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First ferrari

Discussion in '348/355' started by ginsuguy, May 6, 2006.

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  1. ginsuguy

    ginsuguy Karting

    May 4, 2006
    209
    My first one...a 1990 348 ts with 10k miles. The last service was done at 7500 in 1999...What should I be doing to insure troble free driving? All the oils look clean, and no leaks on the floor...Thanks all. I really enjoy the site
     
  2. chaa

    chaa F1 Veteran

    Mar 21, 2003
    5,058
    So the belts are not 7 years old:( Either get a s**T load of money of the price to cover the belt change, and get it to the shop ASAP. Or have the seller take the car to the shop for the belt change. Or leave it dude.
    Also worth considering is the fact that most ferrari owners dont know there arse from there elbow. So by there reconing a service involves changing the oil even if its only once a year.
    So by your potential ferrari having clean oil, then some one has to have taken care of it even if its with out the shop. But must have skiped on the belt.
     
  3. tstafford

    tstafford Formula Junior

    Mar 4, 2006
    754
    Nashville
    Full Name:
    Tim
    I also think belt service is in order.
     
  4. BT

    BT F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa

    Mar 21, 2005
    15,291
    FL / GA
    Full Name:
    Bill Tracy
    Get a good mechanic to look the car over and have the engine out service done (timing belt, etc...). Sounds like a nice car. Any pictures??? I had some preventative electrical work done when I first got my 348 qand it has been trouble free since then (about a year).
    :D
    BT
     
  5. No Doubt

    No Doubt Seven Time F1 World Champ

    May 21, 2005
    72,740
    Vegas+Alabama
    Full Name:
    Mr. Sideways
    The 348 is fairly unique in using only a single timing belt for all 4 cams + waterpump...that's a lot of stress, under tension, for a 7 year old belt.

    You might get lucky and never have a problem, but for peace of mind I'd suggest that you get that belt, waterpump, and tensioners changed.

    All Ferraris should have a fire extinguisher (I've got 2, an automatic one in the engine bay and a hand-held one behind the passenger seat). You'll want one for the 3 main types of fires: A, B, and C.

    Other than the above major items, performing these simple tasks will take care of countless minor problems proactively: http://webpages.charter.net/aircover/348/1994Ferrari348Spider.html#postprep
     
  6. ginsuguy

    ginsuguy Karting

    May 4, 2006
    209
    Thanks everyone for the great info.
    The belts, water pump and alternator was chaned at 7500 miles but that was 7 yrs ago...I guess you are all saying, do it again...correct? What was the preventative maint that was done by one member?
     
  7. PerryJ

    PerryJ Formula 3

    Jun 5, 2003
    1,909
    N. Alabama
    Full Name:
    John Perry
    YES by all means do it now ;)
     
  8. PassionIsFerrari

    PassionIsFerrari Formula 3

    Aug 15, 2004
    2,454
    Ok, Listen to me...I am speaking from current experience...

    My timing belt stripped teeth on me 2 months ago...The last belt change was in early 2000 with 9K miles....It stripped with just under 30K, 6 years later...and with 21k miles on the belts...

    Though I am currently removing the motor to diagnosis the problem, my personal feeling is that the water pump bearing seized which cause the failure. The water pump bearing was NOT replaced when they did the major the first...

    And yours PROBABLY was not done either, so even if the belt is fine...IT WILL STILL GO IF THE WATER PUMP BEARING SEIZES!

    I hope I am scaring the crap out of you with these, at least enough to get that major service done immediately...because at least you will not be in the position I am in right now....

    308, 328 belts last a lot longer, so disregard those guys that are telling you that belts don't shed....those cars have 2 belts and do not have a waterpump running off of it too....348's (and certain Mondials) have more stress running on the belts then any other Ferrari...

    Trust me....get it done...

    Don't be one of the people that have to learn the hard way....such as me!
     
  9. PAP 348

    PAP 348 Ten Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Dec 10, 2005
    100,220
    Mount Isa, Australia
    Full Name:
    Pap

    Do the t-belt change man,and tensioners,waterpump ect...but dont worry about replacing the alternator. Replace the alternator and A/C belts while its all apart,but not the actual alternator itself. If thats what you were thinking? :)
     
  10. ginsuguy

    ginsuguy Karting

    May 4, 2006
    209
    No, the alternator was replaced at 7500 as was the water pump, and all belts. While that was only 2500 miles ago, it was 7yrs ago. Does age really impact these belts?
    Anyway, bought the car with 10k miles for 38k. A good deal but hope I don't put the difference back in...
     
  11. No Doubt

    No Doubt Seven Time F1 World Champ

    May 21, 2005
    72,740
    Vegas+Alabama
    Full Name:
    Mr. Sideways

    You bought it right, and it was priced for needing its major service.

    Rebuilding your top end (valves, valve guides, machining heads) will cost you $10k when your timing belt breaks, plus some down time for the car being in the shop. It's actually slightly cheaper to buy and install a salvaged 348 motor in many cases, especially if bottom end damage was done to pistons/crank/dry-sump etc.

    So basically you are risking $10k for delaying the car's inevitable "major service" for a bit. Since the major service will cost anywhere from $3.5k to $6k, many people choose to take the risk.

    It's a financial equation for many.

    My suggestion is to do the belt/waterpump/tensioners change upfront so that you can fully enjoy the 348 driving experience, rather than always worrying if the next time you start her up will cost you $10k.
     
  12. mark328

    mark328 Guest

    Jul 30, 2005
    664
    Mi
    Full Name:
    Mark
    Ferrari recommends the major service every 5 years. You may beable to go longer just depends if your a gambling man. Approx. 6k-8k now for the service or 18k-20k later if the belt breaks.
     
  13. Bullfighter

    Bullfighter Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jan 26, 2005
    22,594
    Gates Mills, Ohio
    Full Name:
    Jon
    Ferrari's updated tech bulletin recommends a belt change for all V8's every three years.

    But in response to the original post, yes - a $38K 348 was priced knowing it needs a major service. If you end up in the mid-$40K range with the belts and any incidentals taken care of, you're fine, IMO.
     
  14. mark328

    mark328 Guest

    Jul 30, 2005
    664
    Mi
    Full Name:
    Mark
     
  15. Bullfighter

    Bullfighter Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jan 26, 2005
    22,594
    Gates Mills, Ohio
    Full Name:
    Jon
    Could be, but if we're going to quote what Ferrari recommends (whether it makes sense or not...) then I believe the 3-year interval for the V8s is accurate.
     
  16. mark328

    mark328 Guest

    Jul 30, 2005
    664
    Mi
    Full Name:
    Mark
    As long as people believe they will next recommend the belt service every 2 years. One of the reason that I sold my car was because of the additude of an employee at the dealership and what he was trying to sell me didn't make sense. I guess it was a slow time of the year.
     
  17. ecoloqua

    ecoloqua Karting

    Mar 15, 2006
    148
    Bought my 348 a month ago. 91 w/19k miles 15k w belt service was done back in 2000 with 10k miles on the odometer. The belt only had 9k miles on it but it was 6 years old. I did what everyone on this board suggested and took it in to the dealer for another major. The were some extras so the whole service ended up over $7,000. Who knows how long I could have gone on the old belt but I know that every time I would open it up I would have that fear in the back of mind that the belt could break and spell diaster. In other words, If you dont do the belt service when its time to do it you cant fully enjoy the car and drive it the way it was meant to be driven.
    On a side note, I asked the mechanic about the water pump and was told that it was just fine so we left it alone. Not sure about what all the fuss is about that.
     
  18. ginsuguy

    ginsuguy Karting

    May 4, 2006
    209
    I guess my next logical question would be " anyway to look at the belt to see if it needs service or not"? Excuse my lack of F knowledge.....
     
  19. Bullfighter

    Bullfighter Two Time F1 World Champ
    Lifetime Rossa Owner

    Jan 26, 2005
    22,594
    Gates Mills, Ohio
    Full Name:
    Jon
    It is a logical question, and I believe there is a way to see the belt with the engine still in the car. But I don't think anyone here would tell you to rely on a visual inspection of the belt to confirm that a major service could be put off till later. As tmobileguy said above, the timing belt arrangement can fail due to causes other than the rubber belt itself giving out.
     
  20. Whisky

    Whisky Three Time F1 World Champ
    Silver Subscribed

    Jan 27, 2006
    31,855
    In the flight path to Offutt
    Full Name:
    The original Fernando
    You sure about that ? For the motor compartment I'd suggest Purple K as the extinguishment, it's the king for gas/oil fires, ABC is 'fair' at best, but inadequate.

    I may have misread that: ABC may be OK for the driver compartment, but for the backend, it won't work at all.
     
  21. Dr.T348

    Dr.T348 Formula 3

    Jan 8, 2004
    1,599
    Chicago NW Burbs
    Full Name:
    Richard T.

    Remove the top of the cam belt cover on either side and you can inspect the belts. You cannot see the tensioner pulley
     
  22. No Doubt

    No Doubt Seven Time F1 World Champ

    May 21, 2005
    72,740
    Vegas+Alabama
    Full Name:
    Mr. Sideways
    Belt service isn't typically about the belt itself, but about the bearings inside the tensioners and water pump.

    You can remove the timing belt cover caps on top of the engine. That will let you see the timing belt (e.g. obvious physical gashes/cracks/loose teeth) and the anti-belt-slap timing-belt guides. The belt guides should *not* be physically touching your timing belt (but should be very, very close to touching). The belt guides can be adjusted with a 5mm allen key wrench from on top/back of the engine.

    However, if you have a Ferrari 348 made after the switch to black plastic timing belt covers, you run a very real risk of shattering the plastic (it becomes brittle with age/engine-heat) into your timing belt, belt pulleys, etc. from doing any of the above.

    So you could cause far more harm than good just by looking.

    You can remove the entire outer cam covers from beneath the car with the engine still in situ. With a Staeger tensiometer you can then check the tension on your belt.

    But none of the above can assure you that your belt is good...the above can really only tell you "bad" or "unknown."

    And none of the above addresses the condition of your waterpump and belt tensioner bearings...the most common cause of failed "belts."

    If you are worried about it, then do the major service to get the belt, tensionsers, and water pump changed. That's my suggestion.

    If you aren't worried about it, then just drive her.

    It's an easy call. Either you are worried about the belt service or not.
     
  23. No Doubt

    No Doubt Seven Time F1 World Champ

    May 21, 2005
    72,740
    Vegas+Alabama
    Full Name:
    Mr. Sideways

    I'm not entirely sure about it, but Class B is gasoline.

    http://www.hanford.gov/fire/safety/extingrs.htm
     
  24. brent Lachelt

    brent Lachelt Formula 3

    Dec 6, 2003
    1,831
    Brownsburg, INDIANA
    Full Name:
    Brent R.Lachelt
    What he said! My understanding is that these belts rarely break in two. Rather they strip several teeth off, which can have the same horrible effect with the valves as if it broke in two. Thus making a visual inspection less than reliable. Sound right? Kinda like looking at a heart during open heart surgery and trying to determine if there is plaque in the coronary arteries just by looking at it from the outside. How can you really tell if those teeth are weakened and close to failing from just a visual inspection?
     
  25. ginsuguy

    ginsuguy Karting

    May 4, 2006
    209
    Any pictures that show where the fire extinguishers go? And why do we need them? Prone to fires???
    Also, the owners manual is awful in that it does not provide a lot of info about driving the car or the various controls.any web sites available that do a better job of explaining the car a bit more?
    Thanks everyone!!! Blown away by everyone's knowledge....
     

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