Fuel Pump / Flooded Sparks

The choke should not be necessary to start the car, warm weather or cold. The cold idle advance should take care of it.

As a matter of fact, lots of Dinos have the choke disconnected by their mechanics, to avoid its use.

My understanding is that if you choke the car, you'll foul the plugs, which could explain why it is so hard to re-start your car.

The more I think about it, the more it sounds like the cold idle avance isnt workinig. My car was very rough running, idle too loo, had to keep a toe in the throttle to keep it running, until we fixed mine. Took me about a year to find a working replacement for mine, and I haven't seen one since. It kicks the idle up about 500 rpm while the motor is cold. Once we found a working one, my cold running problems were over.



DM
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Morry -

My experience with many Dinos is that they start easily, hot or cold, and that choke is not necessary. When cold, feathering the throttle for a moment may help get the revs up above the stall zone.

My only comment vis-a-vis DMs suggestion concerning the cold-timing advance, is that I doubt, other than his, that there is a Dino on Earth with that mechanism still engaged. The thermostatic advance device is left on the cam covers to prevent oil from leaking from the hole it would leave.

Three suggestions. First, make sure that your capacitive discharge system is engaged (if it is a Marelli), or working at all. Second, idle and idle mixture adjustment at the carburettors. Third, make sure static timing (that is, idle RPM timing) is correct.

Other than that, it should start easily and run cold without difficulty.

Jim S.

 

Check the gap on your plugs and make sure they are wide enough.

 

Choke was disconnected from my Dino when I bought it in 1986. Still is 136,000 miles later. At -20 F you might need the choke. Anything warmer, forget it. No need to warm up in place past the point that that oil pressure hits normal. 30-60 seconds is typical. Then drive carefully until temps get up. Half throttle, 4,000 RPM shifts are fine. Sitting at idle fouls plugs. Go to NGK Iridium plugs and they won't foul even then. You have been babying the car. Drive it!

John

P.S. When car is hot, and has sat for 15-30 minutes, gas will boil out of float bowls and car will not start during first 20-40 seconds of cranking. Don't crank! Turn on ignition, fuel pump starts. When pump slows (30 sec or so) then crank and engine will hit on first rev. JC

 

Just give you an excuse to go for a quick spin, say half an hour, each time you start it.

However, since that's probably not practical, I think using the choke to start is what's causing much of this problem, or at least a major symptom. You need to get the car properly adjusted so that it will start without using the choke. Maybe just a good tuneup would do it, or at worst, the carbs may need overhauling and/or re-jetting.

Jim is right, you probably will have to feather the throttle a little when it's first started, but a properly tuned car should fire right up and be driveable within about 30 seconds.

Maybe a review of what the "proper starting technique" used by some of the guys here would provide some guidance too.

I use these:

Cold start. 1.Turn key, let fuel pump run approx 15 seconds until you hear a change in the tone of the pump. 2.Then, no foot on gas, at all, just turn the key and mine fires right up. 3. Before we fixed the idle advance, I had to keep slight pressure on the gas for a minute or two until the car would idle smoothly on its own, now the car does it on its own.

Hot Start. Repeat 1 above. 2. pump pedal a couple of times while cranking, let off gas, engine fires in about 10 seconds.

Interestingly, the new ethanol mix seems to have made hot starting MUCH WORSE for me.

DM

 

I've been told it's not a great idea to start my dino for just a few minutes and then turn it off because it does not leave adequate time to burn of the condensation in the exhaust and can lead to premature rusting (of the exhaust). When I move my car in my garage, I usually push it if I'm not going to go out for a spin. Thoughts?

 

I thought the time-honored procedure for Weber-carbureted engines was (i) never use the choke, (2) turn on the ignition and wait for the float chanbers to fill (pump ticking slows down or changes tone), (3) pump gas pedal 3 times, and (4) start (hopefully). Read that in Road & Track I think 20 years ago and have followed it for my Weber-carb Lotuses and also the Stratos.

The Dino, which is new to me, a 1972 US model, seems to respond to the same procedure, but seems to like a partially open throttle when cranking.

I think, when the engine is hot, that one is supposed to hold the gas pedal down, but not pump.

I also subscribe to the view that running the engine for a short period is not good for it, for the reason 4RedNo mentioned. Also, cold-start wear accounts for a great deal of total engine wear, so I suppose it makes sense to reduce starts. I push the car around too, and don't start it unless I plan to drive it.

 

I agree, No choke. When cold: pump two or three times. Don't pump more than that 'cause you will flood it. When warm: just a slight touch on the throttle. When hot: pedal to the floor till it starts. When cold you will need to go easy on the 1-2 shift or just start in second untill it warms up. I believe it is about 2mins in summer and 5 mins in winter. Or the first couple of miles.

 

Jeez, I can't think of a 246 that I have driven with the choke still connected.

Mark

 

Morry.

I don't think it needs to run for 5 minutes. I move mine around all the time to wash it, clean the garage, whatever. I often run it for less than a minute without any trouble at all. I also had no trouble (as long as I kept a tope on the gas) doing this before I fixed the idle advance.

I think it's a couple of tuning adjustments that need to be made, timing perhaps, carbs too. Dig around in here for what folks are using in their carbs for jets and see if that helps.

DM

 

Hi,

Not warming the car up (bringing up to full temperature) has many disadvantages. First, in the the short term, you will foul your plugs. Second upon shutdown, raw fuel that has not been burned will wash down by the rings, down the cylinder walls, washing away the oil. This contributes to scuffing of the clyinder walls during the next startup - in the long term this is damaging. Also as mentioned, condensation in both the exhaust (rust out your exhaust) and in the oil (forming sludge) is not a good thing as well.

Take it out and exercise it! : )

Anthony

 

DM has it right. There should be no problem, nor damage, in starting a car designed in 1972 for a few minutes and turning it off. It should start as easily the next day. Yes, over time rust in the muffler will occur (with or without careful heating and evaporation of condensation). Yes, cold starts may lead to proportionally more wear. But, guys, get a life. Pushing your car around in the garage for fear of starting it ??!!

CollectorCarStudio - YOUR CAR NEEDS A TUNE UP.

Jim S.

 

LOL, I do SO many short trips on my Lotus some of you guys would shoot me, but I change the oil every 3 months regardless of miles, and I do some hard running at least once a week if not more often. I push the car only to clean the oil spot by the output shafts.

Ken

 

I guess I'll be the outlier and admit that I reconnected the choke on my L-series soon after I acquired the car in fall of '01, at the time of a major engine rebuild. Had not seen enough Dinos at the time to know otherwise, figuring, why would the factory install a choke if it wasn't designed to be used? I use it all the time (all seasons) at initial (cold) starup, after waiting for the fuel pump revs to decrease per other posts, then allow the car to warm for 3-5mins, gradually decreasing the amount of choke during that time, before drivng off, then the usual gingerly shifting from 1st to 2nd until fully warm. I have yet to foul plugs (though confess I have not removed/looked at the plugs) or notice any other probs w/ this method. BTW I ascribe to the "don't start it to just back out of the garage, etc" school, and push it around occasionally.

 

I reattached the choke cable on "L" when I restored it but I have never used it. Morry, Sergio Belli in Toronto is an amazing Ferrari mechanic and you should take your car to him. He tuned up my carbs 5 years ago and it runs flawlessly and never needs the choke engaged to start. A couple of pumps and one or two cranks and she'll fire up like a champ once Sergio gets it tuned up. PM me if you need his number.

Cheers,

Keith