FORMULA 1 PIRELLI GRAND PRIX DE FRANCE 2018: RACE *** SPOILERS ***

Bottas was the one closest to the normal racing line ,Lewis was well over to the left as was Vettel.That is why Bottas could brake later ,he actually left a lot of space on the inside as he was likely expecting Vettel to be right alongside him..

 

Following directly behind someone at a safe distance into a corner while staying on the racing line is not a stunt.

Cutting in front of someone on the racing line in the middle of a fast corner from an outside line at the last second is a mistake. Bottas was not trying to pull a stunt but he misjudge the move because he probably forgot how fast this corner is and how big a role downforce plays with this season's cars.

Bottas made a kamikaze dive from the outside and knowledgeable people in the sport will easily recognize that, whether they will consciously or subconsciously admit it is another matter, open to politics, just as it is on this forum.

 

He made a mistake, but who said that he would have not made a mistake if he drove a different line? Who says that "if" he would have taken other tires and simply followed Bottas into turn one he would have not hit by anybody else loosing every single point..."if, would,..." do not help at all and are not even worth discussing.

And Lewis DID make this mistake before sending Nico off the track and he got no penalty at all...so why does he complain at all???

 

No, you are wrong.

Bottas's outside line only works if there is a straight after the left turn and only if you have a slow corner. That is why HE CHANGED his line, to Lewis's and Vettel's. He CUT IN FRONT of Vettel.

Back to your suggestion Bottas's original outside line is the "normal racing line" - it's not in this case because this is a fast ESS (S) TURN. It has a LEFT TURN (see #1 corner below) taken at 165 kph and then immediately a RIGHT TURN (#2) so the racing line to the LEFT TURN (#1) is the INSIDE LINE, to give you the better (inside) approach to the RIGHT TURN. #2 is taken at 200 kph so you must be smooth.

In racing, smooth is fastest. You also have to link up closely spaced turns, not take each turn in isolation.

If you still don't believe, then ask yourself why Lewis took the same line as Vettel. Lewis is very smooth and it accounts for why he is so fast in qualifying, his car's capacity notwithstanding.

Again, Bottas CHANGED HIS LINE... because it would not have worked in this fast a corner, especially since he was going even faster than Lewis. He would have gone wide, OFF THE TRACK. Bottas was going too fast on the outside and he caused a crash when he tried to avoid scrubbing off speed and he changed his line to block Vettel without giving enough space.

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I read your last sentence to everyone here and there was much laughter. Thanks for brightening up the morning.

 

Ahh really ..? LOL

For your education this actually how Lewis did drive a current F1 car around Paul Ricard to put it on pole a couple of days ago ..

 

Isn't it consoling that misery loves company.

I hope I didn't spoil everyone's morning in Chilliwack by not going along with "fake news".

 

If you haven't already worked it out ..Lewis was defending the corner at the start , and for your education he was not doing anywhere near 330.8 KPH ..having started a long way down the straight .

 

Wrong again. Qualifying conditions are different from race conditions. You are talking apples instead of oranges. If every racer took the same line in a mass race as in qualifying THEY WILL ALL CRASH.

In qualifying, you use a clear track and the idea is the same, smooth is fastest. In this case, you turn as EARLY as possible and take the smoothest sweeping approach to hard (potentially slower) corners to make them into fast corners (you straighten the corners), not abrupt last second (LATE) changes in direction which is what Bottas did, abrupt changes is bad for speed and safety and only works if you have the wrong line and enough space from other cars.

In order to take the fast sweeping curve that Lewis made in qualifying, in a mass race, Bottas would have to run over someone on the inside. Remember, cars start 2 abreast and Lewis, Vettel had the better inside line to turn #1. The cars are not starting in a Indian File formation.

Finally, if you were right, Lewis would have attempted to create the same line as he did in qualifying (by swinging right and then cut back to the left). He didn't, he took the same line as Vettel, because it is the fastest line available and it is also the safe line.

If you actually raced before you will know a racer must not change direction and cut in front of another racer in the middle of a corner.

 

You are right, my bad. The 330 kph is the maximum which would have been on a flying approach probably on a qualifying lap.

However, the inside line to Turn 1 remains the correct racing line for the ESS turn. Lewis did not have to defend going into Turn 1 because Vettel would only lose time taking an outside line and have to brake harder for Turn 2.

OTOH, Bottas was in a poor line approaching the ESS and he also took the role of blocking for Lewis. Bottas clearly CHANGED HIS LINE abruptly.

 

Exactly. He cannot afford to not finish and yet puts himself in a position almost immediately at the start to have an accident. Closing on LH at speed loses downforce at a given distance. Just ask Ricci and Max. Vettel has no one but himself to blame. You cannot drive 53 laps in one corner and keeping it clean early opens up further possibilities in later laps. Sorry abut Vettel was simply impatient and again lacks long term thinking. A DNF and an LH win in a race, and he can probably forget the title.

 

4th Gear

The reason Lewis took the inside line was to defend his position ,and he could do that because he was going a lot SLOWER than on a normal lap.

Ok, i will admit i do not have a lot of racing experience .Only FF16oo/FF2000/F3/ in Europe (Spa,Ring,Zandvoort/Jarama, the usual UK circuits etc etc .

Oh ,almost forgot my only F1 car experience Dijon (Arrows)

 

Firstly, referring to your pictures you have posted, Vettel is not butt up square following Hamilton, have a another look.
Bottas is a full car length in front of Vettel, as he moves to take the corner.
As a seasoned F1 driver, one would imagine they are all well aware of the effects of down force.
The move Bottas made was deemed fair by the stewards by all accounts, hence Vettels 5 sec penalty, so hardly a kamikaze move.
Vettel has apologised to Bottas after the race, so why would he do that, if he was as you say innocent in the matter.
The accident dropped Bottas to last place and to make matters worse there was damage to the floor of his car, so hindering his progression back through the field, I'd say that was more of a bad deal for him, rather than the damage Vettel sustained, so if you feel it was his fault, justice was done eh.

As you say it's open to opinion on a forum, and folk see what they want to see.

At least the judgment wasn't as bad as the ref's decisions in the Portugal v Iran football WC cup match

 

...and doing all those circuits in a "'77 308 GTB" too. Kudos to you.

 

Not all of them ,but quite a few.

 

I can't speak for why Vettel did not try to defend himself but politics do play a big role in F1, as well as in FIFA.

Bottas is not a bad driver or nasty person. I actually quite like him. I also quite like Lewis, he's authentic and I don't see why he is often vilified. Vettel is also very pleasant, funny and a skilled driver. So I saw this as a race incident. Vettel approached the corner in a safe manner and Bottas should have held his line and slowed but instead he misjudged the effects of his cutting in so close, so late.

Nobody wants to hit someone and certainly Vettel did not aim for Bottas's car to put him last. Bottas was hoping Vettel could avoid him but he was wrong. Both the Ferraris and Mercedes have excellent brakes and Vettel was already the slowest of the 3 cars to the corner - he clearly locked up because Bottas made a late move and destroyed his downforce.

I don't have much faith in the stewards... it's not because of any single incident but because their decisions are so often controversial and sometimes just plain wrong. I think most of us like to see the best drivers and the best cars/teams do well and win, lesser drivers, cars/teams improve or make a brilliant effort. However, when politics and "dirty tricks" affect races, they ruin the sport.

 

...like I said, kudos to you.

 

Yes fair comments, I can see your point of view, and I can go along with most of it

 

Kudos to you too, tracking a Cali T,exciting?

 

...a 911 GTS and a modified Cali30 HS. It's fun but I need more downforce, and with a bit of luck a solution will happen within a few days.

 

Yes, it's not a personal gripe or put down. Thanks.

 

F1 On-boards


ONBOARDS: The best action from France

https://www.formula1.com/en/video/2018/6/ONBOARDS__The_best_action_from_France.html

 

I would like to see the LH throttle trace from the start to the first corner apex.
Everyone it talking about the terrific start that SV got. Yes it was good, better than VB, but I suspect there was a tactical breathing of the throttle from Lewis to assist Bottas into second on the start. Earlier this year, LH had a good start and Bottas not as good and SV jumped him (spain maybe...?). After the race and in the green room, LH stated that he should have allowed less space for Seb to fill. He did it perfectly this race and Bottas closing down alongside pinned SV to the inside. Had both of them made it, VB would have come second as the following right corner would have him on the inside. It was clumsy on both of their parts and they both paid dearly.....

 

[AMuS] Even with an optimistic forecast Vettel would have been only 2nd in France. But for that he would have had to beat Bottas at the start. That's probably why it was so important for him to win the start against Bottas.

[AMuS] Mercedes data said that in a normal race their lead would have been only a tenth per lap. Not that much, so everything can change.

 

The stewards saw the incident differently and blamed Vettel. I agree with them.
Let's leave it at that. .