Ferrari's new styling Sucks!

Mark(study) · Nov 11, 2003

"Mark, when has Ferrari's main goal ever been to be exotic? Making pure exotic cars has never been in the business plan- Sophistication, elegance, style, driving really well... I think those are"

I got tricked in the 80's when Ferrari gave us all exotic looks 308/TR/F40
And in the 90's with the 348/355/F50/512TR

Texas Forever · Nov 11, 2003

WOW, the new FerrariChat must be working! I normally avoid threads like this one because, well, they typically start out low and then the fires start.

But here, you guys are having a reasonably sane discussion over an emotional issue, i.e., some like blondes, some like brunettes, some like raven-haired beauties swaying in the moon light, and some of you like flat-headed drawfs (you know, the ones that have a level spot where you can set your beer). And while I haven't read the entire thread, it appears that there has not been one flame!

Bravo!

DrTax

ps I like Maranellos because they remind me of Camaros, ha!

parkerfe · Nov 11, 2003

Of course the 550/575 look most like what Enzo wanted his road cars to look like. He fought his own engineers for years before he gave in to using mid-engined designs for his race cars and later his road cars.

absent · Nov 11, 2003

In short: Ferraris (360,575,612)are classy,ultimate cars that can be driven daily;Lambos are cartoonish pseudo race cars(no heritage from tractor maker),that you buy to impress 15 year old Highschool girls.
(Always considered Lambo owners to be the insecure types with a little pedophile character in them.)

Mark(study) · Nov 11, 2003

Absent,

Your FBI profiling skills seems a bit harsh on the Lambo Drivers. So I'm almost affraid to ask... what are Viper Drivers?

zjpj · Nov 11, 2003

Well, Dr. Tax, I guess you now have to take back that commendation....

Napolis · Nov 11, 2003

parkerfe said:

Of course the 550/575 look most like what Enzo wanted his road cars to look like. He fought his own engineers for years before he gave in to using mid-engined designs for his race cars and later his road cars.
Click to expand...

Frank
You ever meet Enzo? Talk to him? Sit in a room with him as he discussed what he wanted the F40 to be? Stand next to him as he watched it being unveiled and whispered "Bella..." Noticed the photo of the 3 P4's crossing the line at Daytona or the 512S blasting through the Targa Floria? (All midengined cars) he had on his office walls on the day he died?

Gary(SF) · Nov 11, 2003

Mark(study) said:

Dictonary says

Take the name plates off and-
360 blends in at the stop light
Click to expand...

Man, you are hangin' out at different stop lights than I am! What a strange comment. You must live in Hollywood, right?

ernie · Nov 11, 2003

Frari

I have seriously thought about getting a Lambo as my next exotic, which is why I started this thread. I have thought about it on several levels. In the looks department, compaired to similarly priced Ferrari's, the looks of the Lambo's are more exotic. In the performance area, compaired to the similarly priced 360, the new Gillardo gives you more bang for your buck. In the maintainance department, compaired to any new Ferrari, the new Lambo's have NO CAM BELTS! Every time I have compaired the the new Ferrari's against the new Lambo's the Ferrari's just don't stack up, and I don't like it. I am not drawn to them as before. The first time I ever saw a Testerossa was on the Pacific Coast Highway in Malibu. We were driving home, and I saw this white car that was low, wide, and exotic looking, parked on the side of the road. When I saw it I yeld, "Whoooooa did you see that?!" to my brother. "Was that a Ferrari?", "I dunno, it looked like one", "Maybe it is a new one?" was what my brother and I said right after I yeld. We made my dad turn the car around and park it, so that we could get out and go see if that awesome looking car we just passed was a Ferrari. Sure enough, to our pleasant surprise, it was. This was when Crocket was still driving the Daytona, before the Testarossa appeared on Miami Vice. The new cars are lacking the spark that the old cars have. The first time I saw a 550, was at night on the freeway. I thought it was an Aston Martin, until I saw the horse on the back. Just this past weekend, I was at a news stand and saw a picture of this car that looked like a new Maserati concept car, or wait, maybe it was a TVR prototype. Wrong! It was the new 612, and man is it ugly. That is when I lost it. A Ferrari should never get mistaken for another make of car, and should never be considered ugly, Never. Ferrari is also quickly loosing ground in the performance area, on their street cars. The AMG SL55 will bloody the nose of the 550. The Z06 will blacken the eye of the 360. Both cars will do it for less money and more reliability. You can even take a Subaru WRX, put $25K in mods on it, and it will kick the 575's ass, at a savings to the tune of $200,000.00. Ferrari is slipping, and I don't like it one bit. They are turning into the has been professional sports player, that is making waaaaayyy too much money, and should have retired two seasons ago. This lastest creation makes them look like the old grey haired man, that dyes his thinning hair, has had a face lift, and spends to much time in the tanning booth. Ferrari needs to make a huge come back on the street, just like they did on the F1 circuit. Please spare me the Enzo talk. I like Ferrari's, which is why I own one. But the only sence of racing heritage the new Ferrari's seem to have, is that little yellow badge on the hood, and the chrome horse on the back.

madturk · Nov 11, 2003

It's ok that you think Ferrari design sucks...
Opinions are like a..sholes everyone has got one.

ForzaFerrari · Nov 11, 2003

Napolis said:

Frank
You ever meet Enzo? Talk to him? Sit in a room with him as he discussed what he wanted the F40 to be? Stand next to him as he watched it being unveiled and whispered "Bella..." Noticed the photo of the 3 P4's crossing the line at Daytona or the 512S blasting through the Targa Floria? (All midengined cars) he had on his office walls on the day he died?
Click to expand...

Napolis...did you do.. meet Enzo? It sounds like you did

parkerfe · Nov 11, 2003

Napolis, while I never meet Enzo, I have read a lot about him including his quote that "...the wagon never pushes a horse...the horse always pulls the wagon..." In fact, Ferrari lost a lot of races in the late 50s and early 60s due to Enzos refusal to go to the mid-engined design when all the other F1 teams did so. He may have accepted the mid-engined designs later on, but not in the beginning.

Napolis · Nov 11, 2003

parkerfe said:

Napolis, while I never meet Enzo, I have read a lot about him including his quote that "...the wagon never pushes a horse...the horse always pulls the wagon..." In fact, Ferrari lost a lot of races in the late 50s and early 60s due to Enzos refusal to go to the mid-engined design when all the other F1 teams did so. He may have accepted the mid-engined designs later on, but not in the beginning.
Click to expand...

Frank
Over the course of our lives we all say a lot of things. Mr. Ferrari may have held on to front engine design too long but he was smart enough to move on. There were tears in his eyes on the day they unveiled the F40 and they were tears of joy...

Hubert · Nov 11, 2003

parkerfe said:

Napolis, while I never meet Enzo, I have read a lot about him including his quote that "...the wagon never pushes a horse...the horse always pulls the wagon..." In fact, Ferrari lost a lot of races in the late 50s and early 60s due to Enzos refusal to go to the mid-engined design when all the other F1 teams did so. He may have accepted the mid-engined designs later on, but not in the beginning.
Click to expand...

actually, it's "... the horse should pull the cart, not push it..." and he also said "... aerodynamics is for those who can't built great engines..." and he was also one of the last to go to disc brakes, etc., but , i think you should remember that we're talking about designs (the shapes), and i don't remember any of the ferrari shapes being penned by enzo, rather, it was some pinanfarina guy, no?

and , if we're going to get alegorical about enzo (like some greek tragedy), he's *said* to not have even cared about the road cars; therefore, his comments pertaining to the design, build and execution of said cars must have been made under the cloud of ether, or by some ominous , misanthropic deity meant to ruse us all into buying these ugly, mundane overprice horsecarts, or is it tractors. no, wait, trailers... aww hell, i'm all confused now. where do i put this damned horse again? which way is mt. olympus? did i bring enough hemlock?? dammit.

allanlambo · Nov 11, 2003

rodsky said:

Allan they may be over inflated but people are paying those prices. People will pay $150K for a 2 year old 360 - which is the car you say sucks. There are obviously a lot of people (more than there are cars available that will pay for that styling and appreciate it). Show me any Lambo that goes for sticker 2 years later. Simple economics - more demand than supply, price goes up. Same cannot be said for the Murci - which I think is a nice car with exotic looks.

As for the 575, it's kinda near the end of its run - the 550 has been around for 6 years. It is discounted but is expensive to begin with.

Mark (Study) - we agree. Sounds like your tastes are leading to "I want a more in your face car". You dont seem to like the 360's looks. Then perhaps you should buy a Lambo or an F40/F50 etc. I dont think people are defending Ferrari's looks - some people prefer them the way they are vs. the competition. Some of us dont want a GT car to be in your face. That's not defending the looks - that's stating a preference.
Click to expand...

Not many people are paying those prices, people are asking those prices. And with this OVERINFLATION, in the end, will come huge DEPRECIATION at a rate that will boggle the mind.

Like i said, the 360 sells to this day, because of the turmoil created at its introduction which continues to this day. It is the only car that keeps Ferrari going. It is the only car that can semi allow the people who loved Ferrari for what it was, to go on today.

Ive never actually used the words "sucks" with the 360. But in the general sense of the word, it does not suck, but it sucks for a Ferrari. They are dull, and ive driven them extensively. I just sent Robiferretti video of me running one up to 150-160mph. Very Dull.

In my opinion, Lamborghini hammers Ferrari in every sense of the word. Wish it wasnt that way, because i have room in my garage for both.

allanlambo · Nov 11, 2003

absent said:

In short: Ferraris (360,575,612)are classy,ultimate cars that can be driven daily;Lambos are cartoonish pseudo race cars(no heritage from tractor maker),that you buy to impress 15 year old Highschool girls.
(Always considered Lambo owners to be the insecure types with a little pedophile character in them.)
Click to expand...

Funny comments coming from the owner of a 2nd rate vehicle. That is if you actually own a Ferrari.

Napolis · Nov 11, 2003

allanlambo said:

Funny comments coming from the owner of a 2nd rate vehicle. That is if you actually own a Ferrari.
Click to expand...

absent
One of the greatest racedrivers of all time Mario Andretti loves, owns, and drives Lambo's. Inferring that he, or Allan for that matter is a pedophile is extremely offensive, stupid and untrue.

snj5 · Nov 11, 2003

One of Ing. Ferrari's great strengths was that he did change his mind well enough to keep his comparatively tiny company at the forefront of world motorsports for a half century, and produce roadcars which mirrored that passion. Ferrari still grows and changes, and seem to be doing quite well. Well enough not to have to make an SUV, anyway...
I'm glad things I said decades ago are not touted as dogma.

best
rt
"One of the most entertaining things about some 'Ferrari people' is how many think they know better what defines a Ferrari than the factory that made them."

rodsky · Nov 11, 2003

allanlambo said:

Not many people are paying those prices, people are asking those prices. And with this OVERINFLATION, in the end, will come huge DEPRECIATION at a rate that will boggle the mind.

Like i said, the 360 sells to this day, because of the turmoil created at its introduction which continues to this day. It is the only car that keeps Ferrari going. It is the only car that can semi allow the people who loved Ferrari for what it was, to go on today.

Ive never actually used the words "sucks" with the 360. But in the general sense of the word, it does not suck, but it sucks for a Ferrari. They are dull, and ive driven them extensively. I just sent Robiferretti video of me running one up to 150-160mph. Very Dull.

In my opinion, Lamborghini hammers Ferrari in every sense of the word. Wish it wasnt that way, because i have room in my garage for both.
Click to expand...

What turmoil are you talking about? Its like you're trying to pull the wool over a teenagers eyes. A 360 sells for a high price - above MSRP - because it is desireable. A Murcielago sells below MSRP because not enough people are willing to pay that price for them - plain and simple. Forget confusion, which ones better, Lambo's faster, Lambo's better etc. - those are the facts. If a 360 sucks for a Ferrari - somehow the people that are lining up to buy them haven't figured that out. You and 20 of your closest friends may think that Lambo's better but the numbers dont support your argument.

Now, Allan - you were so well behaved for a few weeks after you went off the deep end 4 weeks ago. Even James is coming to your defence. You and Bruce were getting along (even after you insulted his family). Its good to have the older and less well behaved Allan back. I figured we had a fake for a few weeks.

allanlambo · Nov 11, 2003

rodsky said:

What turmoil are you talking about? Its like you're trying to pull the wool over a teenagers eyes. A 360 sells for a high price - above MSRP - because it is desireable. A Murcielago sells below MSRP because not enough people are willing to pay that price for them - plain and simple. Forget confusion, which ones better, Lambo's faster, Lambo's better etc. - those are the facts. If a 360 sucks for a Ferrari - somehow the people that are lining up to buy them haven't figured that out. You and 20 of your closest friends may think that Lambo's better but the numbers dont support your argument.

Now, Allan - you were so well behaved for a few weeks after you went off the deep end 4 weeks ago. Even James is coming to your defence. You and Bruce were getting along (even after you insulted his family). Its good to have the older and less well behaved Allan back. I figured we had a fake for a few weeks.
Click to expand...

This has nothing to do with what happened a few weeks ago. The turmoil over 360's is started with the dealers who sell to specific people only who then resell the vehicles. Dealers order the cars in specific numbers according to their orders.while Lambo just shoves cars down dealers throats. This causes the escalated price. This in turn hurts the true enthuisiasts who gets stuck with huge depreciation in the end.

Again, the 360 is desirable, mostly because it is the cheap Ferrari. Lambos may depreciate as normal cars do, but so does the 550/575/456 and i wont even mention what happened to the speculators who tried to make a buck on the Barchetta.

And again, I know for a fact, these cars do not sell for what theyre advertised for. Uncles 360 bought for sticker, 1 month ago new 360 Spider, bought for STICKER. Not on waiting list, walked into dealer, traded 360 walked out with Spider. 2 years ago he purchased an 00 360 for 145,000 with 3,000 miles on it.

Hubert888 · Nov 11, 2003

Except the newest 2003 Lambos, all the other Lambos look the same. And dont tell me to get my eyes checked because it is true!

allanlambo · Nov 11, 2003

Hubert888 said:

Except the newest 2003 Lambos, all the other Lambos look the same. And dont tell me to get my eyes checked because it is true!
Click to expand...

LOL! Yes a Countach and a Diablo are virtually identical! Better get them checked.

JaguarXJ6 · Nov 12, 2003

LOL! No more identical than a 308/328 and a 348/355.

I'd rather have a 355 (for mechanical quality sake and a drop top), a 246, a 512bbi or no Ferrari. Hand me the keys to a new Ferrari no strings attached and I'd give them to DES and not lose sleep over it.

Sunny

allanlambo · Nov 12, 2003

Hand me the keys to an Enzo and im keeping that one!

wax · Nov 12, 2003

Lamborghini HQ:
"Qualcosa manca..."

(la mano colpisce la fronte) 'La pala del air!'

"Bisogno di più tinfoil!"

'Ci dimentichiamo sempre di includere quello nel disegno reale, non come i geniuses di Ferrari'

_________

Ferrari HQ:
"È perfetto"

'Sì, includiamo il rendimento di aria nei nostri disegni. Non come quelle mucche di Lamborghini.'

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