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Ferrari vs mclaren vs Porsche

Discussion in '458 Italia/488/F8' started by Nincompoop, Apr 29, 2020.

  1. Nincompoop

    Nincompoop Rookie

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    #1 Nincompoop, Apr 29, 2020
    Last edited: Apr 29, 2020


    As I have placed my deposit for a F8, I wonder if I should consider a 720S instead. I’m assuming the F8 doesn’t drive much differently from the 488. Anyone want to chime in on his opinion of the 488?

    His statement regarding the Ferrari driving dynamics and that it ultimately isn’t worth its asking price is a little disconcerting...
     
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  3. IPO1

    IPO1 F1 Rookie

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  4. johnr265

    johnr265 Formula Junior

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    Ok, that's a useless video. The complaint that driver had was with handling and that car's suspension has been modified. Not all mods make a car better, and with less suspension travel, aftermarket rims, and who knows what alignment settings, you can't judge the handling of that car compared to what Ferrari engineered in the stock car.

    Also, why compare it to a highly modified Porsche?

    I can't speak to the McLaren comparison but I have owned the 488 and 911 GT3. They are both magnificent cars and I loved the handling of both. They are very different cars but the Ferrari is a wonderful car to drive. Every bit the passionate exotic while the Porsche is surgically precise, almost clinical. Add a Forza exhaust controller to the 488 and the sound is actually not that bad too (otherwise, it's too quiet).

    Haven't driven the F8 but I would be willing to bet you won't be disappointed. Watch some more reputable reviews and go with your heart. (BTW, the backup camera on the 488 is AWFUL so once again, they are wrong. So low and distorted it's near impossible to tell what you're looking at)
     
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  5. SoCal to az

    SoCal to az F1 World Champ
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    F8 is faster, wuicker, more nimble than 488. Both great cars. Porsche/. Totally different- not as fast in a straight line but tighter, and quick around corners.

    720- to me is the ultimate vehicle right now and you can get great deals.

    No right or wrong choices here. All amazing. Just have to decide what kind of driving you want to do.
     
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  6. Jo Sta7

    Jo Sta7 F1 Rookie
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    Mclaren 720S in U.K. just auctioned for about $170k USD including buyers premium. I think 720S is a $175k car in USA in short period of time unless dealers are willing to hang onto inventory. Lease deals on brand new spiders are insane. It’s possibly the best performing series production car of all time and the discounts are wild.
     
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  8. mkraft3003

    mkraft3003 Formula Junior

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    Lots of threads already on this exact subject. How about this one to start:https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/f8-versus-720s.618508/
     
  9. Jason B

    Jason B Formula Junior

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  10. dustman

    dustman F1 Veteran
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    If you can get a 720 for <$200k....damn. Where????
     
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  12. dustman

    dustman F1 Veteran
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  13. Lukeylikey

    Lukeylikey Formula 3
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    What a time to auction a 720 though? I am fully (and personally) aware of how weak McLaren residuals are, but we are in lockdown. Buyer paid £130,500 after premium. If he can even pick the car up, where can he go with it? Seems like a bargain, car looks to be a straight one (impossible to know for sure, but looks ok). But why would you sell unless you were forced to (listing had no reserve) and if you’re forced to at this crazy time, the market will be merciless.

    Chris Harris tweeted that this shows the real market price but I disagree to a point. It clearly shows today’s market price, but today there is no functioning market - a perfect market has free supply of goods, sellers and buyers, with no restriction on transactions taking place. There is never a ‘perfect’ market, but today, most of the sellers are closed, all of the buyers are locked away, and the point of the product (to drive on open, free roads) is not allowed! This buyer has bought in faith that at some point we are going to start to get back to ‘normal’ but there will be a new normal - so whenever that arrives he/she is betting that this 720 will be ok. A normally functioning market could be 6 months away, or even more. Seller pays a premium for the buyer taking that risk.

    For those with 720s that they plan to sell in 6 months and beyond, surely the expected price today is £130,500 plus that ‘premium’ the seller had to pay the buyer to take a risk in the heart of a pandemic? In 6 months time the 720 auction buyer might well feel he made an excellent buy, but he is still taking a risk, hence the low price.

    Without question, used prices will be volatile over the next couple of years. But that does not mean buyers won’t see value in paying more than this level. Dealers will use this as evidence to bid on any 720s coming their way, but if they want to sell their newer product, that game gets stale quickly because they need buyers more than sellers.

    Someone suggested on Twitter that McLaren should have bought this car, given the lease deals with buyback they are using to sell new cars. That about says it for me. The finance company will not be liking this and the subsidies they require from McLaren just went up by much more than the value of this car.
     
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  14. mdrums

    mdrums Formula Junior

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    It is all personal opinions....get the car you like the best and just enjoy it.
     
  15. SoCal to az

    SoCal to az F1 World Champ
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    Truer words could not be said. All great cars. No bad choices here. Just different choices.
     
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  16. IPO1

    IPO1 F1 Rookie

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    Did a quick check, $209 is cheapest and a 2018, they quickly got to $225.

    There is always the cheap one...Ogara had one a few weeks ago for like $195....with 18K miles. Always something to justify price.
     
  17. Jo Sta7

    Jo Sta7 F1 Rookie
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    I check every day, car prices for all brands dropped significantly and then bottomed in the first few weeks of Covid. They haven’t moved much. I think dealers are scared of continually dropping prices but frankly they aren’t moving inventory. Just look online, same cars listed for months. I don’t know if they’ll take low balls. They may be dug in. If the economy sucks in 6 months it could be a different story as they’ll have no choice.
     
  18. Coincid

    Coincid F1 Rookie

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    The best value super car currently is a used 720S.
     
  19. LVP488

    LVP488 F1 Rookie

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    A 488 GTB victim of consistent bashing should be even cheaper and could be an even better deal than a 720S - of course it's not as fast though.
    Regarding the video, as mentioned above, judging a car based on an example that has been subject to debatable tinkering (changing wheels and suspensions just for the look) is really not fair.
    The 488 can probably be optimised (adjusting suspensions in the same directions as mentioned here for the Pista https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/pista-alignment-video-at-manthey-racing.619579/) depending on personal preference and intended use, but the current set-up (designed to accommodate the average user) is far from catastrophic.
    The F8 is very similar to the 488, but its added power puts it in the same performance league as the 720S (while the 488 GTB is undeniably slower).
    The need for performance is also personal - some people claim a 458 has already more than enough, while some will say a 488 is far too slow (while the 488 is a lot faster than the 458); personnally I would not like to be limited to the 458 performance and I would prefer the F8 but I do not think it's currently worth the money compared to my 488.
     
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  20. Coincid

    Coincid F1 Rookie

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    In Canada, the depreciation of 720S has been more aggressive than 488. Seems to parallel the situation in most US markets.
     
  21. Coincid

    Coincid F1 Rookie

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    There is a salient difference in the driving dynamics between the 488 and F8. I found the 488 as very capable and technically adept but for my taste lacking in involvement and engagement. Compared to the 488, The F8 elevates noticeably every objective and subjective parameter. If your proclivities reside on the desire for stellar technical and objective metrics, the 720S, especially used which represents the finest value currently available, is the one to buy.
     
  22. dustman

    dustman F1 Veteran
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    Ferrari also does a very good job of price collusion to maintain used prices.
     
  23. Coincid

    Coincid F1 Rookie

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    Ferrari and their dealers, have long established that competing discounting is self defeating. That practice will only inevitably lead to lower pricing for everyone. The concept adheres to the belief that for those who are intent in purchasing a Ferrari, the sale price will remain relatively consistent between dealers. No interest in competing with other brands if that involves lowering prices.
     
  24. Nincompoop

    Nincompoop Rookie

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    #22 Nincompoop, Apr 30, 2020
    Last edited: Apr 30, 2020
    I have read every response and truly appreciate everyones contribution and patience with a rehashed topic. Every single one of you guys has valuable experience to offer and I appreciate that you took the time to state your opinion on this matter.

    The pista thread regarding the suspension and toe out characteristics plus the video I linked made me question, is Ferrari doing something wrong? This will be my first foyer into the super car world. And as mentioned above it seems very much more opinion than science at this point. I don’t live near a mclaren dealer and Ferrari ownership is on my bucket list, which is why I’m here and not on a mclaren forum.

    but ~350US for an F8 or 250US for a used 720S
     
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  25. LVP488

    LVP488 F1 Rookie

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    A brand new car is typically bad value for money compared to a used one - then there are personal factors, like the happiness of specifically configuring your car to your tastes, and enjoyment of the whole process from order to delivery: they may be considered worth the added price, it is really personal.
    Regarding the set-up, all these cars are set-up for multiple uses by mutiple users so there are always compromises - this being said, Ferrari is typically relatively efficient in this respect, and McLaren (although they might have improved with the 720S) was rather relying on superior power than on better set-up.
    As an example for that - when driven by the same driver on the same track, a 675 LT (in theory the track oriented McLaren of the time) was basically not faster than a heavier (and officially more road-oriented) 488 GTB; which is a good testament to Ferrari's ability, although the car tested, being provided by Ferrari, may have had specific suspension adjustments.
    Using the 488 for some self promotion to show it's not that bad :p https://www.ferrarichat.com/forum/threads/post-your-best-lap-times.510170/page-10
     
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  26. SoCal to az

    SoCal to az F1 World Champ
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    Just know in a few years that F8 will also be 250k. I cant fault you for buying the F8 over a 720 just as I couldn't fault someone for saving 100k+ by going with the Mclaren. We all have different budgets, likes/dislikes. There is no wrong choice here. Just know an F8 if you want to spec one out is a ways off. A year maybe? There will be used cars, demo cars but they will command a premium currently being the latest and greatest.

    If you must do Ferrari, don't count out the 488. You could get a 488, order an F8 and sell the 488 when the F8 comes. Again- just depends on how much financial pain you want to put yourself though.

    Good luck with the journey. Its a great ride.
     
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  27. Nincompoop

    Nincompoop Rookie

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    Thank you SoCal! The F8 is definitely 1+ years out. Buying a 488 and calling it a day is probably a more wise decision since the difference is negligible, to me at least. Unfortunately I wanted to experience the whole process of a new order. I’m beginning to think I should buy a used 720S while I wait for the F8 or even just get over myself and pick up a used F8 in a few years
     
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