bother you somehow?

    Does it bother someone who has a Porsche, Bentley, BMW, or Lambo there are SUV's in China?

    Please explain what the problem is because I sure don't see it
     
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  3. davidoloan

    davidoloan Formula Junior

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    #128 davidoloan, Sep 24, 2018
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2018
    Its a reasonable argument that companies are at their best when the top down direction usually from a single individual is to realise valid, in the sense of true to a set of principles, products.

    The Range Rover is valid and wonderful, imo, and nearly all other large luxurious SUVs, are a waste of space. I accept the differing opinions of those who disagree. Charles Spencer King who created the Range Rover was saddened to see the influence his country / town car had on the market; the Chelsea tractor.

    Marchionne said in 2018, that Ferrari "made a profit of a billion in cash last year, I think you can double that number by 2022. The last fifteen years has seen us focus a lot more on the performance car, the performance end, we need to rekindle our interest in the other side of this and grow volume. If we do it in that area we are not endangering the exclusivity conditions of Ferrari and I think we will be able to reach a much wider audience. Once we do that I think you will see their is additional earnings potential coming out of the machine"

    He is speaking of the SUV and he is excited when doing so. His motivation was business, and a clear focus on short term maximisation of profit. Ferrari has an exploitable mystique way beyond any other existing car company, and this is the reason John Elkann and the late Sergio Marchionne are / were so excited by it.

    When I think of Porsche today, I think of a company that makes diesel SUVs that I just don't warm too. I know that they make some amazing 911's at the top of the range, but I view these as halo cars, for what is now simply a division of VW, a company that was taken over by VW in the era of the SUV, rescuing Porsche from going bust, arguably because they stepped away from the sports car ideals of the founder and his successor's. I formed my initial opinion of Porsche in the 1980's, and just the idea of a Porsche was exciting. I'm sure kids of today can't have this feeling, no matter how impressive the halo cars are; Porsche 956 at Le Mans and 911 Turbo's on the street vs halo cars and diesel people carriers on stilts, that can't make it across a wet field.

    Charles Spencer King sat down at his drawing board to design a game changer. Ferrari needs to do the same. Otherwise they just cash in at the cost of the reputation of the marque and probably the continuing validity of the sports, GT and supercars.

    @TheMayor - yes Porsche, Bentley and BMW have all gone way down in my estimation in the last twenty years. Peter Wheeler's TVR, Romano Artioli's EB110, Horacio Pagani's Zonda, Luca Cordero Di Montezemolo's (though I didn't agree with everything) Ferrari and others have been the positives.
     
  4. davidoloan

    davidoloan Formula Junior

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    Nope, for all Enzo Ferrari's disdain of his customers, and even his road car business, he never made a duffer. Every car is pretty special.
     
  5. jjmalez

    jjmalez F1 Veteran
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    The business case for the Ferrari Purosangue SUV

    This new Ferrari SUV is one piece of a larger plan to boost the company's earnings significantly over the next several years.

    In a nutshell, Ferrari is aiming to roughly double its adjusted earnings before interest, tax, depreciation and amortization (adjusted EBITDA), from 1 billion euros in 2017 ($1.18 billion at the current exchange rate) to between 1.8 billion and 2 billion euros in 2022. It'll get there by increasing both its revenue and its profit margins, and it plans to do that by offering a series of new products.

    Some of Ferrari's new products will be intended to boost the company's already very high margins, by tempting Ferrari's established customers to buy more (and more expensive) cars. Others will be intended to draw new customers to the brand, to increase Ferrari's annual sales somewhat. Ferrari sold 8,398 vehicles in 2017, and while it hasn't disclosed its sales goals, it probably wants to raise its annual sales to around 12,000 by 2022.

    Ferrari's effort to draw new customers to the brand is focused on what the company calls "gran turismo" vehicles ("grand touring" in English). In Ferrari's usage, a gran turismo is a fast, luxurious road car that generally has seating for more than two people. It's distinct from "sports cars," which have harder-edged high performance, minimal luxuries inside, and seating for just a driver and a single passenger.

    Ferrari thinks that it has room to expand sales of its gran turismo vehicles without compromising the exclusivity of the brand, because it can introduce gran turismos in market segments it doesn't participate in now. Specifically, it thinks that it can sell more Ferraris in newer markets like China, that gran turismo vehicles in general sell especially well there, and that a gran turismo that is also an SUV will sell very well, without cannibalizing sales of its sports cars or watering down the Ferrari brand.


    https://www.fool.com/investing/2018/09/21/why-ferrari-decided-to-build-the-purosangue-suv.aspx

    B:eek::eek:!
     
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  6. WJHMH

    WJHMH Two Time F1 World Champ
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    As long as it races the Paris Dakar rally or Baja 1000, I'm perfectly fine with it.

    Besides, we can't say it wasn't going to happen, there was talk of this almost 2 decades ago.
     
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  7. BMW.SauberF1Team

    BMW.SauberF1Team F1 World Champ

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    It will probably look like a GTC4 Lusso with extra set of doors and lifted...

    Unfortunately it's a money grab...and it's been like this for a while. Ferrari used to be a race team that sold cars to fund the race team, but now it's the opposite. Going public with that IPO was only going to push it farther from its roots.
     
  8. dustman

    dustman F1 Veteran
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    1. I’m not bothered by ferrari creating an suv
    2. I’d rather they focus on making better looking exotics as this current wave is unimpressive, esp 812 and Porto
    3. Someone above said Range Rover is great? Horribly low quality bar, sadly. But agree was once pretty.
     
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  9. TheMayor

    TheMayor Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    Really? GM Auto slush box good enough for ya was it?

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  10. Jana

    Jana F1 Veteran

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    I totally agree. And it's still a bit sad. Once a company mainstreams, it's shine is diminished. It doesn't lessen the driving experience of the car enthusiast, but it does lessen the specialness of owning the brand. It becomes just another car manufacturer, like say BMW. The guy with the 7 series is no better labeled than the guy who bought a Mini Cooper and insists it's a BMW as well.

    That issue comes in because the general public is mostly not car enthusiasts. They don't know models very well. They only know brand. I had people ask me all the time what my 360 was. I'd reply "360 Spider", thinking I'm answering their question and get blank looks. Then I'd say "Ferrari" and everyone understood. So yeah, it's sad to see a company that was only about race cars for the street become pedestrian. But that's been changing for a long time.
     
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  11. italiafan

    italiafan F1 World Champ
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    Let's see...Ferrari builds more models, to attract new customers and at same time increase price of the more desirable models for the tifosi to spend more on. They add an SUV which serves just about zero practical purpose. Of all their vehicles in their product line there will only be a few really desirable ones, others will be there to have dealer push for tifosi to get higher up on lists.
    All of this unfolds right as the World Markets begin to slide back into a recession at the business cycle rotates. Currently the USA is near the tail end of the longest market bull run since WWII. China's markets already under pressure, and wouldn't be surprised one bit by an "Asian Contagion" as trade war carries on.
    All cars turbo, turbo-electric; and at stupid performance numbers only Internet idiots actually care about.
    I can easily foresee the possibility for Ferrari to be stepping into a pile of dung.
    IMO...which obviously no one at Ferrari actually cares about (rightfully so I suppose)...Ferrari should go the opposite direction.
    More exclusive sports/exotic cars for the tifosi.

    Rear-Midengined V12, not LE.
    Front-Midengined V12 in both coupe and hardtop Spider versions, not LE.
    Rear-Midengined V8, not LE.
    LE versions of above.
    Rear-Midengined stripped V6 "Dino" car, no radio, no options other than colors and leather.
    Maybe a 2+2 for sons, but to be honest I'd ditch those.
    Maybe a Portofino-type car for going to dinner with the wife, girlfriend, mistress.
    :)
     
  12. jjmalez

    jjmalez F1 Veteran
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    It's the nearly 50% production increase in the next 4 years that really bothers me. I feared this when the company went public. Shareholders don't care about tradition, they care about earnings.

    :(
     
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  13. LARRYH

    LARRYH F1 Veteran
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    I am fine with Ferrari selling an SUV .. but if they are going to do it they really need to look at what Porsche has done with the Cayenne from my point of view having owned many suvs over the last 30 years .Porsche has done it right it is the best suv on the market .. we own one and love it . It is the only Suv that is fairly fun to drive and feels just right and is rock solid reliable. I hope if Ferrari is going to do this they look at the cayenne turbo and use that as a guide .. If so they will build a nice addition..a ferrari that can really be a daily driver...
     
  14. TheMayor

    TheMayor Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    They need to build the best. The bar is high.

    It’s a challenge they entered. If it’s less they will fail.
     
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  15. LARRYH

    LARRYH F1 Veteran
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    Thats is my point Porsche built a built proof car in the cayenne . And if ferrari is going to do this they really have their work cut out for them... the bar is indeed high
     
  16. HotShoe

    HotShoe F1 Veteran
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    From a design standpoint the odds are stacked against them.

    When one considers the many hard points and regulations they have to work around to create a five seat FUV/SUV package you realize their hands are tied. In the end that's why all these vehicles are so cliche and or derivative. There isn't much room for new surfacing. It all ends up being about the graphic breakup. In the end it will be the same generic blob with Ferrari graphics such as the headlights and grill. Even the profile and stance is severely limited due to packaging. Look at the Lambo, Porsche, Bentley, etc.

    I've worked on SUV's design projects and it's a ***** given the modern day constraints. The only area they'll be able to stand out in is the interior IMO.

    I hope for Ferrari's sake the reward is worth the risk.
     
  17. crinoid

    crinoid F1 Veteran
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    I think this is why what they build will not be like anything else. If it is truly unique and disappoints in sales then they weren’t really beaten because they really didn’t compete. They can still say they tried and without breaking their principals of not building a 4 door truck. It’s like they’re trying to build something to steal the sales from SUV’s that isn’t actually a truck. I keep thinking of the Giugiaro Parcour. Ferrari will do a front TTV8 with gullwing doors that will have extra ground clearance and be sleek. Remember the Panamaerica 599 cars? What about the Giugiaro Parcour based on the Lamborghini Gallardo ?
     
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  18. crinoid

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    Ferrari’s have been taken into dirt and jumped before and they’re pretty cool. I do not want Ferrari to make an SUV. I think if they do it in a way that doesn’t violate their principals of not building a 4 door truck and make it unique it may be tolerable. Now this is still slightly irking because they really don’t need SUV money. Montezemolo had them set up to build sports cars and GT’s and they could still be laughing their way to the bank. Instead that silly balless sack Elkann wants to be like gramps and save Fiat. So they pimp Ferrari out and reward them for their deserved success and hard work by making them support the whole fiat empire. Well done Elkan you quim.
     
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  19. davidoloan

    davidoloan Formula Junior

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    I like the manual better, but the 365 / 400 / 412 is one of my favorite cars. Plenty of people on here have the auto and say it suits the GT.
     
  20. anunakki

    anunakki Seven Time F1 World Champ
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    The Parcour is so cool looking !
     
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  21. crinoid

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    I would drive it until it self destructed.

     
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  22. TheMayor

    TheMayor Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    To me, Ferrari is a car company with a certain ethos --a reason for being: design and performance philosophy, a degree of exclusivity, workmanship /craftsmanship, engineering etc. As long as that ethos is continued into new vehicles, it still works across platforms.

    If it doesn't the brand will suffer.
     
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  23. davidoloan

    davidoloan Formula Junior

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    Yes, but the purpose of this is to double profits from 1 to 2 billion over five years.

    So unless they have a market redefining idea like the original Range Rover then we are going to see a compromised version of the FF.

    Which is more likely given the driving force is money, not product led?
     
  24. dustman

    dustman F1 Veteran
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    Explorer was market defining.
     
  25. TheMayor

    TheMayor Nine Time F1 World Champ
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    Please explain how profits are “bad”.

    Tickets to Caracas are pretty cheap now.
     

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