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Found my Overheating Problem

Discussion in '308/328' started by Jbryant, Feb 16, 2008.

  1. Jbryant

    Jbryant Karting

    Sep 23, 2006
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    Jeff Bryant
    #1 Jbryant, Feb 16, 2008
    Last edited by a moderator: Sep 7, 2017
    For along time now I have had an overheating problem like most other 308's. While driving, the car would run cool. Maybe just over the first mark on the temp gauge, but at Idle for more then 5 min. like in traffic, the car would go to around 200 to 210F then the fans would come on and the temp would drop to 195F

    A few weeks ago, I talked to Eugenio and he had a new Thermostat, so I removed the old one and installed the new. Now the temps are perfect. Never gets over 195 in traffic.

    Look at the pictures of the old Thermostat. Notice the screw on the top. The weld broke loose and allowed the screw to back out. This screw is what adjusts the opening and closing temp on the thermostat. The weld broke and the screw came loose. This restricted the flow of water to the Radiator allowing the water in the engine to exceed 200F. The water in the Radiator was much cooler so the fans were delayed in coming on.

    I would suggest, if you are having problems like I had, to take a good look at the Thermostat. If that screw backs out the thermostat will not work properly.

    Jeff
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  3. BillyD

    BillyD Formula 3
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    Feb 28, 2004
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    Fifty plus dollar thermostats should never fail!!! Good find.
     
  4. Meister

    Meister F1 Veteran
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    There is a cross reference thermo for a X1/9 that I put in my car (80 308).

    I was able to walk up to the counter at Auto zone and they had one for less than $5.00

    Problem is, I can't find the number...but maybe someone here will or it's somehwere in the 308 cross reference thread.

    BTW, it's been in my car for 5+ years and no issues.
     
  5. No Doubt

    No Doubt Six Time F1 World Champ
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    Are you serious?!

    I had no idea.

    Shouldn't that mean that you can tweak the running temp on Ferraris by adjusting that screw, then?

    Kinda cool.

    Thanks for the info. Good to learn such things.
     
  6. Dr Tommy Cosgrove

    Dr Tommy Cosgrove Three Time F1 World Champ
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    May 4, 2001
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    You sure your old thermostat was a factory/dealer part and not an aftermarket one?
     
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  8. Jbryant

    Jbryant Karting

    Sep 23, 2006
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    Jeff Bryant
    WOW, I am kind of surprised at your response, or were you being childish and sarcastic or even a little condescending? I would have thought that someone such as you would have already known that. But then again, maybe I am wrong about your expertise on Ferrari’s

    I have been using your website as a source of excellent technical information for months now (ignoring the many spelling and grammatical errors) and have been referring other Ferrari enthusiasts to view the information posted there. If you are being that condescending, maybe I should re-think doing that. Not everyone here has the same technical background as you and may even take your reply as a valid method to repair the thermostat.

    Maybe, instead of being condescending, you could offer up an alternative part number for this item, or maybe an explanation as to how this could have happened. You know, something useful.

    I await your reply, as do many, many others.

    Jeff
     
  9. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
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    Feel free to Back Off.

    Thermostats whether they cost $5.00 or $50.00 are known to fail and should be tested (on the stove, in water, with a thermometer) any time they are suspected of failing (I always test new thermostats before they go in).
     
  10. doug328

    doug328 Formula 3

    Mar 11, 2004
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    Will be replacing mine in a couple of weeks when I work on the cooling system. No problems so far but after 20 years I'm sure it could use some perventive maintenance. Plan on replacing the thermostat, thermotemp switch for the fans, expansion tank cap, all rubber hoses and clamps and remove the raidator and have it boiled/cleaned out and pressure tested. Then it will be good for another 20 years.
     
  11. No Doubt

    No Doubt Six Time F1 World Champ
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    Ouch!

    I didn't know that you could adjust the trigger temp on thermostats.

    Did I say something wrong?
     
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  13. luckydynes

    luckydynes F1 Rookie

    Jan 25, 2004
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    Thermostat out of my car had the same screw . . . the piece of metal that holds it actually broke at a P car autocross about 4 years ago . .. got to hear all the critics (especially P car guru's that don't know anything about F cars) explain how 308's always overheat and are no good for the track. Was nice to beat ALL of them a couple weeks ago with not a drop of water out the overflow :).

    New thermostat and my car does not run hot period even with high compression and my very heavy right foot :)

    I also tried the alternate cheap substitute thermostat listed in the cross reference thread . .. did not fit in the cavity anything like an OEM part and the car ran COLD because it was bypassing water all the time. The proper thermostat is not that spendy from the proper suppliers.

    Sean
     
  14. Jbryant

    Jbryant Karting

    Sep 23, 2006
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    Jeff Bryant
    I am sorry and I did not really mean to offend.

    I did not want people to get the impression the this is something that could be adjusted.
    I also thought you were being mean in your response. For that I am truly sorry. I really enjoy your website and the information there is fantastic. That is why I thought you were being offensive. Again, I apologize.


    Jeff
     
  15. No Doubt

    No Doubt Six Time F1 World Champ
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    Mr. Sideways

    So the trigger temp can not be adjusted after all??
     
  16. Jbryant

    Jbryant Karting

    Sep 23, 2006
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    Jeff Bryant
    I would not advise it. I am not sure how you would go about it anyway. Maybe make an adjustment and then place it in a pan of hot water and watch the temp as it opens. Even then, I am not sure that this would be correct. Might make for a great expriment though. If that is all there is too it, might be a great way to save money $$$.

    I first would want to know what caused the weld came loose in the first place. It would seem that this would take major heat, or maybe corrosion at the joint? No telling after many years of service.

    Jeff
     
  17. chrismorse

    chrismorse Formula 3

    Feb 16, 2004
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    I was talking to Daniel at Ricambi a couple of days ago and he mentioned that the oficial, "correct" part was now up to something like $238. He also stated that other parts were available, for a lot less, but that it was important to drill a small weep hole in the disc, if it did not have one. I am guessing that this is what makes it possible to bleed the air out of the engine without the later model bleed screwon the thermostat housing???

    Anyway, I choked a bit and looked at the thermostat i had ordered a couple of years ago for $35 or so and it had a hole in it so i am gong to give it a try.

    At that time, i will have a bung welded onto the thermostat housing so i can use birdman's, (verell's??) spiffy bleed screw.

    hth,
    chris
     
  18. Dr Tommy Cosgrove

    Dr Tommy Cosgrove Three Time F1 World Champ
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    May 4, 2001
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    The thermostat is one of the few things that Ted Rutland will not sell an aftermarket item. He only stocks the Ferrari part and will not sell anything else.
     
  19. smss26

    smss26 Karting

    Nov 19, 2006
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    And all this time i thought it was normal to push 210 when idling. Same situation, the fans kick in and it cools back to 195 again.
     
  20. Mike C

    Mike C F1 Veteran
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    I've had them side-by-side... they may fit identically, but the part from Rutlands is MUCH more robustly built... heavier metal, obviously stronger, and also has a air-relief hole the the Autozone versions do not.
     
  21. 2NA

    2NA F1 World Champ
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    Nothing wrong with using the best quality parts but if the main difference between thermostats is a bleed hole (typically OEM has a "jiggle pin") feel free to drill one and pocket the money you save. I've done it numerous times. I recommend that thermostats always be tested before installation regardless of the price you paid.
     
  22. Jbryant

    Jbryant Karting

    Sep 23, 2006
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    Jeff Bryant
    Well guess what???

    The new thermostat I installed last year FAILED..... The weld on the top of the thermostat is completely gone and allowed the screw to back out. I ordered a new one from T. Rutlands ($250). It has the same weld over the pin as the last one.

    The question is, what is making the weld at the top of the thermostat to fail? It looks like a solder joint on the new thermostat. I can not believe that the water temp gets soooooo hot to melt the solder. All I know is that this is the second time I had an overheat problem and found the thermostat the culprit. You would think that at $250 bucks, the solder should be GOLD Plated. Anyone else have this problem?? Any suggestions?

    Jeff
     
  23. mike996

    mike996 F1 Veteran

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    #20 mike996, Mar 12, 2009
    Last edited: Mar 12, 2009
    Was your coolant replaced at that time? Old or degraded coolant will not retard corrosion as it should and moving, hot water is an excellent corrosive. Water is not called "the universal solvent" for nothing.
     
  24. GeoMetry

    GeoMetry Formula Junior

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  25. AHudson

    AHudson F1 Rookie
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    Perhaps the corrosives in your rad water are treating the solder as an anode rod and prematurely eating it. With that new high dollar thermostat, I'd definitely drain, flush, and refill. I'm sure someone more chemically/mechanically in tune can respond.
     
  26. Jbryant

    Jbryant Karting

    Sep 23, 2006
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    Jeff Bryant
    Last Year I flushed the system and added new Prestone. I am thinking that maybe the chemicals in the Prestone may be the problem. I will know for sure in about a year if this becomes a regular problem. I only added a small amount of antifreeze. Less than one gallon to the system. We will see if this is what is happening

    Jeff
     
  27. mike996

    mike996 F1 Veteran

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    "I only added a small amount of antifreeze. Less than one gallon to the system. "

    Are you saying that you only added one gallon of AF and the rest was water? The system holds nearly 6 gallons of coolant. 1 Gal of AF is not near enough of an additive package. You don't HAVE to use AF if the temps in winter don't get to freezing but you must have the appropriate additive package to protect the engine and associated parts from corrosion. Corrosion inhibiters are a major part of AF or additive packages if you are not using AF. For proper corrosion protection you need approx a 50/50 mix of AF and (ideally) distilled water OR, if you choose not to use af, the recommend amount of the appropriate additive.
     
  28. BwanaJoe

    BwanaJoe Formula 3

    Oct 23, 2006
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    It got my thermostat in September from FerrParts and it was put in with the coolant change.

    109671 Thermostat 53.21
    105192 O-Ring 9.41
    105189 Gasket 4.10

    Works great.
     

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